MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[bulldogalum]

I agree with what Bogeyman says in regards to recruiting issues in the MIAA.  It's no secret that Hope and Calvin have a huge advantage.  I have the utmost respect for Mike Turner and what he's done at Albion.  For the past few years, I thought Adrian had done a pretty good job of establishing itself as the 4th best team in the conference, and there's nothing to be ashamed of if you're 4th in the MIAA.  Unfortunately, things haven't gone all that well this season.  However, I'm confident that the Bulldogs can turn things around next year.  I think the coaching staff has a good idea of the problems that face it, and they are taking steps to improve in those areas next season.

[sac]

I'm pretty sure I can count on one hand the number of out of state kids who've played varsity ball for the Dutchmen that I've seen.

Stinger, your right my post can be misread or interpreted differently.  No hard feelings.  Points taken.

But I do think Kzoo was outmanned against Hope.  I thought Kzoo actually played a tremendous game, but Hope's depth both in numbers and size wore down the Hornets.  The improvement in quality of play from the first time I saw the Hornets to last night was easy to see.

Big kudos to the K students who 1) stood the whole game 2) cheered even when their team trailed big 3) didn't leave early as so many other student sections have 4) came out in the largest numbers I've seen in a very very long time

As for the transfers I think the whole transfer issue is getting blown out of proprtion.  Every one of those guys was recruited by Hope that I'm aware of and everyone of them is a D3 player.  There's a reason they left D2 and D1 schools.

[ziggy]

Its all about PT

[sac]

exactly my point ziggy.

You can go and be on a D1 or D2 team or you can go play for a D3 school.


Here's the +/- update with remaining road games

Hope +4         @ Calvin, @ Adrian
Calvin +3        @ Alma @ Adrian @ Olivet
Albion +2        @ TSU,  @ Hope, @ Kzoo @ Calvin
Tri-State +0    @ Kzo, @ Adrian @ Hope
Kalamazoo -2 @ Adrian,  @ Alma @ Olivet @ Calvin
Olivet -2          @ Hope, @ TSU, @ Albion
Alma -3           @ Albion, @ TSU, @ Hope
Adrian -3        @ Olivet @ Alma

Keep your eye on the #4 spot in the standings this week.  Crucial week for Kzoo if they want that spot with 2 must win and winnable road games at Alma and Adrian followed by a trip to current #4 TSU.  Meanwhile TSU has to play Albion this Wed.  Golden opportunity for the Hornets to slide into the #4 spot.

Boy I didn't realize what a huge loss that was for Albion to Calvin.  Look at their reamining road trips @ TSU, @ Hope, @ Calvin and @ Kzoo.

Calvin still seems in the driver's seat to me because their 3 road games all look like W's, it all comes down to whether they can beat Hope and Albion at home.

[bulldogalum]

Amazing to think that Calvin is in the driver's seat.  Nothing against the Knights, but there are 2 top ten teams in the conference.  Have to agree with you though, Sac, the remaining schedule seems to favor the Knights.

[sac]

One last thing before I go take a nap

Why isn't anyone talking about the slump Brandon Crawford is in..........he's gone two full games without a double-double.

Out of curiosity I looked up something and this really impressed me about Crawford.  He's currnetly on pace to break the single season FG shooting % record.........in MIAA play Crawford is 69-90 for .767

Here's the top 3 all-time

BEST FIELD GOAL SHOOTING PERCENTAGE
.705    Steve Honderd, Calvin, 1991-92 (91-129)
.684    Wade Gugino, Hope, 1991-92 (91-133)
.684    Steve Honderd, Calvin, 1989-90 (81-117)

Couple of impressive names, both were d3 all-americans and both played against each other many times.  These guys come from the pinnacle of the Hope/Calvin rivalry in my opinion.  Mr. Crawford is putting himself in some unique company.

What makes Honderd's numbers so impressive is that he didn't just camp out under the hoop like Gugino did and Crawford does.

[KnightSlappy]

Of the 7 games in the second half of the MIAA season, Calvin has the bottom 3 on the road and the top 4 at home (counting the Tri-State game they just played).  They are a MUCH better team now than when they got slashed by the Dutch.  Hope and Albion AT HOME. anything can happen.

[MIdoubleA]

Here's some food for thought for all the recruiting talk.

I took a look at all the rosters and added up the amount of non-michiganders on each team (both JV and Varsity). I did not include Tri-State for obvious reasons.

Adrian: 7
Albion: 1
Alma: 2
Calvin: 8
Hope: 4
Kalamazoo: 0 - do they have a JV team? I could not find a roster...
Olivet: 3

Anyway, I know it's a rough estimate and what not, but suprisingly Hope does not seem to get as many out of staters as you might think. Adrian really suprised me with 7, but most are midwest. If you want to talk about recruiting power, look at Calvin and the states they come from. New Mexico, California, South Dakota... those are quite a ways away. The majority of everyone else's out of state recruits are from the midwest with a few exceptions.

Also, for you Albion officianados, why is the JV roster so small? I was suprised to see how few people were listed.

[bulldogalum]

As close as it is to the Ohio Border, Adrian has the easiest job of all the MIAA schools in recruiting Ohio talent.  Plus, Coach Riley is originally from the Cleveland area, and he has established a pretty solid recruiting pipeline in that part of Ohio.

[ziggy]

Here's some food for thought for all the recruiting talk.

I took a look at all the rosters and added up the amount of non-michiganders on each team (both JV and Varsity). I did not include Tri-State for obvious reasons.

Adrian: 7
Albion: 1
Alma: 2
Calvin: 8
Hope: 4
Kalamazoo: 0 - do they have a JV team? I could not find a roster...
Olivet: 3

Calvin JV is scheduled to play Kzoo JV on February 18.  They did not play this past Varsity meeting so I dont know what they are up to.

[realist]

Wow! A for real, honest discussion.  The point many of you are missing is the fact that the entire student body at Calvin (and to a lesser degree those at Hope) come from across the entire country.  Granted each school in the MIAA may have a variety of students from a variety of regions, but Calvin/Hope draw from across a large geographic area.  Notice where the students that go to Calvin went to H.S. (notice all the various Christian H. schools), the real frustration for many loyal Calvin followers is the disturbing tendency for many ( "Christian" H.S. grads) to choose to attend the Hope, and this tendency almost exclusive to the W. Michigan area. Does the name Bosma ring any bells?   A number of states do not allow "non-public" schools to compete in their  H.S. leagues with public schools for the most part to their own loss.  It simply comes down to the fact if "Mom & Dad pay good $$$$ for their son or daughter to attend a "non-public" school they tend to be much more involved in the entire education experience.  Look at the CCIW, and note where their athletes went to H.S., and the same is true from Ohio etc. etc. etc.  If over the years the kids that went to Hope from the various W. Mich. Christian H.S's  had all gone to Calvin it would be Calvin, and the rest of the MIAA,  not Calvin/Hope, and ocassionally Albion.

[KnightSlappy]

Calvin has a large number of Alumni and therefore 'Calvin Families' in regions across the country such as Chicago (this is the reason there were more Calvin fans at the tournament game in Aurora than actual Aurora fans), Denver, So. Cal, and New Mexico.  This may be what realist was trying to say.  Hope draws better from the West Michigan area but Calvin seems to get guys to come cross country to play ball.

[sac]

Lets not forget Albion is a much smaller school than Hope or Calvin.   I imagine its more difficult to draw nationally to a much smaller school.

What I think Albion has done very well over the past decade is get kids from the Grand Rapids area and lately they're getting every good D3 player out of the Lansing area.   Lets not forget the fantastic find they got from Saginaw in Michael Thomas.  Heck they've gotten a couple kids from right under Hope's nose recently.  Travis DePree from Holland........and DJ Mocini from Saugutuck, although I have no idea if he or Hope were ever interested in each other.

I took a look at all the rosters and added up the amount of non-michiganders on each team (both JV and Varsity). I did not include Tri-State for obvious reasons.

Adrian: 7
Albion: 1
Alma: 2
Calvin: 8
Hope: 4
Kalamazoo: 0 - do they have a JV team? I could not find a roster...
Olivet: 3

Ok you made me pull out my old MIAA Tournament programs

I'll only go back 5 years including this year, varsity only since believe it or not there are kids who only want to play JV for one year then concentrate on school or simply get cut.

Adrian
Matt Luthardt--Ohio
Mike Rheinard--Ohio
Brian Schaefer--Ohio
Nate Stolzfus--Ohio
Earl Engram--Ohio
Mike Rogers--Ohio
Ian Weber--Ohio
Joe Alberts--Ohio
Mike Rairigh--Ohio
Phil Tennent--South Dakota
Steve Brooks--Ohio
Dan Walter--Ohio
Andy Keimer--Ohio
Tom Cieker--Ohio


Albion
Mark Smith--Ohio

Alma
Rod McGhee--Alabama
Bener Sen--Turkey
Jami Fazi--Indiana
Ian McAlpine--Ontario
Aaron Kanitz-Ohio

Calvin
Caleb Veldhouse--South Dakota
Tim Katt--Wisconsin
Josh Vriesman--Colorado
Kevin Prins--California
Andy Draayer--Colorado
Brian Roelofs--Pennsylvania
Chris Prins--California
Mike Natelborg--Indiana
Brian Rooney--Colorado
Nick Ploegstra--Ohio
Rob Holleman--Minnesota

Hope
Ryan Klein--Illinois
Cody Fleming--Iowa
Nate VanHofwegan--Iowa

Kalamazoo
D'Angelo Bailey--Illinois
Jeff Oney--South Carolina
Dirk Rhinehart--Indiana
Eric Rhinehart--Indiana
Mario Anton--Japan

Olivet
Adam Alberson--Wisconsin
Grag Ravy--Louisiana

Tri-State--05 and 06
Derek Graham--Michigan
John Moore--Michigan
Adam Harkiewicz--Michigan
Andre Patrick--Illinois
David Hutter--Ohio
Jeigh Krupp--Michigan
Eric Koncz--Ohio

Those 3 players from out of state for Hope are THE only 3 players in the MIAA tournament era, and VanHofwegan barely played.  Klein doesn't play much now but he will next year and beyond. 

Hope's rosters typically have a few but are rarely if ever dominated by Christian school kids as most assume.  The last five years Hope's had 2-4-2-3-4 kids from Christian schools

Hey if Tri-State gets a kid from Illinois does that make them Quad-State? 

As you see Albion has had 1 player from out-of-state in the last 5 seasons so maybe Coach Turner just doens't like to drive much.

[northb]

It is my understanding that all of the MIAA schools started out with some church affiliation.  Is this accurate?  Do other schools retain this affiliation?  Hope (Reformed Church in America) and Calvin (Christian Reformed Church in North America) basketball teams certainly enjoy the benefits of this system to "feed" the teams.  Are there any other RCA-affiliated schools?  Although other schools have deep connections to the CRC, Calvin is certainly the predominant school for students with a CRC connection.

[sac]

Your almost correct Northb

Adrian--United Methodist--founded by Weleyan Methodist
Alma--Presbyterian
Calvin--Christian Reformed
Hope--Reformed Church
Olivet--I forget, Congregational maybe?

Albion lists no current afiliation but I thought it was founded by Methodists, there's a huge Methodist Church right next to the campus.

Kalamazoo has none that I'm aware of and I'm sure Tri-State has no affiliation either.