MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[calvin_grad]

the end of regulation in the Michigan/Wisconsin game is, as far as I'm concerned, evidence that you guard the passer on an inbounds play.

Don't even get me started.  I still can't believe Beilein didn't pull McLimans off the bench and have his 7' frame and at least that long of a wingspan standing in front of the passer.   

You CANNOT let the shooter catch a perfect, in-stride, half-court long chest pass.

[sac]

Just finished watching the entire Hope/Calvin game on World Harvest TV - DVR'd it and got to skip through the timeouts, commercials, etc.  Quite a luxury for a D3 game!

I think I was about as neutral of an observer as you'll find in this one - I had zero rooting interest, just wanted to 1) enjoy the rivalry atmosphere, and 2) get a little better feel for Calvin.  There has been some discussion about Calvin's placement in the Great Lakes regional rankings so was looking to see for myself what kind of team the Knights are.  I didn't think the officials were biased either way in this one.  Like any game, there were some bad calls, and other bang-bang type calls that could have gone either way, but it seemed balanced to me.

I enjoyed watching the game.  Great atmosphere.

I would agree on good close game, great atmosphere and the reffing being unbiased except for those under the basket calls I previously alluded too.  It's one thing to call a loose ball foul under the basket when guys are fighting for a loose rebound but making that call against the defensive team multiple times AFTER the ball has gone through the hoop and on what was clearly borderline contact and boxing out seems to be a pretty big anomaly compared to most games.  I just think they got suckered, multiple times, into what should have non-calls.  It's one thing if it was a clear loose ball and a Hope player was clearly prevented from getting an offensive rebound, those calls they should make.  But in those multiple calls there was some acting going on and the ball was NEVER even in play for a rebound on top of that.

All in all a good rivalry game (though wish the result would've gone the other way), and nice to be able to see the game up here in Northern MI from the comfort of my own family room.  Also pretty strange to see that Hope is gonna have an all lefty shooting back-court for the next few years, don't see that often.

I'm going to watch this again tomorrow and I'll pay attention to these because it was quite curious to see I think 4 of these called in one game.

The one that really caught my attention was on a Hope ft late in the first half, on the first free throw Mickey DeVries got his arms up and into Chase DeMaagd's face as the ball went through the net.  The official came right over to him and probably said something like 'don't do that'.  Mickey nodded his head.  On the second ft he does the same thing and the ref called it.  That really isn't the refs fault.

Having watched it again I think you bought the drivel spewing from Tom Clearly's mouth about Hope players diving.  Talk about leading the witness.   


Second observations:

--It was a lot tougher to score than even I realized watching the game live, that 10 minutes first half stretch where Calvin held Hope to 6 points was the big minutes of the game.   Those were the same 10 minutes Hope was blown out of VanNoord yet yesterday they kept themselves in it because they were better on defense and rebounded really well this time.

--shot selection was really bad for both teams a few times, perhaps again the two defenses making life more difficult for each other.

--Grant Neil's hustle play to knock the ball off the Calvin defender in the final seconds was pretty awesome live and even better on replay.

[Titan Q]

Were the broadcasters on the World Harvest TV coverage connected to Calvin?  I thought they were very good, but definitely seemed slanted towards Calvin.  In tense, pressure, big play moments both guys sounded like Calvin fans to me.

Thanks for the scoop anyone can provide on this.

[sac]

Olivet played its last home game yesterday finishing 6-1 at Cutler in league play, 8-1 overall.

They're 0-5 in the league on the road, all of those losses by double digits, in need of at least one win to grab a tournament spot

Wed  @Hope
Sat    @Calvin

[sac]

standings with +/-........+1 for road wins/-1 for home losses

Calvin          11-1        +6      Clinched tournament spot and home court
Hope           10-2        +4      Clinched tournament spot and home court
Trine           7-5          +1
Olivet          6-6          -1
Adrian         6-6           0
Alma           3-9          -4       eliminated
Kzoo           3-9         -2        eliminated
Albion         2-10        -4       eliminated

Home teams now 34-14    (11 of these road wins belong to Hope and Calvin)

Wednesday, February 13
Olivet at Hope, 7:30 p.m.
Alma at Albion, 7:30 p.m.
Trine at Calvin, 8 p.m.
Adrian at Kalamazoo, 8 p.m.


What's left

Calvin:    TRINE, OLIVET
Hope:     OLIVET, @Trine

Trine:     @Calvin, HOPE
Adrian:    @Kzoo, ALBION
Olivet:    @Hope, @Calvin

Alma:     @Albion, @Kzoo
Kzoo:     ADRIAN, ALMA
Albion:   ALMA, @Adrian


Calvin--a win or Hope loss clinches the MIAA Championship
Hope--a win and Calvin loss ties for the lead with 1 to play

Interesting to see all 3 teams in the mix for the 3/4 spots all on the road Wed. 

There are quite a few tie-breaker scenarios here, more than worth my time to figure out.

Olivet still holds the 'we beat hope' trump card over both Adrian/Trine, after that a few of the tie-breaks are dependent on the next weeks results.  Basically if you are Trine/Olivet or Adrian you need to win.

If things go as expected this week with Calvin, Hope and Adrian winning out the tournament would look like this.  Any results that aren't Calvin, Hope or Adrian winning changes things.

Trine at Calvin
Adrian at Hope

[Knightmare]

Just finished watching the entire Hope/Calvin game on World Harvest TV - DVR'd it and got to skip through the timeouts, commercials, etc.  Quite a luxury for a D3 game!

I think I was about as neutral of an observer as you'll find in this one - I had zero rooting interest, just wanted to 1) enjoy the rivalry atmosphere, and 2) get a little better feel for Calvin.  There has been some discussion about Calvin's placement in the Great Lakes regional rankings so was looking to see for myself what kind of team the Knights are.  I didn't think the officials were biased either way in this one.  Like any game, there were some bad calls, and other bang-bang type calls that could have gone either way, but it seemed balanced to me.

I enjoyed watching the game.  Great atmosphere.

I would agree on good close game, great atmosphere and the reffing being unbiased except for those under the basket calls I previously alluded too.  It's one thing to call a loose ball foul under the basket when guys are fighting for a loose rebound but making that call against the defensive team multiple times AFTER the ball has gone through the hoop and on what was clearly borderline contact and boxing out seems to be a pretty big anomaly compared to most games.  I just think they got suckered, multiple times, into what should have non-calls.  It's one thing if it was a clear loose ball and a Hope player was clearly prevented from getting an offensive rebound, those calls they should make.  But in those multiple calls there was some acting going on and the ball was NEVER even in play for a rebound on top of that.

All in all a good rivalry game (though wish the result would've gone the other way), and nice to be able to see the game up here in Northern MI from the comfort of my own family room.  Also pretty strange to see that Hope is gonna have an all lefty shooting back-court for the next few years, don't see that often.

I'm going to watch this again tomorrow and I'll pay attention to these because it was quite curious to see I think 4 of these called in one game.

The one that really caught my attention was on a Hope ft late in the first half, on the first free throw Mickey DeVries got his arms up and into Chase DeMaagd's face as the ball went through the net.  The official came right over to him and probably said something like 'don't do that'.  Mickey nodded his head.  On the second ft he does the same thing and the ref called it.  That really isn't the refs fault.

Having watched it again I think you bought the drivel spewing from Tom Clearly's mouth about Hope players diving.  Talk about leading the witness.   


Second observations:

--It was a lot tougher to score than even I realized watching the game live, that 10 minutes first half stretch where Calvin held Hope to 6 points was the big minutes of the game.   Those were the same 10 minutes Hope was blown out of VanNoord yet yesterday they kept themselves in it because they were better on defense and rebounded really well this time.

--shot selection was really bad for both teams a few times, perhaps again the two defenses making life more difficult for each other.

--Grant Neil's hustle play to knock the ball off the Calvin defender in the final seconds was pretty awesome live and even better on replay.

The announcer may not have been perfectly unbiased but I still challenge anyone to come up with the last game at any level that had 4 of those calls AFTER a basket was made.  I still say that they were pretty nit-picky calls made by the refs that Hope helped, give them credit for this, to draw the whistle on.

Don't confuse my focusing on that area as the reason for the Calvin loss and Hope win.  I think there were many other things that each team did or didn't do that contributed to the end result.  But you can't deny that taken together, both the type of call and the number of times they called it was quite curious and strange.

[sac]

The announcer may not have been perfectly unbiased but I still challenge anyone to come up with the last game at any level that had 4 of those calls AFTER a basket was made.  I still say that they were pretty nit-picky calls made by the refs that Hope helped, give them credit for this, to draw the whistle on.

Don't confuse my focusing on that area as the reason for the Calvin loss and Hope win.  I think there were many other things that each team did or didn't do that contributed to the end result.  But you can't deny that taken together, both the type of call and the number of times they called it was quite curious and strange.

After reviewing it, they all looked like clear fouls to me and correct.  In fact I didn't see one bad call in the game.

[hope1]

i   think they neeed  tp  change the people  doing the game on tv   

[pointlem]

Random reflections on Hope v. Calvin

• After a could-have-ended-either-way game, winning fans are left to explain victory and losing fans defeat.  Had the universe been infinitesimally different--say if Snuggerud's answered-prayer shot had missed and Calvin had won--the Hope fans would be lamenting their team's 11 first-half turnovers and Calvin fans would be celebrating their team's good defense or the five 3-point shots by Brink and Powell
• Long-time Hope fans may regard the Snuggerud shot as payback for Aaron Winkle's 40-foot, off the backboard 3-pointer some years ago at a game's end
• NVA's points, rebounds, and 35 minutes were impressive, but even more so his six assists to one turnover.  Passing the ball in to him and letting him distribute worked beautifully.
• What a great game--college sports and fan support at their best.  I hated to see Hope lose to IWU in double overtime last year, but afterwards nevertheless savored it as a "great game."  (To sample the atmosphere--everyone on their feet and joining the Interlude dance with 3 minutes to go--see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEuAYQ3q7kw.)  Yesterday, with 3 minutes to go I turned to friends beside me and said, "win or lose, this has been a great game."  Kudos to the student athletes.
• Next Saturday, promises to be another great Hope v. Calvin game (on the women's side) . . . and then, likely, two more the following Saturday.  If it's not March Madness it's February Ferment.
• If only the NCAA could find a way to put the Hope and Calvin women in opposite brackets with the possibility of their meeting in a national championship game.  How cool would that be?
• Massey just about nailed it.

FYI Massey projects the game nearly as close as they possibly could.  The median simulation is Calvin 70.34 points to Hope's 70.25 points.   

[Roundball999]

Random reflections on Hope v. Calvin

• After a could-have-ended-either-way game, winning fans are left to explain victory and losing fans defeat.  Had the universe been infinitesimally different--say if Snuggerud's answered-prayer shot had missed and Calvin had won--the Hope fans would be lamenting their team's 11 first-half turnovers and Calvin fans would be celebrating their team's good defense or the five 3-point shots by Brink and Powell
• Long-time Hope fans may regard the Snuggerud shot as payback for Aaron Winkle's 40-foot, off the backboard 3-pointer some years ago at a game's end
• NVA's points, rebounds, and 35 minutes were impressive, but even more so his six assists to one turnover.  Passing the ball in to him and letting him distribute worked beautifully.
• What a great game--college sports and fan support at their best.  I hated to see Hope lose to IWU in double overtime last year, but afterwards nevertheless savored it as a "great game."  (To sample the atmosphere--everyone on their feet and joining the Interlude dance with 3 minutes to go--see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEuAYQ3q7kw.)  Yesterday, with 3 minutes to go I turned to friends beside me and said, "win or lose, this has been a great game."  Kudos to the student athletes.
• Next Saturday, promises to be another great Hope v. Calvin game (on the women's side) . . . and then, likely, two more the following Saturday.  If it's not March Madness it's February Ferment.
• If only the NCAA could find a way to put the Hope and Calvin women in opposite brackets with the possibility of their meeting in a national championship game.  How cool would that be?
• Massey just about nailed it.

FYI Massey projects the game nearly as close as they possibly could.  The median simulation is Calvin 70.34 points to Hope's 70.25 points.   

Great points all, I heartily agree!

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Were the broadcasters on the World Harvest TV coverage connected to Calvin?  I thought they were very good, but definitely seemed slanted towards Calvin.  In tense, pressure, big play moments both guys sounded like Calvin fans to me.

Thanks for the scoop anyone can provide on this.

The announcers for the game are both sportscasters from the local GR media. Hope fans have long been pointing out the slant toward Calvin, so it is interesting to hear the perspective of an "outsider". It was also interesting to see one of those broadcasters sit directly behind the Calvin bench for the entire JV game chatting with some Calvin faithful he has obvious connections to.  That being said, there aren't many people in W Michigan who aren't on one side or the other.

[Titan Q]

Were the broadcasters on the World Harvest TV coverage connected to Calvin?  I thought they were very good, but definitely seemed slanted towards Calvin.  In tense, pressure, big play moments both guys sounded like Calvin fans to me.

Thanks for the scoop anyone can provide on this.

The announcers for the game are both sportscasters from the local GR media. Hope fans have long been pointing out the slant toward Calvin, so it is interesting to hear the perspective of an "outsider". It was also interesting to see one of those broadcasters sit directly behind the Calvin bench for the entire JV game chatting with some Calvin faithful he has obvious connections to.  That being said, there aren't many people in W Michigan who aren't on one side or the other.

Thanks, I assumed so.  Again, they were good broadcasters and very knowledgeable about both teams, but there was definitely a slant towards Calvin. 

One play in particular I remember was late in the game when a ball went off Mickey DeVries and out-of-bounds.  The play-by-play guy said multiple times something like, "DeVries says he was fouled." They showed one replay and he said it again...but there was no sign of a foul on the replay.  Then they showed another and I think he finally conceded there wasn't a foul. 

There were a lot of examples throughout the game.  Thanks for the info...I was just curious.

[HopeConvert]

Were the broadcasters on the World Harvest TV coverage connected to Calvin?  I thought they were very good, but definitely seemed slanted towards Calvin.  In tense, pressure, big play moments both guys sounded like Calvin fans to me.

Thanks for the scoop anyone can provide on this.

The announcers for the game are both sportscasters from the local GR media. Hope fans have long been pointing out the slant toward Calvin, so it is interesting to hear the perspective of an "outsider". It was also interesting to see one of those broadcasters sit directly behind the Calvin bench for the entire JV game chatting with some Calvin faithful he has obvious connections to.  That being said, there aren't many people in W Michigan who aren't on one side or the other.

Thanks, I assumed so.  Again, they were good broadcasters and very knowledgeable about both teams, but there was definitely a slant towards Calvin. 

One play in particular I remember was late in the game when a ball went off Mickey DeVries and out-of-bounds.  The play-by-play guy said multiple times something like, "DeVries says he was fouled." They showed one replay and he said it again...but there was no sign of a foul on the replay.  Then they showed another and I think he finally conceded there wasn't a foul. 

There were a lot of examples throughout the game.  Thanks for the info...I was just curious.

Ryan Terpstra, the color commentator, went to Calvin. I'm not sure about Cleary.

[HopeConvert]

Random reflections on Hope v. Calvin

• After a could-have-ended-either-way game, winning fans are left to explain victory and losing fans defeat.  Had the universe been infinitesimally different--say if Snuggerud's answered-prayer shot had missed and Calvin had won--the Hope fans would be lamenting their team's 11 first-half turnovers and Calvin fans would be celebrating their team's good defense or the five 3-point shots by Brink and Powell
• Long-time Hope fans may regard the Snuggerud shot as payback for Aaron Winkle's 40-foot, off the backboard 3-pointer some years ago at a game's end
• NVA's points, rebounds, and 35 minutes were impressive, but even more so his six assists to one turnover.  Passing the ball in to him and letting him distribute worked beautifully.
• What a great game--college sports and fan support at their best.  I hated to see Hope lose to IWU in double overtime last year, but afterwards nevertheless savored it as a "great game."  (To sample the atmosphere--everyone on their feet and joining the Interlude dance with 3 minutes to go--see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEuAYQ3q7kw.)  Yesterday, with 3 minutes to go I turned to friends beside me and said, "win or lose, this has been a great game."  Kudos to the student athletes.
• Next Saturday, promises to be another great Hope v. Calvin game (on the women's side) . . . and then, likely, two more the following Saturday.  If it's not March Madness it's February Ferment.
• If only the NCAA could find a way to put the Hope and Calvin women in opposite brackets with the possibility of their meeting in a national championship game.  How cool would that be?
• Massey just about nailed it.

FYI Massey projects the game nearly as close as they possibly could.  The median simulation is Calvin 70.34 points to Hope's 70.25 points.   

Good points all. It's especially interesting what an interpretive difference would be made by a basket on either side.

[sac]

Good points all. It's especially interesting what an interpretive difference would be made by a basket on either side.

I'd rather not think about that, thanks.

Ryan Terpstra, the color commentator, went to Calvin. I'm not sure about Cleary.

Ryan Terpstra's comments after Van Arendonk's shot really rubbed me the wrong way.  Those of us that have watched Nate frequently know full well he's capable of hitting that shot and has done so on numerous occasions these last two years.