MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[northb]

I think the disgruntlement with Cleary comes from the fact that he is a completely negative announcer.  Both teams' fans view him as pro-'other' because he is constantly criticizing every player on the court.  I'd rather have a biased announcer who would acknowledge great plays from at least one team than one who criticizes 20-year olds for 40 minutes plus.

Another classic rivalry game, and the posts on here are showing why it is such.  Both teams have a lot of positives to take from the game and a lot of things they can improve upon.  Calvin has to be the favorite from here on out simply becaues they won at Hope and it appears the rest of the league is not as good as advertised. 

Hats off to all the participants.  A few shots here or there and Hope wins the game.  A few shots here or there and Calvin wins going away.  That's why it's such a great game.   Every player on the court gave it their all.  Now, I'm just counting down the days until the rematch.  HOPEfully we can open up the Noord in style with a Hope win. 

Is it just me, or is everyone else glad these teams won't play 5 times this year as they did a few years ago?

I said before the year and I'll say it again.  I won't be surprised if Calvin wins the regular season title, while Hope beats Calvin in the MIAA tourney finals to get the automatic bid.

If Calvin makes the tourney, I really hope that Hope is not in it because Hope has ended Calvin's season the last 3 years, including twice in the NCAA tournament in the second round.

Yes, but they are not supposed to win     

[sac]

I've used efficiency ratings to rate players and teams for many years now.  I can often tell within the first 4-6 games who's a legit contender for the MIAA Championship, who's not and who the guys to watch for MVP are.

So when I make a statement like such and such a team is not a contender, its not my Hope arrogance or any other kind of arrogance or superiority its me looking at numbers and interpreting them.

For the MVP race I really only see 3 now, here's why

For all games here's the eff ratings of the 5 guys I thought were in the MVP chase, based on actual minutes of play.

Jesse Reimink 19.65
Brandon McClary 17.89
John Mantel 14.77
Desmond Young 13.54
Caleb Veldhouse 6.56

Per 40 minutes its all Reimink and Mantel

Mantel 25.30
Reimink 24.58
B. McClary 19.8
Young 14.9
Veldhouse 9.5

For just MIAA games, actual minutes played

B. McClary 22.67
Reimink 20.42
Mantel 15.38
Young 11.79
Veldhouse 5.46


MIAA games per 40 minutes played
Mantel  32.37
B. McClary 25.76
Reimink 25.36
Young 13.56
Veldhouse 7.53

I'll only add that its always a little tougher for guards to score high using this method because of their lack of rebounds.  But I've always liked doing these kinds of ratings just for my own amusement.  But looking at these it appears Reimink, B. McClary and Mantel are the frontrunners.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Before last week, the MIAA shaped into levels of competition like this

Calvin
Hope
-------------------------
Albion
Olivet
Kalamazoo
Adrian
----------------------
Trine
----------------------
Alma

I haven't updated it this week, but this seemed to mirror reality pretty well.  I would guess a new level will include Adrian/Trine/Alma with this weeks numbers.

[sac]

I think the disgruntlement with Cleary comes from the fact that he is a completely negative announcer.  Both teams' fans view him as pro-'other' because he is constantly criticizing every player on the court.  I'd rather have a biased announcer who would acknowledge great plays from at least one team than one who criticizes 20-year olds for 40 minutes plus.

Another classic rivalry game, and the posts on here are showing why it is such.  Both teams have a lot of positives to take from the game and a lot of things they can improve upon.  Calvin has to be the favorite from here on out simply becaues they won at Hope and it appears the rest of the league is not as good as advertised. 

Hats off to all the participants.  A few shots here or there and Hope wins the game.  A few shots here or there and Calvin wins going away.  That's why it's such a great game.   Every player on the court gave it their all.  Now, I'm just counting down the days until the rematch.  HOPEfully we can open up the Noord in style with a Hope win. 

Is it just me, or is everyone else glad these teams won't play 5 times this year as they did a few years ago?

I said before the year and I'll say it again.  I won't be surprised if Calvin wins the regular season title, while Hope beats Calvin in the MIAA tourney finals to get the automatic bid.

If Calvin makes the tourney, I really hope that Hope is not in it because Hope has ended Calvin's season the last 3 years, including twice in the NCAA tournament in the second round.

Yes, but they are not supposed to win     

Just because you beat a smart remark to death, doesn't make it more funny.

I've looked back and only one post used the term 'supposed to win', I was told the smart remarks weren't directed at me, but they pretty much were.

Try reading in the abstract instead of literal sometime and you might get the point better, but then I guess you'd have less material.

peace.

[HopeConvert]

Calvin looked good to me - very balanced.  Calvin has a really nice inside presence with Mantel and (can't remember the other name), and Veldhouse is terrific on the perimeter. Where Hope is missing a good 5, it seems like Calvin is missing a good 3 - a guy who could make 3's and also break the defense down.  But Calvin seems like a very dangerous team...one that could do damage in the tournament.  

Again, it was my first look at both, but I left the TV broadcast feeling like Calvin is the better team due to its size and balance.  They looked like a Top 25 team to me.

Evidently not TOO much like one. They received no votes in this week's poll. 

[northb]

I know that Hope fans could agree with this statement.  Cleary Cleary Cares for Calvin.  He seems to forget that people all over watch this broadcast and should be a neutral unbiased commentator.  It appears he targets the Grand Rapids market.  Maybe I'm way off on this but it's just my opinion. 

It's funny how our own bias affects our opinion. Since Saturday's game I have spoken with 3 Calvin fans who, like me, watched the TV broadcast. Every one of them was vehement in their denunciation of what they saw as Cleary's pro-Hope bias and said they wouldn't listen to any broadcast he did.

We see what we look for

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URkDvGqpjuw

[arena]

I know that Hope fans could agree with this statement.  Cleary Cleary Cares for Calvin.  He seems to forget that people all over watch this broadcast and should be a neutral unbiased commentator.  It appears he targets the Grand Rapids market.  Maybe I'm way off on this but it's just my opinion. 

It's funny how our own bias affects our opinion. Since Saturday's game I have spoken with 3 Calvin fans who, like me, watched the TV broadcast. Every one of them was vehement in their denunciation of what they saw as Cleary's pro-Hope bias and said they wouldn't listen to any broadcast he did.

We see what we look for

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URkDvGqpjuw

Good example. 

[Happy Calvin Guy]

It seems that some on this board are getting a little sensitive, so maybe we should talk more basketball and not try to crack any jokes lest they offend. 

On the MVP race, thus far in my mind there is no question it is Reimink.  any production #'s per 40 min's are interesting to look at, but in my mind a player that can produce and manage to stay effective (and out of foul trouble) for the whole game is more valuable than a player who can simply be very productive for a shorter period of time.  Put another way, traditional per-game stats are more meaningful than per-40-min stats.

Note that I said that thus far it is Reimink.  I can see Caleb catching fire if Saturday is any indication, and Mantel asserting himself more and more too.  If Calvin can win the league, maybe the MVP will fall to one of those two.  Unless Adrian finishes above .500, I can't see Young getting it unless he puts up #'s far superior to anyone else.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Again, it was my first look at both, but I left the TV broadcast feeling like Calvin is the better team due to its size and balance.  They looked like a Top 25 team to me.

Evidently not TOO much like one. They received no votes in this week's poll. 

This is too bad only because it seems more and more that the only way to the NCAA tourney is through winning the league tourney.  It may be tough for any MIAA team to get an at-large bid.

Hypothetical:  If Calvin wins out but loses to Hope in the MIAA tourney, are they getting in?  Or vice versa?

[KnightSlappy]

On the MVP race, thus far in my mind there is no question it is Reimink.  any production #'s per 40 min's are interesting to look at, but in my mind a player that can produce and manage to stay effective (and out of foul trouble) for the whole game is more valuable than a player who can simply be very productive for a shorter period of time.  Put another way, traditional per-game stats are more meaningful than per-40-min stats.

In this case, though, 40 minute stats may be more telling. John turned his ankle against Alma so one of his GP is only 25 seconds and zero stats.

Hypothetical:  If Calvin wins out but loses to Hope in the MIAA tourney, are they getting in?  Or vice versa?

IMO: Yes for Calvin, Maybe for Hope

[sac]

Again, it was my first look at both, but I left the TV broadcast feeling like Calvin is the better team due to its size and balance.  They looked like a Top 25 team to me.

Evidently not TOO much like one. They received no votes in this week's poll. 

This is too bad only because it seems more and more that the only way to the NCAA tourney is through winning the league tourney.  It may be tough for any MIAA team to get an at-large bid.

Hypothetical:  If Calvin wins out but loses to Hope in the MIAA tourney, are they getting in?  Or vice versa?

The d3hoops.com top 25 has no bearing on NCAA invitations.

You can read about the convoluted process the NCAA uses here    http://d3hoops.com/faq.php?category=NCAA%20Tournament

[realist]

Sac:  Your numbers look pretty much like my more subjective evaluations.  In another game or two I think it will be more evident how large a climb it would be for Veldhouse or Young to get MVP.  I like both of them alot, but the deck is stacked against them.
Yes, the number of minutes one plays does have an impact, but simply because JR has to play 38 minutes doesn't make him the MVP.  It may just signify that Hope needs him more.  In recent memory I think the MVP has often gone to the guy who makes his team that much better, as opposed to the guy whose team tanks without him.  Ask yourself who is hurt moreby the loss of their MVP candidate: Olivet, Hope or Calvin.? 
HC.  Personally I am very glad that the so called national "experts" aren't giving Calvin any points.  All the better to sneak up on someone.  Just remember it is these same national pollsters that had Hope (not to mention Chicago) rated in the pre-season.  Look how that has turned out.  The polls have a bias to the people who are already there as opposed to those earning the right to be rated.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

JR played 38 minutes, and being asked to defend a bigger guy, and than run to the other end where you are going to shadowed is very taxing.   Earlier in the game with fresh legs that last shot of his goes in. 

Well it would go in most games anyway   

[realist]

HCG:  As Sac points out D3 Hoops top 25 really means nothing to the NCAA.  If you look at where Calvin is today, 4-0, and dream that they run the table, and lose to Hope in the MIAA tourney that would make Calvin a 16-1 "in region" team.  Hope is curently 3-2 "in region", and the best they can finsih is 16-2.  My gues is a 16-1 Calvin team looks good to the selection committee.  However, it really seems to piss off the other conferences that play many more "in region games".   If Hope loses 2 more to Calvin to finish 14-4 that means bubble time, and I wouldn't like those odds.

[realist]

JR played 38 minutes, and being asked to defend a bigger guy, and than run to the other end where you are going to shadowed is very taxing.   Earlier in the game with fresh legs that last shot of his goes in. 

Well it would go in most games anyway   

Maybe yes, and maybe no.  Perhaps I am giving Calvin too much credit for coming up with a game plan that forced JR to play 38 minutes.  The difference between making or not making that shot is so small it is hard to know the impact "tired legs" would have.   Needing JR to cover JM really indicates how important GVW feels JM is to the outcome.  It also points out how JR is Hope's best defender, but he is still human an the strain takes a toll.  Long before the opening bell I said if I were KVS I would plan my game so that I forced JR to beat me.  He almost did.

[BogeyMan]

Sac,

Are you missing Drew Yancey in your list of possible MVP's or Players of the Week?
Last week he had 43 points, 14 rebounds and was 18-32 from the field.  Not having a team favorite I  just read and don't write comments because I usually make a fool out myself.  His stats caught my eye Saturday night.