MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[almcguirejr]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

There are at least 2 people on this board who will find that funny........and probably for different reasons.

Do tell...

Not sure I feel comfortable sharing that with the board.

Its just one of those moments that happens........then a few minutes later you ask yourself...........did I really just do that?........and why the hell did I just do that?

Maybe you shouldn't have brought it up here originally then.

[oldknight]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

Titan Q: Thanks for the thoughts.  Trust me, I didn't take the side of the US women.

I'll go back to lurking now.

You can come back, despite the--shall we say--uneven welcome you received. Since you are a first time poster I've already given you my standard courtesy applause, just for showing up on the board.

I think TitanQ's listing of player sizes is telling on the question of how well the Olympic women's team might do in D3. The list speaks for itself but let me share with you an anecdote from OldKnight's past.

When I was in grad school I was typically enthralled by bookwork a lesser man would consider crushing and laborious, yet I would occasionally drag my self away from the library to play some pickup hoops with other students at the IM building. I hated to do that but thought it best for the OldKnight body which seemed to be wasting away in my library cubicle. The players there were the standard collection of college students--some former high school players of varying abilities, an occasional past player from the school, and some basketball wannabes. On a couple of nights when I played, Wanda Ford showed up to compete with the guys.

There's probably not a reader of this post who recognizes that name so let me tell you. Wanda was a 6'0" power forward, a stout player who had--let me put this delicately--a wide base. At first glance, you would expect her to be slow but she had amazingly quick feet to go along with excellent shooting skills, great timing, was a solid ball handler and had hands that were both large and soft.  I've played against other female DI players and Ford was, by far, the strongest of them all. Wanda Ford would go on to set the NCAA DI career rebounding record by averaging 16.1 rebounds per game over a four year career. I believe that record still stands. Her senior year Wanda averaged 30.6 points and 16.9 boards and scored 54 in one game and grabbed 30 rebounds in another. She was named a first team All-American, a team that included USC's Cheryl Miller, herself an Olympian and the sister of former Pacer, Reggie Miller. Simply put, Ford was a superior DI athlete and basketball player.

There were a couple of pickup games I played that matched me up, one-on-one, with Wanda. I found she could and did go hard to the basket and I admit she scored a few on me. I also scored a few on her and basically our matchup was a draw. But I was an out-of-shape graduate student and she was a top shelf DI hoopster in the best shape of her life. On my best day, I wasn't a top tier D3 player. Those encounters with one of the strongest female players around convinced me that no women's team would ever compete with the men. The difference in strength and power is simply too great for the ladies to overcome.

[sac]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

There are at least 2 people on this board who will find that funny........and probably for different reasons.

Do tell...

Not sure I feel comfortable sharing that with the board.

Its just one of those moments that happens........then a few minutes later you ask yourself...........did I really just do that?........and why the hell did I just do that?

Maybe you shouldn't have brought it up here originally then.

Maybe but then the ones who would find it funny might not have noticed it.

[almcguirejr]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

There are at least 2 people on this board who will find that funny........and probably for different reasons.

Do tell...

Not sure I feel comfortable sharing that with the board.

Its just one of those moments that happens........then a few minutes later you ask yourself...........did I really just do that?........and why the hell did I just do that?

Maybe you shouldn't have brought it up here originally then.

Maybe but then the ones who would find it funny might not have noticed it.

ALRIGHT,.... EVERYBODY,.... OUT OF THE POOL!

Sac and his chums are gonna use it for a little while.

[sac]

.........and actually the other party involved might not feel comfortable with it being shared either, but I'm certain they'd get a laugh out of it.         .........and gasp, they're a Calvin fan.

So sorry, not as chummy as you think.

[sac]

Thought I'd update our record chasers (these are the only three I'm aware of)


*** Peter Bunn's FT avg in league play stands at 91.4%, it will be pretty hard to get back in the top 5.  He's still among Hope's top 5 single season leaders.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

***  Matt Wayne of Adrian currently is 60-84 or .706 in MIAA play, the MIAA single season record is

BEST FIELD GOAL SHOOTING PERCENTAGE
.708    Brandon Crawford, Albion, 2005-06 (106-148)
.705    Steve Honderd, Calvin, 1991-92 (91-129)
.684 Wade Gugino, Hope, 1991-92 (91-133)
.684 Steve Honderd, Calvin, 1989-90 (81-117)

Matt's % is widely variable, at halftime Saturday his average was down to 65%, 2-2 in the second half put him back where he is now.  This is an interesting record given the names on this list.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Missed in yesterday scores was Wes Weir nailing 7 triples in the win over Alma, this makes up for his previous game of 1.

Wes Weir, Trine's 4.3 3 pointers per game is still way ahead of pace to break the single season MIAA record

THREE-POINTERS SCORED
3.5 Steve Brooks, Adrian, 2001-02 (42 in 12 games)
3.3    Todd Wesche, Adrian, 1996-97 (40 in 12 games)
3.2 Ben Taylor, Adrian, 1996-97 (38 in 12 games)
3.2 Andy Draayer, Calvin, 2004-05 (45 in 14 games)
3.2 Mo Brookins, Tri-State, 2004-05 (45 in 14 games)

Wes needs just 2 more to make this list, 6 more to tie the record.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

[realist]

Wanda Ford.  Drake University.  Cleveland native.

[formerd3db]

I watched most of the Albion/Olivet game and some things stood out.


1.  The north end of Albion's gym is pretty dark, they could use another row of lights there, I thought so  Wed and on video it really shows up.

2.  Albion might be playing the best team basketball in the league right now.  It just seems like everyone is playing a team concept.  A little surprising given what I saw 2 weeks ago.  I don't know if they can keep it up but I'm sure they'd like a chance to put some pressure on Calvin/Hope if they havent' already.  Could be 2 years in a row a slow start costs them a chance at the MIAA title.

3.  Albion does a really good job getting their 3 point shooters open for wideopen shots.  Almost every one they take is unguarded.

4.   Another career high today, Thalen I think.  Guys are just stepping up in Yancey's absense.

5.   Intensity never comes across on TV well, but there was a palpable difference between Albion's D and Olivet's D.


.......and I'll mention what I sent the Albion broadcaster.   Kresge is 75+ years old, the video quality is excellent.  Hope and Calvin have spent $75 million on new arenas.........no video.  Thats a little embarrasing

Some good observations there sac.  We discussed this on this board a few pages/couple of weeks ago re: facilties.  Anyway, I was talking with one of Hope's administrators last evening about various topics in the MIAA and that of various new facilities came up.  With Hope, Adrian, Calvin, Olivet having new bb facilities (Trine's being more recent as well), and now that Alma has committed (at least on paper and in the fundraising/planning stages for their new arena - BTW of which you had some previously very astute and interesting comments about their current "digs" and student attendance at games); it follows that Albion and Kazoo need to consider taking the next step.  As I recall (and because I haven't been to a game there), Kazoo semi-renovated their bb arena as did Albion several years ago.

However, it is time for at least Albion to take the next huge step.  Kresge is a sound building and as such, I personally think they should renovate it even more - gut the building and add the new individual seating at ends and home sideline like it was many years ago, thereby keeping it on campus.  While Albion will most likely never attract the size crowds that Hope, Calvin do, at least new "state of the art" home surroundings might improve that aspect.  Perhaps someone could address the Kazoo current status in that regard as well.

Too bad that Calvin's attendance is not what would be expected for home games so far in their new surroundings.  Were they on recent "Winter Break" like Hope is now?  Even if they were, it seems to me that in that same situation, Hope always manages to attract good crowds even when the students are not around.  You'd think that with a larger populated area (GR) that Calvin would, but then again, there are other attractions (uh, or distractions  ) that might play into that as compared to Holland!

And finally, I guess I would have to agree with many of you (and like some had said recently); at least for this year (although you could make a case for it every year), it doesn't matter in the stretch other than for a team to try and start their "ascending stretch to their peak" in the season i.e. becoming hot at the right time - since there is the league tourney, winning that for the AQ is what matters.  Only way to assure you can "go to the big dance" early rounds at least .  Anyway, should be interesting heading into the final couple of weeks to see who might be regrouping, although as we all know, anything can happen in the tournament - yet I think that might be especially true this year.

[GoVols]

Someone more astute than I (and others here?) once remarked that on Saturday afternoons, Hope basketball is pretty much the only game in town and they have a lot of elderly boosters who are gloriously faithful to their team. e.g.: even with the students on midwinter break (or whatever it's called), they still packed the place with over 3200 fans. Calvin, on the other hand, as was recently pointed out, is just a couple of minutes from a large mall and a movie theatre that charges just $3.50 to see (second run?) films on the big screen; and there are a lot of good ones to see at this time.
Plus, Grand Rapids and all it has to offer are just minutes away and a day away from campus is sometimes a welcome respite. At Hope, you can still go to the game and get out in plenty of time to tour the town and still be home by dark.

[CalvinChelseaMom]

Regarding Calvin's fan attendance at games--I think it's going to take time to build. It gets mentioned often on this board and it seems like it would be good for folks to just chill out about it. Holland and Grand Rapids are two completely different environments. In the same way that Chelsea football regularly fills it's large stadium (we are a small town and football is huge and the whole town participates), Holland seems to have that with basketball at Hope. Chelsea can go to a football game at Pioneer (at least three times as big as Chelsea) and have three times as many fans as Pioneer.

I'm not as concerned about the numbers. I'd rather see the students who do come get more excited--throughout the game. Then if the numbers grow, great. I was talking with my sister-in-law (who went to Calvin) and she said when she was at Calvin she didn't know anything about the basketball team. She's not even sure she knew there was one. Also, recently the daughter of a good friend (who is now a freshman at Calvin, living in the Diversity dorm), finally went to a basketball game. She grew up with our families spending a lot of time together, so she knows John pretty well. She told her mom she had no idea that basketball was such a big deal or that John was a key player! Many students at Calvin are just not interested in sports as much. They are into many, many other things.  Hope has a great fan base. The fans are really into it. Great! Hopefully, Calvin's attendance will grow and the students will be a fun and integral part of the games. In the meantime, we need to just keep playing good basketball.

[Dark Knight]

I haven't given an update on Trish's thoughts on the MIAA for two weeks now.

In the last two weeks, there were only four games more than 8 points afield of expectation. Trine's 76-58 win over Alma was a 12-point surprise; Hope 92-64 over Olivet and Olivet 73-51 over Trine were 14-point surprises, and Kalamazoo 82-50 over Alma was a huge 26-point surprise, in fact the biggest surprise of the season so far. Sometimes games just turn into blowouts.

Hope's blowout win against Olivet combined with Calvin's squeaker vs. Trine combined to put Hope solidly into first place in Trish's affections at 10.3 vs. 7.6, a position Calvin did nothing to change with close games against Alma and Adrian. Hope's power rating is fueled by two blowout wins, though; Hope median power is 6.1.

Albion continues to improve and was the strongest team in the MIAA over the last two weeks by the median measure.


Trish is still willing to make Calvin a favorite on Wednesday -- a very, very slight favorite with a 51% chance of victory. However, Calvin has a tougher schedule remaining than Hope, and Trish gives Hope a 43% chance of winning out, compared to 20% for Calvin and 13% for Albion.

Here are current (week 5) standings:

Team	Power	Median Power	Last 2 Weeks
Hope	10.3	6.1	6.0
Calvin	7.1	5.9	2.1
Albion	4.3	4.3	8.5
Olivet	-1.2	-1.0	-2.0
Adrian	-1.4	-4.3	-5.9
Kazoo	-3.9	-2.5	2.5
Trine	-6.4	0.0	0.0
Alma	-9.4	-5.6	-15.4

If anyone wants to play with the spreadsheet drop me a line and I'll send it to you. You'll need Excel 2007.

[Civic Minded]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

There are at least 2 people on this board who will find that funny........and probably for different reasons.

Do tell...

Not sure I feel comfortable sharing that with the board.

Its just one of those moments that happens........then a few minutes later you ask yourself...........did I really just do that?........and why the hell did I just do that?

Maybe you shouldn't have brought it up here originally then.

Maybe but then the ones who would find it funny might not have noticed it.

ALRIGHT,.... EVERYBODY,.... OUT OF THE POOL!

Sac and his chums are gonna use it for a little while.

Hey al...someone saw you in person this week --- isn't it time for you to disappear again? 8)

You really ought to stop peeing in the pool, dude.

[ziggy]

SAC: I thought you were passing out hugs on this board, not scaring away new posters.  I only asked the question because I saw YOU were part of the High School All-Americans vs. D3 All-Americans debate at http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6226.0 (yet another game that will never happen, but may be interesting to discuss nonetheless).

There are at least 2 people on this board who will find that funny........and probably for different reasons.

Do tell...

Not sure I feel comfortable sharing that with the board.

Its just one of those moments that happens........then a few minutes later you ask yourself...........did I really just do that?........and why the hell did I just do that?

Maybe you shouldn't have brought it up here originally then.

Maybe but then the ones who would find it funny might not have noticed it.

ALRIGHT,.... EVERYBODY,.... OUT OF THE POOL!

Sac and his chums are gonna use it for a little while.

Hey al...someone saw you in person this week --- isn't it time for you to disappear again? 8)

You really ought to stop peeing in the pool, dude.

Its really rude to pee in someone's pool.  Unless of course, that person swims in your toilet.  All bets are off at that point.

[GoKnights68]

Calvin got an attendance of 2800 in Saturday's game.  800 more than last Wednesday's game verses Kalamazoo.

Not too bad for Calvin...

[northb]

Maybe we'll get a few more for Wednesday's game!