MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[ziggy]

As the lead whittled from 19 down to 14, he inserted several players who make up the 3rd team and then proceeded to yank them one by one, as each of them made a mistake and watched the lead get down to 3 points at one point.

I don't think its a "sub pattern" thing, it is just that he decides to clear the bench too early.

[realist]

S7:  Perhaps if you looked at it from Trine taking advantage of a chance to make a game of it when they saw their chance rather than thinking it was a bad coaching decision to give subs some pt., and risking injury to starters it makes the sequence of events more reasonable.  
Are you upset he (GVW) put the subs in or that he had the good sense to put the starters back in when the margin shrank to 9. ?
From my distance it seems one might be disappointed the subs didn't do better when they got their chance, and also a tad disappointed the starters didn't respond better when put back in. 

[sac]

Some players made the MIAA career record books this season........

Matt Veltema, Calvin finished 101-113 from the FT line for his MIAA career, which puts him #2 on the all-time list

FREE THROW SHOOTING
(Minimum 90 made)   Att.      Made      Pct.
1. Eric Elliott, Hope, 87-91   205   184   .898
2. Matt Veltema, Calvin, 07-10  113  101 .893
3. Matt Strong, Hope, 85-88   175   152   .869
4. Ron Barczak, Kalamazoo, 87-91      203   176   .867
5. Ajamain Gardner, Olivet, 97-01   184   159   .864
6. Andy Mangin, Alma, 87-91   159   137   .862
7. Tom Dykstra, Hope, 68-70   115    99   .861
8. Steve Honderd, Calvin, 89-93   364   311   .854
9. Zak Silas, Albion, 04-07   116   99   .853
10. Tom Olson, Kalamazoo, 87-91   242   206   .851
11. Mike Kennedy, Calvin, 79-83   109    92   .844
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Just missing the career lists............

Matt Veltema went 93-211 from trey for .441, which is just under #5 at .461

THREE-POINT SHOOTING
(Minimum 50 made)   Att.      Made       Pct.
1. Mike Bachman, Alma, 88-92      119   57   .479
2. Eric Elliott, Hope, 87-91   107   51   .477
3. Kyle VanderWall, Hope, 98-01   181   86   .475
4. Matt Rottman, Calvin, 89-94   115   54   .470
5. Jim Timmer, Calvin, 86-90   180   83   .461


John Mantel, Calvin finished with 359 rebounds, 12 short of making the top 10

REBOUNDING   Number
1. Floyd Brady, Hope, 64-68    648
2. Mark Veenstra, Calvin, 70-74    615
3. Gordon Lofts, Olivet, 64-68    603
4. Willie Dawkins, Alma, 70-74    551
5. Craig Vossekuil, Kazoo, 66-70    441
6. Kevin York, Kalamazoo, 73-77    412
7. Travis DePree, Albion, 01-05       397
8. David Dame, Kalamazoo, 75-76       389
9. Jeremy Veenstra, Calvin, 99-03    373
10. Curtis Williams, Adrian, 75-79    371
10. Aaron Winkle, Calvin, 96-00    371


Matt Wayne,  Adrian, finished his career 140-229 from the floor for a FG% of .611.  Unfortunately that falls 40 made FG's short of making the requirement to make the list.

[sac]

A couple of Olivet players are on pace to make the record books next year........

both Andre Evans and Joe Post are on pace to crack the top 5 for Assists per game.  Andre is at 4.07, Joe is at 4.46.

ASSISTS (Since 1988-89)
(Minimum 36 games played)   GP      No.      Avg.
1. Joel Holstege, Hope, 94-98      48   237   4.9
2. Matt Harrison, Calvin, 88-92   36   168   4.7
3. Travis DePree, Albion, 01-05   50   203   4.1
4. Jeremy Cole, Kalamazoo, 92-96   48   194   4.0
5. Ryan Klingler, Hope, 98-01   40   155   3.9



and Michael McClary is climbing the career records list, his 627 points puts him on pace to crack the scoring list.  If he has another year like this one (306 pts), Michael would finish with over 900 points.  Good for the top 10.

SCORING   Points
1. Mark Veenstra, Calvin, 73-77    1,233
2. Floyd Brady, Hope, 64-68   1,170
3. Dan Shinabarger, Hope, 68-72    1,117
4. Steve Honderd, Calvin, 89-93    1,046
5. Charles Hudson, Alma, 67-71    1,001
6. Jim VanderHill, Hope, 59-63   945
7. Gordon Lofts, Olivet, 64-68   940
8. Willie Dawkins, Alma, 70-74   917
9. John Schelske, Kalamazoo, 75-79       895
10. Bill Sall, Calvin, 85-90   864
11. Jeremy Veenstra, Calvin, 99-03   855
12. Mike Maciascz, Olivet, 68-72   839
13. Clare Van Wieren, Hope, 62-66    828
14. Duane Bosma, Hope, 92-96   825
15. Eric Elliott, Hope, 87-91   813


for rebounding, Michael is already a member of the top 10 with 420 MIAA rebounds.  He had 154 this season, should he duplicate that effort next season he would be 4th on the all-time rebound list.

REBOUNDING   Number
1. Floyd Brady, Hope, 64-68    648
2. Mark Veenstra, Calvin, 70-74    615
3. Gordon Lofts, Olivet, 64-68    603
4. Willie Dawkins, Alma, 70-74    551
5. Craig Vossekuil, Kazoo, 66-70    441
6. Michael McClary, Olivet, 08-11      420
7. Kevin York, Kalamazoo, 73-77    412
8. Travis DePree, Albion, 01-05       397
9. David Dame, Kalamazoo, 75-76       389
10. Jeremy Veenstra, Calvin, 99-03    373
11. Curtis Williams, Adrian, 75-79    371
11. Aaron Winkle, Calvin, 96-00    371

[sac]

JC Cruse, Albion and Brent Schuster, Calvin are players of the week.

[sac]

Good Morning All -

There has been discussion recently on here regarding Hope's bench and GVW's use or lack of use/trust in them.

Well, GVW pulled the typical (Alma/Trine/KZoo) sub patterns on Saturday and made a mess of the 2nd half for all involved (players and fans).

As the lead whittled from 19 down to 14, he inserted several players who make up the 3rd team and then proceeded to yank them one by one, as each of them made a mistake and watched the lead get down to 3 points at one point.

I am all for getting your bench time in games and rewarding all your players for their dedication and effort.  But, why does GVW continue to pull this type of sub pattern and then have to reinsert the starters to hopefully save the day?

Am I the only one who was frustrated by this on Saturday?  After the loss to Adrian on Wed and then that display on Saturday..........................not exactly how you want your team going into the MIAA tourney.  More than likely your only chance to make the NCAA tourney.

Please tell me I am on an island by myself so I can forget this feeling.

Hope had a 17 point lead at 8:51........Will Bowser came back on the floor joining the other 4 starters.

Hope led by 16 at 8:00.........Holwerda, Ross, Jungling
replace Bunn, Venema, Krombeen............2 starters on the floor

Hope led by 14 at 6:22.........Dickerson in, Nelis out.......Will Bowser only starter on the floor

Hope led by 12 at 5:59............Bunn in, Dickerson out........2 starters on the floor

Hope led by 12 at 4:56...........Venema in, Holwerda out.......3 starters on the floor

Hope led by 9 at 4:03..........Nelis, Krombeen in, Jungling, Ross out......5 starters on the floor

From that point on Neil and Venema subbed in and out 3 times (offense/defense I guess)



I see a lot of starters on the floor.......


I would say the fact Hope didn't score a single FG  the last 8 min and went 0-8 and scored just 4 points on FT's  has more to do with the game getting tighter than any subbing pattern.........

Here's who took those shots for Hope......

MISSED JUMPER by Chris Nelis                    07:41
MISSED JUMPER by Scott Jungling                 07:05
MISSED 3 PTR by Scott Jungling                  05:35
MISSED JUMPER by Will Bowser                    03:51
MISSED JUMPER by Andy Venema                    03:03
MISSED JUMPER by Andy Venema                    03:00
MISSED 3 PTR by Peter Bunn                      01:08
MISSED JUMPER by Peter Bunn                     00:10

Trine also made 5 shots in a row from 8min on, including 2 3's and scored points on 6 straight possessions and made 10 of their last 13 shots.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

do career #'s include tournament (MIAA or NCAA) games?  If so, it's too early to close the book on the rankings and Matt Veltema still has a shot at the #1 all time FT %. 

[sac]

do career #'s include tournament (MIAA or NCAA) games?  If so, it's too early to close the book on the rankings and Matt Veltema still has a shot at the #1 all time FT %. 

no

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Here's my postseason awards:

MVP:  Michael McClary, Olivet
Newcomer of the year:  Nathan Jennings, Olivet
Coach of the Year:  Mark White, Adrian

In keeping with MIAA standards of six players per team, but adding a 3rd all-conference team,

1st team:
Michael McClary, Olivet
Peter Bunn, Hope
Nathan Jennings, Olivet
JC Cruse, Albion
Scott Rogers, Trine
John Mantel, Calvin

2nd team:
Andre Evans, Olivet
Joe Prepolec, Kalamazoo
Ryan Clark, Kalamazoo
Chris Nelis, Hope
Will Bowser, Hope
Jovon Mosley, Adrian

3rd team:
Matt Veltema, Calvin
Kevin Ginther, Alma
Andre Bridges, Albion
Wes Weir, Trine
Danny Rodts, Calvin
Joe Post, Olivet

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Peter Bunn is also on track to join the MIAA FT% record books.  After 2 seasons, he is at 101-112 .902. 

[section7]

My apologies, wasn't trying to imply that the 3rd string let the game get down to 3 points, just that the pattern of subs and actual score went from 19 pt lead to a 3 pt lead.

I would contend that the 0-8 shooting and play of the final 5 minutes of the game had much to do with the starters and 3rd string being interchanged.  But it is clear I am the only one of that opinion.

The other point, is I think it is great when all people get to play, but how about when the game is in hand.....with 3 minutes or so left, not 10 minutes.  Then by all means, clear the bench and go to town.  The starters to 3rd string to starters to recover is not ideal for anyone.

BTW, wonder how Ty Tanis felt about his time in the 2nd half?

[section7]

My apologies, wasn't trying to imply that the 3rd string let the game get down to 3 points, just that the pattern of subs and actual score went from 19 pt lead to a 3 pt lead.

I would contend that the 0-8 shooting and play of the final 5 minutes of the game had much to do with the starters and 3rd string being interchanged.  But it is clear I am the only one of that opinion.

The other point, is I think it is great when all people get to play, but how about when the game is in hand.....with 3 minutes or so left, not 10 minutes.  Then by all means, clear the bench and go to town.  The starters to 3rd string to starters to recover is not ideal for anyone.

BTW, wonder how Ty Tanis felt about his time in the 2nd half?

LOL, CM!

[realist]

No need to apologize S7.  You obviously feel strongly that the subbing pattern is a concern.  What the heck.  I am a Calvin fan, and have learned over the years that GVW generally has a pretty good idea what he is doing.  I think Sac and some of us are simply pointing out GVW isn't the one who missed the shots at the end of the game, and Trine did get a hot hand.  Venema had 4 fouls so you protect him.
Suppose GVW had left the starters in until the 3 minute mark, and the lead had grown to 25 or 26.  What sort of comments might that evoke?

[realist]

HCG:  Interesting that you place 4 guys from the team that finished 4th in the MIAA on your teams, only one from the 3rd place team, and 3 each from the top 2 teams.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

The other point, is I think it is great when all people get to play, but how about when the game is in hand.....with 3 minutes or so left, not 10 minutes.  Then by all means, clear the bench and go to town.  The starters to 3rd string to starters to recover is not ideal for anyone.

Why not sub those guys in the 2nd half?  Those "3rd string guys" were subbed in during the first half when the game was tied, and were a big part of the reason Hope went on a run to open a big halftime lead.