MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[ChicagoHopeNut]

I really don't get why its so important that people think this needs to  be done quickly, or that 7 weeks is a long time.

whats the difference between today and next week or 3 weeks ago?

I am not at all surprised why you don't get it.

section7, could you explain why you think it's important that Hope fill the position quickly?

Personally, I am of the opinion the job should have been filled by now but at the same time I certainly can't offer any concrete reasons why it has to be. I have some opinions but I certainly don't think the program is going to collapse over this.

This isn't D1 and the reality is filling a job at D3 quickly is not nearly as important as filling a job at the D1 level.

[Pat Coleman]

I agree that at this point the ship has probably sailed.

There isn't likely to be any positive effect on the incoming recruiting class to be gained at this point. All that's left is to keep the kids focused on their offseason activities and if Hope doesn't have someone invested in running the program now they may lose some ground there.

If Van Wieren had announced his retirement closer to the end of the season, there would have been a shot at having a smoother transition, I suppose. We'll never really know what kind of effect it has on a recruiting class in terms of losing kids who may have been on the fence.

[KnightSlappy]

whats the difference between today and next week or 3 weeks ago?

Your agitation level.

[sac]

whats the difference between today and next week or 3 weeks ago?

Your agitation level.

who's agitated?  just disappointed in the discourse

I'd also appreciate it if we backed off on the making this personal about me or anyone else stuff.

[almcguirejr]

who's agitated?  just disappointed in the discourse

I'd also appreciate it if we backed off on the making this personal about me or anyone else stuff.

You've been attacking and making it personal with Hoopdreams for 7 weeks.

[Pat Coleman]

Well, in fairness, it has often been a two-way street.

[sac]

who's agitated?  just disappointed in the discourse

I'd also appreciate it if we backed off on the making this personal about me or anyone else stuff.

You've been attacking and making it personal with Hoopdreams for 7 weeks.

Here's the sum total of posts I've made to hoopdreams or quoting hoopdreams since Glenn retired

SAC- I'm not sure if my speculation is stirring THE pot, or yours.  Just because I am providing some info and some speculation to what most everyone on this board is either questioning, wondering, or speculating, doesn't make it a bad thing.  Just because make humor isn't nearly as funny as Wiz's, doesn't make me a bad guy. 

I know a lot of people around and in the situation, maybe not as many as you, nor as important, but you have to give at least a little credit to the accuracy of a lot of the facts/ eventual facts discussed on this board.

FYI- I have had a dozen personal messages this week asking for "more"  info about the coaching situation or thanking me for my honest approach.  I may be speculating on this, but i get the impression many posters aren't nearly as irritated as you.  If they are, they don't feel the need to "put me in my place".  I'm sure you can go back through all my posts and count the times i tried to stir some sort of conversation during a lull, I guess I'd rather do that than respond to a picture of a guy dressed in an orange outfit, or a picture of mustard and ketchup bottles.  Must be an inside joke.  I'll stick strictly to the facts from now on, no more speculating.

Its the lack of discretion you've shown when sharing what are probably private conversations with players and posters you've had, and you sharing those thoughts  publicly when those that share those thoughts with you wish they remain private.

quit trying to act as though you're the only person with a relevant post.  I was simply trying to support my intial post, which was dismissed by someone else, with another comment made by someone else.  Is this making a mountain of a molehill, speculating, or supporting an initial comment which was questioned/dismissed as outlandish?

I could give 2 s%$ts about who Hope hires, it has no impact on my life.  I just like commenting on message  boards about things a may or may not know anything about. I'm just speculating on my knowledge of course.

For someone who doesn't care, your last 22 posts are about the Hope job.  Constantly stirring the pot for reactions sometimes just stirs up trouble.

devossed- thanks for the tip that Glenn has been lobbying for a month now.  It further justifies my comment that if  Hopes players input into the hire was irrelevant, why is he calling everyone?  For a month?    An earlier poster " I seriously doubt that the new coach is going to be decided by a popular vote of players and parents".  I would like to think that the returning players thoughts on the man who will become an important figure in their lives for the next 1, 2 or 3 years may be of at least a little importance.  It's just speculation though.

Quit trying to make a mountain out of a molehill, all coaches who retire in some way try to influence the next hire.

See Lloyd Carr, Mike Turner etc etc.

Looking at it from a different perspective, and I know the time lines of both postings play a big part in my speculation....  If Neil has a Masters' but its not in Kinesiology or any other health related speciality, wouldn't the Assistant of the Dow and Intramural Coordinator position have been PERFECT FOR HIM? 

Working off memory, but I don't think any of the 3 finalists have a degree in Kinesiology.

I'm not on the hiring committee but the person I heard this info from is pretty darn close to the situation. Won't say the name of the person (publicly) because it was said in confidence, although he didn't specifically say "not to say anything".  I guess in this sense it just looks like speculation

key words probably ?

SAC, if you want to call me a jerk, please post it for all to see because I'm a big boy and can handle it.  Am I overusing the word "speculating"?  I apologize if I've offended you in any way, and will stop with the "Hope hire" talk. Hope will win the MIAA regardless of who they hire, unless Olivet has something to say....

ok

Sorry ChicagoHopeNut but I believe "gut feelings" fall under the category of speculation, which currently is not allowed on this message board.  Of course, I'm purely speculating on this point.  There are only a few members worthy of releasing information pertaining to Hope Basketball.  

Who will be the first to know and release info- Hope faithful, or Buena Vista faithful? Hypothetically speculating...

There's really no reason to continue being a jerk about all of this. 

The above was actually a private message that hoopdreams requested be public.

section 7, are you speculating?  By the way SAC, unless you were at the game Monday night and watched it firsthand, your  brief recap was...  Are you speculating that Cornerstone pulled away and that everyone was present other than Bowser?  Was that info told to you in confidence?  Some of us prefer to let nature run its course before jumping to conclusions that C-stone will be good. Summer league are not an accurate indicator of how strong a team will be during the regular season.  I seem to remember someone debating this in the past.  Can someone find that dialogue for me?

By the way, if it does come to fruition that Carlson is named Head Coach, how do you explain it?  You (SAC) confided in me via personal message about the 3 finalists Hope was interviewing, I believe before it became common knowledge to those on this board. And by know it is common knowledge who the initial 3 were.  What happened? Yes, I understand that these were "personal messages", just trying to make a point. Although I'm not even sure what the point is anymore. Suppose I could have PM'd you about this but then no one could see you calling me names.

Of course, section 7 could simply be making this up to stir the pot, maybe because I haven't made any "jerkish" statements in a few hours. Thought I was done with this but the "Holland grapevine" comment with the cute smily face was too much to pass on

Two answers since you want everyting to be public.

1)  As we all probably know now the original statements circulating that Hope had a final 3, were probably not true.

2)  I confided in you before I understood that you simply can't keep anything private, or realized that you can't determine yourself what topics and information should be shared publicly or kept private.  I won't be making that mistake with you again.

section 7, are you speculating?  By the way SAC, unless you were at the game Monday night and watched it firsthand, your  brief recap was...  Are you speculating that Cornerstone pulled away and that everyone was present other than Bowser?  Was that info told to you in confidence?  Some of us prefer to let nature run its course before jumping to conclusions that C-stone will be good. Summer league are not an accurate indicator of how strong a team will be during the regular season.  I seem to remember someone debating this in the past.  Can someone find that dialogue for me?

By the way, if it does come to fruition that Carlson is named Head Coach, how do you explain it?  You (SAC) confided in me via personal message about the 3 finalists Hope was interviewing, I believe before it became common knowledge to those on this board. And by know it is common knowledge who the initial 3 were.  What happened? Yes, I understand that these were "personal messages", just trying to make a point. Although I'm not even sure what the point is anymore. Suppose I could have PM'd you about this but then no one could see you calling me names.

Of course, section 7 could simply be making this up to stir the pot, maybe because I haven't made any "jerkish" statements in a few hours. Thought I was done with this but the "Holland grapevine" comment with the cute smily face was too much to pass on

Two answers since you want everyting to be public.

1)  As we all probably know now the original statements circulating that Hope had a final 3, were probably not true.

2)  I confided in you before I understood that you simply can't keep anything private, or realized that you can't determine yourself what topics and information should be shared publicly or kept private.  I won't be making that mistake with you again.

In looking back, I can see you already knew where the 3 candidates were from, I was being nice and filled in the blanks for you.   I can see now I was just feeding the wolf in sheeps clothing.

[sac]

If you haven't wandered over to the NCAC board, or the front page of d3hoops.com, DePauw has decided to join the NCAC.

This is a pretty significant addition to not only their conference but to the Great Lakes Region as a whole.  It doesn't really affect in-region game status since those were all ready in-region because of the administrative region rule.

DePauw has either been in the NCAA or just on the edge of NCAA tournament qualification for a few years in a row.  This makes the GL region stronger and you have to think makes that Pool C bid just a little tougher to get.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Here's the sum total of posts I've made to hoopdreams or quoting hoopdreams since Glenn retired

Wow, seems pretty extensive. I don't think that I've actually ever seen a longer post .....

[Pat Coleman]

It will certainly add some depth to the GL regional rankings. In recent years when it comes to mock playoff projections, the last team in the Great Lakes list has usually been a pretty tough sell compared against others nationally. (Not even talking Calvin here, but the next one down, such as a PAC team.)

Where it might affect other teams getting in is if three NCAC teams are in consideration -- then the third team might be considered somewhat of a mental roadblock for the committee and might keep teams below them from getting in.

I'd be interested to see some assessment of what a strong DePauw team replacing Earlham might do for NCAC strength of schedule as a whole. It will only be one or two games out of 25, so it might not be a big difference.

[Happy Calvin Guy]

It will only be one or two games out of 25, so it might not be a big difference.

Even a small difference can matter huge when you're on the bubble.  Not to open our old wounds, but look at Calvin's quest to land an at-large bid in the NCAA tourney in each of the past two seasons. 

[Pat Coleman]

Right, I know. But we don't really know how much of a difference it takes to be meaningful to the committee.

[ziggy]

Right, I know. But we don't really know how much of a difference it takes to be meaningful to the committee.

And as the members of the committee changes over the weighting between WP and SOS (whatever incarnation the NCAA goes with at the time) will change. When you get towards the bottom of Pool C the choices are generall WP or SOS, the challenge comes in determining whether to reward a good record against lesser opponents or a somewhat lesser record against better opponents.

[oldknight]

This is certainly fun, watching all the back and forth. I got a PM from someone with a completely different name that nobody has talked about in weeks, claiming the guy was a done deal. Have not been able to get in touch with the coach in question.

Mike Boschee, Head Coach at Central College hasn't been mentioned in awhile.  He had a great 2009-10 record.  He does not have a Ph.d but does have a Master's and teaches in the Exercise Science department at Central.

I don't remember Boschee's name being in the mix before but--like Van Haaften--the current head coach of The Dutch (the one in Iowa) seems to have the resume' to be considered for the Hope job. Boschee has a nice combination of youth and a good track record, having turned around a dormant Central College program that only won 5 games each of the the two seasons prior to his hire in 2003. Since I have a long history with Pella (I got married within easy walking distance of Central's campus, was acquainted with more than one staff member at the school, and still have relatives there) I thought I would try and call in a favor in an attempt to track down this rumor. Alas, I've been shut out.

[Gregory Sager]

This is certainly fun, watching all the back and forth. I got a PM from someone with a completely different name that nobody has talked about in weeks, claiming the guy was a done deal. Have not been able to get in touch with the coach in question.

Mike Boschee, Head Coach at Central College hasn't been mentioned in awhile.  He had a great 2009-10 record.  He does not have a Ph.d but does have a Master's and teaches in the Exercise Science department at Central.

I don't remember Boschee's name being in the mix before but--like Van Haaften--the current head coach of The Dutch (the one in Iowa) seems to have the resume' to be considered for the Hope job. Boschee has a nice combination of youth and a good track record, having turned around a dormant Central College program that only won 5 games each of the the two seasons prior to his hire in 2003. Since I have a long history with Pella (I got married within easy walking distance of Central's campus, was acquainted with more than one staff member at the school, and still have relatives there) I thought I would try and call in a favor in an attempt to track down this rumor. Alas, I've been shut out.

... and, as I pointed out before, Boschee came to Central after having been an assistant at a high-powered D3 program of long standing, Gustavus Adolphus College. Boschee's experience at GAC may not count for as much as his work at Central in terms of his resume, but I'll bet that it nevertheless counts for a lot.