MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[Happy Calvin Guy]

I gotta say that from the outside looking in, it appears that Hope's basketball program is failing Public Relations 101 with its handling of various injuries and issues within the program.  I understand that personal privacy is important, but Peter Bunn's injury and the repeated vague references in the paper about the issue being "undisclosed", etc, have seemed to enflame quite a bit of speculation, most of it probably worse than whatever the truth actually is.  Even some very non-credible rumors on this board have speculated about eligibility issues.  I'm sure there is nothing at all to that as they have been refuted by more reliable sources, and I do not condone ridiculous rumormongering, but the mere fact that those thoughts are running around in people's minds could have been avoided with some better language and disclosure from the Hope basketball program, even if they stopped short of revealing the full details of the injury. 

PR principles state that honesty ("whole truth", not just the absence of falsehood) and "getting in front of the story" are important.  Now this week, we see two players vaporize from the published roster with no official explanation from the program.  Again, rampant speculation ensues.  The fact is that sometime stuff happens, and it can be uncomfortable and unpleasant to talk about.  But when you are in the public eye, you gotta be honest and forthcoming, otherwise rumors will swirl in the meantime and then the truth comes out eventually anyways. If this continues, in time the program will develop a reputation for being secretive and less than honest.  I am certainly not accusing Hope of being anything less than honest, but by being less than quick and forthcoming around several issues, it potentially could be perceived by the public that they are hiding something.  Unfortunately in this world, perception = reality.  Am I missing something?  Again, just a 3rd party observer here. 

[Dark Knight]

I gotta say that from the outside looking in, it appears that Hope's basketball program is failing Public Relations 101 with its handling of various injuries and issues within the program.  I understand that personal privacy is important, but Peter Bunn's injury and the repeated vague references in the paper about the issue being "undisclosed", etc, have seemed to enflame quite a bit of speculation, most of it probably worse than whatever the truth actually is.  Even some very non-credible rumors on this board have speculated about eligibility issues.  I'm sure there is nothing at all to that as they have been refuted by more reliable sources, and I do not condone ridiculous rumormongering, but the mere fact that those thoughts are running around in people's minds could have been avoided with some better language and disclosure from the Hope basketball program, even if they stopped short of revealing the full details of the injury.  

PR principles state that honesty ("whole truth", not just the absence of falsehood) and "getting in front of the story" are important.  Now this week, we see two players vaporize from the published roster with no official explanation from the program.  Again, rampant speculation ensues.  The fact is that sometime stuff happens, and it can be uncomfortable and unpleasant to talk about.  But when you are in the public eye, you gotta be honest and forthcoming, otherwise rumors will swirl in the meantime and then the truth comes out eventually anyways. If this continues, in time the program will develop a reputation for being secretive and less than honest.  I am certainly not accusing Hope of being anything less than honest, but by being less than quick and forthcoming around several issues, it potentially could be perceived by the public that they are hiding something.  Unfortunately in this world, perception = reality.  Am I missing something?  Again, just a 3rd party observer here.  

Unfortunately, colleges are constrained by the law here. If a player chooses not to give permission for the college to reveal the type of injury, it is illegal for the college to reveal it. Similarly for academic issues.

I don't know of laws governing revealing disciplinary issues, but no doubt there are college policies about not revealing those.

[sac]

The schedule is showing Calvin vs Benedictine at the Elmhurst Classic, is this a change?

I thought Calvin was supposed to play DePauw.

[sac]

I gotta say that from the outside looking in, it appears that Hope's basketball program is failing Public Relations 101 with its handling of various injuries and issues within the program.  I understand that personal privacy is important, but Peter Bunn's injury and the repeated vague references in the paper about the issue being "undisclosed", etc, have seemed to enflame quite a bit of speculation, most of it probably worse than whatever the truth actually is.  Even some very non-credible rumors on this board have speculated about eligibility issues.  I'm sure there is nothing at all to that as they have been refuted by more reliable sources, and I do not condone ridiculous rumormongering, but the mere fact that those thoughts are running around in people's minds could have been avoided with some better language and disclosure from the Hope basketball program, even if they stopped short of revealing the full details of the injury. 

PR principles state that honesty ("whole truth", not just the absence of falsehood) and "getting in front of the story" are important.  Now this week, we see two players vaporize from the published roster with no official explanation from the program.  Again, rampant speculation ensues.  The fact is that sometime stuff happens, and it can be uncomfortable and unpleasant to talk about.  But when you are in the public eye, you gotta be honest and forthcoming, otherwise rumors will swirl in the meantime and then the truth comes out eventually anyways. If this continues, in time the program will develop a reputation for being secretive and less than honest.  I am certainly not accusing Hope of being anything less than honest, but by being less than quick and forthcoming around several issues, it potentially could be perceived by the public that they are hiding something.  Unfortunately in this world, perception = reality.  Am I missing something?  Again, just a 3rd party observer here. 

I really don't know how to respond to this except to say its pretty rare to see any formal press release from a D3 when a kid leaves the program for any reason.

Calvin had a PG not long ago that left the program and it was never released to the public why he left.  Nor did it need to be.  I certainly don't recall a press release, but I do recall it being discussed a bit on the board why he left.



Regarding Hope/Bunn, I wish people would just accept that its a delicate situation and that they aren't going to get the answers they want when they want it.  Not to mention they have a first year coach who's trying to make sure he follows the book of school policy to the letter.


Mysliewiec and Williams is a new situation that happened over the weekend, the team is in Florida, the Sentinel is in Holland (at least I doubt they've joined the team just yet)..... give it the proper time and I'm sure something might appear in the press shortly.

[realist]

The schedule is showing Calvin vs Benedictine at the Elmhurst Classic, is this a change?

I thought Calvin was supposed to play DePauw.

Not sure it is a change.  When the schedule first came out it just listed the teams, and the pairings came later if memory serves correct.  I think it was commented on as speculation over Calvin getting an "in region" game.

 

[realist]

Over the years I recall quite a few Calvin players that have left the program for one reason or another.  In some cases the college has commented on the departure, and other times it is silent.  In some cases like Engelsma, we are told, he stopped playing to focus on his plans to go into the ministry, and several years before that Joel Hoekstra didn't come back for a senior year, we are told, so he could concentrate on getting into medical school.  Gerth was the p.g. that left after one season. (No comment).
A college might be more inclined to comment on a departure if they feel it is likely not to be viewed as negative towards the college. I think both Calvin and Hope have been fairly forthright when disciplinary issues have been involved.  Not the details, but that it was disciplinary.

A review of the Calvin rosters over the last 10 years shows quite a few names that appear for only a year or two.  The same might well be true of every school.

In some cases, and Mr. Bunn may fit this scenario, it is almost a no win for the college.  Darned if they do, and darned if they don't comment. 

[Happy Calvin Guy]

I gotta say that from the outside looking in, it appears that Hope's basketball program is failing Public Relations 101 with its handling of various injuries and issues within the program.  I understand that personal privacy is important, but Peter Bunn's injury and the repeated vague references in the paper about the issue being "undisclosed", etc, have seemed to enflame quite a bit of speculation, most of it probably worse than whatever the truth actually is.  Even some very non-credible rumors on this board have speculated about eligibility issues.  I'm sure there is nothing at all to that as they have been refuted by more reliable sources, and I do not condone ridiculous rumormongering, but the mere fact that those thoughts are running around in people's minds could have been avoided with some better language and disclosure from the Hope basketball program, even if they stopped short of revealing the full details of the injury. 

PR principles state that honesty ("whole truth", not just the absence of falsehood) and "getting in front of the story" are important.  Now this week, we see two players vaporize from the published roster with no official explanation from the program.  Again, rampant speculation ensues.  The fact is that sometime stuff happens, and it can be uncomfortable and unpleasant to talk about.  But when you are in the public eye, you gotta be honest and forthcoming, otherwise rumors will swirl in the meantime and then the truth comes out eventually anyways. If this continues, in time the program will develop a reputation for being secretive and less than honest.  I am certainly not accusing Hope of being anything less than honest, but by being less than quick and forthcoming around several issues, it potentially could be perceived by the public that they are hiding something.  Unfortunately in this world, perception = reality.  Am I missing something?  Again, just a 3rd party observer here. 

I really don't know how to respond to this except to say its pretty rare to see any formal press release from a D3 when a kid leaves the program for any reason.

Calvin had a PG not long ago that left the program and it was never released to the public why he left.  Nor did it need to be.  I certainly don't recall a press release, but I do recall it being discussed a bit on the board why he left.



Regarding Hope/Bunn, I wish people would just accept that its a delicate situation and that they aren't going to get the answers they want when they want it.  Not to mention they have a first year coach who's trying to make sure he follows the book of school policy to the letter.


Mysliewiec and Williams is a new situation that happened over the weekend, the team is in Florida, the Sentinel is in Holland (at least I doubt they've joined the team just yet)..... give it the proper time and I'm sure something might appear in the press shortly.

I am in no way suggesting that Hope or any other school "owes" the public this information.  I'm just suggesting that if they prefer to not have as many rumors floating around out there, they may want to choose a better PR strategy.  Otherwise I'm afraid that rampant sumors will be present, and if they choose that to be the lesser of two evils, so be it.  Maybe it's just exascerbated by the fact that Hope has a new coach and a bunch of the preseason roster members aren't playing now. 

[sac]

Remaining Non-conference schedules

Adrian  4-4, 0-1 in-region
12-29  Spring Arbor
12-30  North Central

1-1 would be a good finish, they'll be a strong underdog vs SAU, and North Central is 3-0 vs D3 since deploying a new defensive strategy including a win over Albion.



Albion  5-4, 2-1 in-region

12-29 vs MacMurray, IL at Defiance
12-30  at Defiance or vs OSU-Lima

Albion should face Defiance in the tournament championship, I'm 50/50 if they can beat them and it would be the all importan in-region game.  Their performance in Texas was less than inspiring.  1-1 seems like the safe pick.



Alma 4-4, 2-1 in-region  

12-28  at Indiana-Northwest
12-29  at Purdue-Calumet

They should win both of these, with emphasis on should, but if they can drop a 16 point second half lead to Finlandia and lose...they can lose both of these.  Mr. Optimism says 2-0.


Calvin 4-5, 1-0 in-region

12-29 vs Benedictine
12-30 vs DePauw or Elmhurst

Benedictine seems winnable, as does Elmhurst.  DePauw might be a tougher pick.  I see 1-1 with a loss to DePauw maybe.


Hope 3-4, 1-0 in-region

12-21 vs Lake Forest
12-22 vs Dominican
12-29 vs Marygrove
12-30 vs Madonna or Malone

Almost feels like 4-0 is a must, winning both in Fla. is a must because those are both in-region.


Kalamazoo 2-7, 2-6 in-region

12-29 vs Geneva at Case Western
12-30 vs Earlham or Case Western

anywhere from 0-2 to 2-0, Geneva appears to be the best team entering the tournament.  maybe a loss with consolation win.


Olivet 5-6, 2-1 in-region

The Comets are done and will have 18 days off before opening the MIAA with Albion.



Trine 7-2, 5-2 in-region

12-21 vs Dominican
12-22 vs Lake Forest

Theses both seem winnable for the Thunder



Conference record today:  34-36, in-region 15-12
Prediction (maybe a little optimistic):  46-40, in-region 19-16

At this point last season the league was 30-40.

Edit~because I can't do math

[HopeConvert]

I gotta say that from the outside looking in, it appears that Hope's basketball program is failing Public Relations 101 with its handling of various injuries and issues within the program.  I understand that personal privacy is important, but Peter Bunn's injury and the repeated vague references in the paper about the issue being "undisclosed", etc, have seemed to enflame quite a bit of speculation, most of it probably worse than whatever the truth actually is.  Even some very non-credible rumors on this board have speculated about eligibility issues.  I'm sure there is nothing at all to that as they have been refuted by more reliable sources, and I do not condone ridiculous rumormongering, but the mere fact that those thoughts are running around in people's minds could have been avoided with some better language and disclosure from the Hope basketball program, even if they stopped short of revealing the full details of the injury. 

PR principles state that honesty ("whole truth", not just the absence of falsehood) and "getting in front of the story" are important.  Now this week, we see two players vaporize from the published roster with no official explanation from the program.  Again, rampant speculation ensues.  The fact is that sometime stuff happens, and it can be uncomfortable and unpleasant to talk about.  But when you are in the public eye, you gotta be honest and forthcoming, otherwise rumors will swirl in the meantime and then the truth comes out eventually anyways. If this continues, in time the program will develop a reputation for being secretive and less than honest.  I am certainly not accusing Hope of being anything less than honest, but by being less than quick and forthcoming around several issues, it potentially could be perceived by the public that they are hiding something.  Unfortunately in this world, perception = reality.  Am I missing something?  Again, just a 3rd party observer here. 

"Enflame quite a bit of speculation"
"ridiculous rumormongering"
"the public eye"
"rampant speculation ensues"

I think you are overestimating the amount of interest in D3 basketball, as much as I hate to say that. You're overestimating even more the number of people on this board.

Of course, I had a hard time taking it seriously after I read "PR principles state that honesty ('whole truth', not just the absence of falsehood)..."

[hoopdreams]

Looks like Jon Schultz from the Holland sentinel has been reading the message boards again.  New article up about the recent transfers (vague) and Bunn not accompanying the team on its trip to Orlando

[gohope]

Here's the link that many of you have been waiting for:

http://www.hollandsentinel.com/sports/sports_hope/x1882973482/Two-Hope-mens-basketball-players-transfer

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Here's the link that many of you have been waiting for:

http://www.hollandsentinel.com/sports/sports_hope/x1882973482/Two-Hope-mens-basketball-players-transfer

haha, I guess patience was in order.  It seems that they have provided the proper amount of information to the public regarding these players.  Well done, Hope "PR"!   

[Dark Knight]

Today's games, according to Massey:

Hope 75 Lake Forest 70
Trine 76 Dominican IL 73

Both games close enough that they could either way: Hope with a 70% chance vs. Lake Forest, Trine with a 59% chance over Dominican.

---

Who verbs?

[sac]

A little basketball today.......

Orlando forecast
This Afternoon: Sunny, with a high near 69. West wind around 5 mph

The basketball forecast is a little more cloudy

Trine vs. Dominican, Ill. at RDV Sportsplex D3Classic (Orlando, Fla.), 3 p.m.   

Dominican comes in 6-4, but have won 4 of their last 5.  For this amateur D3ologist its been a mixed bag of results.  The schedule seems short on top-flight known teams, yet the one game they have vs such a squad they only lost by 7.

Trine is 7-2, haven't played the toughest schedule but they've won the games they should.  They probably should be getting a few votes in the top 25, there are teams with equal resume's and lower ranked schedules than Trine getting votes.

These two teams played last year at Dominican, and this happened  http://www.miaa.org/mbb/stats/0910/mbdutri1.htm  ........a 94-92 Triple OT thriller of a win for Trine.  Trine won the year before as well 68-61 in Angola

This is an in-region game.




Hope vs. Lake Forest, Ill. at RDV Sportsplex D3Classic (Orlando, Fla.), 5 p.m.


Lake Forest and Hope are actually old rivals......between 1953 and 1978, the Dutchmen and Foresters met 26 times, Hope holding a 20-6 edge.  For whatever reason their paths haven't crossed in 33 seasons of basketball.  This to me is one of those no brainer matchups (like Wheaton) that should happen more frequently.

This years Lake Forest is like Hope, just 3-4 and believe it or not have played very similar schedules in terms of strength.  The MWC season is well under way and LFC is 2-2.  In their most recent games, Lake Forest was crushed by North Central 82-44 and beaten by St. Norbert over the weekend by 18.  They have lost 3 in a row.

Two things stand out in the stats, they've had trouble scoring points, avg only 60 per game (although they've scored over 60 in all but one), and they've turned the ball over more than their opponents. 

6-5 Travis Clark is their leading scorer, shooting 63% from the field.  That should provide a nice challenge for an interior Hope defense that has been torched all season.  Mr. Clark will probably have a good day today.

This game falls under the 200 mile rule, and is in-region.  A very important game for Hope if the post-season becomes a reality.



As Dark Knight pointed out, these seem like close match-ups on paper.

[jspiii]

A little basketball today.......

Orlando forecast
This Afternoon: Sunny, with a high near 69. West wind around 5 mph

The basketball forecast is a little more cloudy

Trine vs. Dominican, Ill. at RDV Sportsplex D3Classic (Orlando, Fla.), 3 p.m.   

Dominican comes in 6-4, but have won 4 of their last 5.  For this amateur D3ologist its been a mixed bag of results.  The schedule seems short on top-flight known teams, yet the one game they have vs such a squad they only lost by 7.

Trine is 7-2, haven't played the toughest schedule but they've won the games they should.  They probably should be getting a few votes in the top 25, there are teams with equal resume's and lower ranked schedules than Trine getting votes.

These two teams played last year at Dominican, and this happened  http://www.miaa.org/mbb/stats/0910/mbdutri1.htm  ........a 94-92 Triple OT thriller of a win for Trine.  Trine won the year before as well 68-61 in Angola

This is an in-region game.




Hope vs. Lake Forest, Ill. at RDV Sportsplex D3Classic (Orlando, Fla.), 5 p.m.


Lake Forest and Hope are actually old rivals......between 1953 and 1978, the Dutchmen and Foresters met 26 times, Hope holding a 20-6 edge.  For whatever reason their paths haven't crossed in 33 seasons of basketball.  This to me is one of those no brainer matchups (like Wheaton) that should happen more frequently.

This years Lake Forest is like Hope, just 3-4 and believe it or not have played very similar schedules in terms of strength.  The MWC season is well under way and LFC is 2-2.  In their most recent games, Lake Forest was crushed by North Central 82-44 and beaten by St. Norbert over the weekend by 18.  They have lost 3 in a row.

Two things stand out in the stats, they've had trouble scoring points, avg only 60 per game (although they've scored over 60 in all but one), and they've turned the ball over more than their opponents. 

6-5 Travis Clark is their leading scorer, shooting 63% from the field.  That should provide a nice challenge for an interior Hope defense that has been torched all season.  Mr. Clark will probably have a good day today.

This game falls under the 200 mile rule, and is in-region.  A very important game for Hope if the post-season becomes a reality.



As Dark Knight pointed out, these seem like close match-ups on paper.

Any live stats or radio for this game?