MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[AndersDY]

95, 05, 06, and 07 are the only years with more than one MIAA team going to the NCAA since the MIAA started tournaments. 

Just jumping in here, but I had actually been looking over exactly that in the tournament program last night. I noticed that in each year Hope made the Final Four, there was a second tournament team that came out of the conference. You missed Albion in '98 and Kzoo in '96 as well.

It would be nice to get more chances for a second team getting Pool C, but I think we've had a lot of coverage on the geographic issues for our particular conference in terms of scheduling those helpful regional games.

[Gregory Sager]

I don't think the UAA has a conference tourney (there cost does seem to be a factor), but they often get multiple teams in the tourney. An interesting point of comparison perhaps.

The UAA is the only league in D3 that doesn't have a tourney, but, believe me, cost is not a factor. There are countries in Africa whose annual GDP does not equal the endowment of a UAA school.

And no, Greg's not joking. Wikipedia is reporting endowments in the billions for some UAA schools. 

Apples and oranges.

The schools obviously could all afford it, but their athletics budgets are often no bigger than most other d3 schools.

Au contraire, mon frere. You're forgetting that travel budgets (which for the UAA include airplane tickets, hotel rooms, road per diems, etc.) are a part of the athletics budget.

[Busted Stuff]

Let me know what you think, but this is my opinion:

I, unfortunately, think the fans that care about the change in the conference tournament are the ones that go to the type of game that is generally a first round game.  Joe Somebody who decides to stop by and watch any other regular game probably has no idea that this change in format is happening; ignorance is bliss!

I feel that the people that care about this change are the ones, albeit not necessarily a huge number, already in the seats.  They are some of the fans who write on this board and the ones who read this board.  It's hard to convince 'fans' to come to the games if they don't care enough about losing 4 teams in the tournament.

[Mr. Ypsi]

I don't think the UAA has a conference tourney (there cost does seem to be a factor), but they often get multiple teams in the tourney. An interesting point of comparison perhaps.

The UAA is the only league in D3 that doesn't have a tourney, but, believe me, cost is not a factor. There are countries in Africa whose annual GDP does not equal the endowment of a UAA school.

And no, Greg's not joking. Wikipedia is reporting endowments in the billions for some UAA schools. 

Apples and oranges.

The schools obviously could all afford it, but their athletics budgets are often no bigger than most other d3 schools.

Au contraire, mon frere. You're forgetting that travel budgets (which for the UAA include airplane tickets, hotel rooms, road per diems, etc.) are a part of the athletics budget.

I'm confused (not a new situation! )

I think you are making the same point I was.  IF they wanted to, the schools could easily absorb the costs of a tourney.  But since they only allow typical d3 athletics budgets, money MAY be indeed the reason for no tourney.  Am I missing something?

[KnightSlappy]

I don't think the UAA has a conference tourney (there cost does seem to be a factor), but they often get multiple teams in the tourney. An interesting point of comparison perhaps.

The UAA is the only league in D3 that doesn't have a tourney, but, believe me, cost is not a factor. There are countries in Africa whose annual GDP does not equal the endowment of a UAA school.

And no, Greg's not joking. Wikipedia is reporting endowments in the billions for some UAA schools. 

Apples and oranges.

The schools obviously could all afford it, but their athletics budgets are often no bigger than most other d3 schools.

Au contraire, mon frere. You're forgetting that travel budgets (which for the UAA include airplane tickets, hotel rooms, road per diems, etc.) are a part of the athletics budget.

I'm confused (not a new situation! )

I think you are making the same point I was.  IF they wanted to, the schools could easily absorb the costs of a tourney.  But since they only allow typical d3 athletics budgets, money MAY be indeed the reason for no tourney.  Am I missing something?

I think Greg was saying they don't allow typical d3 budgets because they spend tons of cash on airfare and hotels while traveling around the country for league games.

[sac]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

[KnightSlappy]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

You're talking quarterfinals right? My Calvin ticket cost $7 on Wednesday.

[sac]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

You're talking quarterfinals right? My Calvin ticket cost $7 on Wednesday.

Did you get the fancy chairbacks at Calvin?  I paid $5 but no chairbacks at Olivet, unless you count the wall behind my seat.

[KnightSlappy]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

You're talking quarterfinals right? My Calvin ticket cost $7 on Wednesday.

Did you get the fancy chairbacks at Calvin?  I paid $5 but no chairbacks at Olivet, unless you count the wall behind my seat.

Nope, lower bowl bleachers. I think it was all $7/$3 at Van Noord.

[oldknight]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

You're talking quarterfinals right? My Calvin ticket cost $7 on Wednesday.

Did you get the fancy chairbacks at Calvin?  I paid $5 but no chairbacks at Olivet, unless you count the wall behind my seat.

Nope, lower bowl bleachers. I think it was all $7/$3 at Van Noord.

Mr. and Mrs. Oldknight paid $14 for their two seats--without the chairbacks. They feel gouged. Maybe the extra two bucks per ticket was a kickback to the college presidents who voted for the wonderfully thought out, new four-team format.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Roughly 3,500 people paid for attendance to the semi-final games, either $5, $3 for MIAA faculty or zero for students with ID's.   If we're generous and say 500 students at the four sites total, maybe another 500 for faculty total, also generous.

A rough estimate figures the MIAA made around $12,000 on the tournament semi's in gate just on the men's side.  There is no way the cost of running four MIAA games in the gyms the schools own cost more than 12 grand with travel included.  When Neilson says the MIAA will lose money by dropping the quarterfinals of the two tournaments, I believe him.

You're talking quarterfinals right? My Calvin ticket cost $7 on Wednesday.

Did you get the fancy chairbacks at Calvin?  I paid $5 but no chairbacks at Olivet, unless you count the wall behind my seat.

Nope, lower bowl bleachers. I think it was all $7/$3 at Van Noord.

Mr. and Mrs. Oldknight paid $14 for their two seats--without the chairbacks. They feel gouged. Maybe the extra two bucks per ticket was a kickback to the college presidents who voted for the wonderfully thought out, new four-team format.

Wednesdays tickets at DeVos were $5 (all general admission).  Tonight's tickets (reserved seating) were $7.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Let me know what you think, but this is my opinion:

I, unfortunately, think the fans that care about the change in the conference tournament are the ones that go to the type of game that is generally a first round game.  Joe Somebody who decides to stop by and watch any other regular game probably has no idea that this change in format is happening; ignorance is bliss!

I feel that the people that care about this change are the ones, albeit not necessarily a huge number, already in the seats.  They are some of the fans who write on this board and the ones who read this board.  It's hard to convince 'fans' to come to the games if they don't care enough about losing 4 teams in the tournament.

Grey - nice post, and IMHO, spot on.  +k from me.  For me the bad part of this is not getting to have my favorite week of basketball:

Tue - Womens game
Wed - Mens game
Thu - Womens game
Fri - 2 Mens games
Sat - Womens game (afternoon), Mens game (evening)

Next year I'm sure I'll get stuck doing some kind of work around the house on Tue & Wed.     

[ziggy]

Let me know what you think, but this is my opinion:

I, unfortunately, think the fans that care about the change in the conference tournament are the ones that go to the type of game that is generally a first round game.  Joe Somebody who decides to stop by and watch any other regular game probably has no idea that this change in format is happening; ignorance is bliss!

I feel that the people that care about this change are the ones, albeit not necessarily a huge number, already in the seats.  They are some of the fans who write on this board and the ones who read this board.  It's hard to convince 'fans' to come to the games if they don't care enough about losing 4 teams in the tournament.

Grey - nice post, and IMHO, spot on.  +k from me.  For me the bad part of this is not getting to have my favorite week of basketball:

Tue - Womens game
Wed - Mens game
Thu - Womens game
Fri - 2 Mens games
Sat - Womens game (afternoon), Mens game (evening)

Next year I'm sure I'll get stuck doing some kind of work around the house on Tue & Wed.     

So it is as much about what you're not doing as what you're doing. I see where you're coming from!

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Let me know what you think, but this is my opinion:

I, unfortunately, think the fans that care about the change in the conference tournament are the ones that go to the type of game that is generally a first round game.  Joe Somebody who decides to stop by and watch any other regular game probably has no idea that this change in format is happening; ignorance is bliss!

I feel that the people that care about this change are the ones, albeit not necessarily a huge number, already in the seats.  They are some of the fans who write on this board and the ones who read this board.  It's hard to convince 'fans' to come to the games if they don't care enough about losing 4 teams in the tournament.

Grey - nice post, and IMHO, spot on.  +k from me.  For me the bad part of this is not getting to have my favorite week of basketball:

Tue - Womens game
Wed - Mens game
Thu - Womens game
Fri - 2 Mens games
Sat - Womens game (afternoon), Mens game (evening)

Next year I'm sure I'll get stuck doing some kind of work around the house on Tue & Wed.     

So it is as much about what you're not doing as what you're doing. I see where you're coming from!

Exactly!  In fact if it were up to me, the whole week should be declared a national holiday, no work (including at home), just basketball and discussing the possiblities on this board...

Back to reality   

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Sentinel article on the games tonight:

http://www.hollandsentinel.com/sports/x700951474/Fatigue-may-be-factor-in-MIAA-mens-basketball-semifinals