MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[KnightSlappy]

What was the change to the MIAA tourny again?

only the top 4 teams make it in.  it's pretty much an outrage.  i haven't heard any supporters of it

I'll speak in support of it. 

Having several times watched a last-place team drive across the state to get humbled, once more, by the first-place team . . . before the sparsest crowd of the season . . . and then to drive home late on a school night after one more defeat . . . I think the new four team playoff respects student-athletes as students.  Besides, how likely is it that a team that couldn't finish in the top half of its league would enjoy much success in the ensuing tournament?

The new playoff system also allows higher seeded teams to play all games on their home floor, and eliminates the chance of a playoff championship game held on neither's home floor (which was the case if the #1 seed lost of Friday night, but hosted the next night's game in a near-empty gym).

Is one less late night of travel really going to make that much of a difference to a college kid and his/her studies?


Your last paragraph I kind of agree with, but the men have been doing this tournament for 20 years and it seems like if the seeding, days of games and Championship site were ever a problem they've had plenty of opportunities to change the format to what the women have been doing for their 20 years.

I always liked that no matter how bad your season was, you always had hope for a turnaround. Even a potential 1-13 Olivet team could have **possibly** found themselves in the big dance and, who knows, even cutting down the nets in Salem. Would this ever really happen? No, but I liked the idea that it could have.

[Hopester]

What was the change to the MIAA tourny again?

only the top 4 teams make it in.  it's pretty much an outrage.  i haven't heard any supporters of it

I'll speak in support of it. 

Having several times watched a last-place team drive across the state to get humbled, once more, by the first-place team . . . before the sparsest crowd of the season . . . and then to drive home late on a school night after one more defeat . . . I think the new four team playoff respects student-athletes as students.  Besides, how likely is it that a team that couldn't finish in the top half of its league would enjoy much success in the ensuing tournament?

The new playoff system also allows higher seeded teams to play all games on their home floor, and eliminates the chance of a playoff championship game held on neither's home floor (which was the case if the #1 seed lost of Friday night, but hosted the next night's game in a near-empty gym).

Is one less late night of travel really going to make that much of a difference to a college kid and his/her studies?


Your last paragraph I kind of agree with, but the men have been doing this tournament for 20 years and it seems like if the seeding, days of games and Championship site were ever a problem they've had plenty of opportunities to change the format to what the women have been doing for their 20 years.

I always liked that no matter how bad your season was, you always had hope for a turnaround. Even a potential 1-13 Olivet team could have **possibly** found themselves in the big dance and, who knows, even cutting down the nets in Salem. Would this ever really happen? No, but I liked the idea that it could have.

The only question I would have in deciding if I like it or not is in regards to the primary criteria for NCAA selection. Hopefully either Sac or KS will have a decent idea.

Would there be more benefit from an in region win over a bad opponent, or more benefit of strengthening your OWP by not playing them? For instance, Hope playing Olivet a third time would give them there 16th or 17th in-region win this year, but it would have to give them a sizable drop off in OWP based on the small sample size.

[KnightSlappy]

The only question I would have in deciding if I like it or not is in regards to the primary criteria for NCAA selection. Hopefully either Sac or KS will have a decent idea.

Would there be more benefit from an in region win over a bad opponent, or more benefit of strengthening your OWP by not playing them? For instance, Hope playing Olivet a third time would give them there 16th or 17th in-region win this year, but it would have to give them a sizable drop off in OWP based on the small sample size.

I think for the most part a home game versus Olivet would hurt a team like Hope. If they're undefeated, the win doesn't help the WP, but the SOS would go down. Especially now that they're using the 0.75 multiplier on the SOS for home games. For seeding and/or Pool C chances, the #1 would probably rather not play that game. The answer might be more difficult for the #2 seed (who probably wouldn't have played semi's and finals at home).

[Happy Calvin Guy]

I always liked that no matter how bad your season was, you always had hope

, waiting to stomp you in the first round of the tourney.   

[HopeConvert]

Brian Van Ochten weighs in on Tournament chances of local teams, including Calvin women and Hope men:

http://www.mlive.com/smallcolleges/grandrapids/index.ssf/2012/01/pretender_or_contender_judging.html

And Alan Babbitt (no relation to Irving) weighs in on Hope:

http://www.hollandsentinel.com/sports/sports_hope/x1672347677/Alan-Babbitt-Hope-College-mens-basketball-has-willed-itself-to-become-national-title-contender

If a fair observation on his part, it would square with my own: that this Hope team has very good chemistry.

[almcguirejr]

Is a 29 point lead after 3 quarters safe in HS?

http://www.highschoolsports.net/sports/preps/basketball/story/2012-01-24/Indiana-team-wins-with-big-comeback/52773388/1

[DewCrewVett]

What was the change to the MIAA tourny again?

only the top 4 teams make it in.  it's pretty much an outrage.  i haven't heard any supporters of it

I'll speak in support of it. 

Having several times watched a last-place team drive across the state to get humbled, once more, by the first-place team . . . before the sparsest crowd of the season . . . and then to drive home late on a school night after one more defeat . . . I think the new four team playoff respects student-athletes as students.  Besides, how likely is it that a team that couldn't finish in the top half of its league would enjoy much success in the ensuing tournament?

The new playoff system also allows higher seeded teams to play all games on their home floor, and eliminates the chance of a playoff championship game held on neither's home floor (which was the case if the #1 seed lost of Friday night, but hosted the next night's game in a near-empty gym).

Is one less late night of travel really going to make that much of a difference to a college kid and his/her studies?


Your last paragraph I kind of agree with, but the men have been doing this tournament for 20 years and it seems like if the seeding, days of games and Championship site were ever a problem they've had plenty of opportunities to change the format to what the women have been doing for their 20 years.

I always liked that no matter how bad your season was, you always had hope for a turnaround. Even a potential 1-13 Olivet team could have **possibly** found themselves in the big dance and, who knows, even cutting down the nets in Salem. Would this ever really happen? No, but I liked the idea that it could have.

The only question I would have in deciding if I like it or not is in regards to the primary criteria for NCAA selection. Hopefully either Sac or KS will have a decent idea.

Would there be more benefit from an in region win over a bad opponent, or more benefit of strengthening your OWP by not playing them? For instance, Hope playing Olivet a third time would give them there 16th or 17th in-region win this year, but it would have to give them a sizable drop off in OWP based on the small sample size.

Ill speak positively for it too.

I think it gives a little more "purpose" to the regular season conference games. With only 4 teams advancing into a playoff tournament system, you're sending a message that you better perform for the length of a conference season rather than just putting together a little "hot streak" in the conference tournament. I am all for everyone getting a chance and the thought of a low seeded team winning is pretty cool, but every team is getting a shot, and their chance to prove they belong there is now. Dont you think the conference season should count for a little bit more than just the possibility of being called the "champion?"

I would defer to the veterans of this board as to whether a 7 or 8 seed as ever won the tournament championship, or had ever even been there.

[Civic Minded]

I always liked that no matter how bad your season was, you always had hope

, waiting to stomp you in the first round of the tourney.

Wasn't exactly what I was expecting from you HCG!    Iced tea nearly sprayed all over my monitor.  +k! 

[Hopester]

Wasn't exactly what I was expecting from you HCG!    Iced tea nearly sprayed all over my monitor.  +k! 

Did you have the blue sugar?

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Wasn't exactly what I was expecting from you HCG!    Iced tea nearly sprayed all over my monitor.  +k! 

Did you have the blue sugar?

And it has to be 3 packets

[Civic Minded]

Wasn't exactly what I was expecting from you HCG!    Iced tea nearly sprayed all over my monitor.  +k! 

Did you have the blue sugar?

Great...twice in one day!  <wipes monitor off again>   

[sac]

Wasn't exactly what I was expecting from you HCG!    Iced tea nearly sprayed all over my monitor.  +k! 

Did you have the blue sugar?

Great...twice in one day!  <wipes monitor off again>   

I heard it was a million.......

[sac]

And Alan Babbitt (no relation to Irving) weighs in on Hope:

http://www.hollandsentinel.com/sports/sports_hope/x1672347677/Alan-Babbitt-Hope-College-mens-basketball-has-willed-itself-to-become-national-title-contender

If a fair observation on his part, it would square with my own: that this Hope team has very good chemistry.

I'll have to wait a few days to read it, I've gone past my allotment of 15 free online articles for the month.   

[sac]

Saturday preview:  Second time through the league is always more interesting


Alma @ Hope -- Hope will be going for win number 38 in a row against the Scots.  Once again we have issues with the Hope archives.  The archives are missing the 2003, 2007 and 2008 MIAA tournament results

2003 Hope 101 Alma 75
2007 Hope 89 Alma 49
2008 Hope 75 Alma 51

Hope won this one comfortably 103-78 the first time, Alma's probably improved some since then but Hope figures to probably win this one in a  comfortable fashion.  Bonus:  It's Hope mascot Dutch's birthday and it will be a mascotpalooza.



Adrian @ Calvin --  Speaking of streaks the Bulldogs have a mini-streak of 3 in a row vs Calvin.  Adrian won the first meeting 68-61, both teams are probably a little better since then.  Adrian a little healthier, Calvin playing better.  Calvin has actually been a pretty good team at Van Noord.  Pretty big swing game in the standings.



Albion @ Olivet --  Olivet has been able to beat Albion once each of the last two seasons.  Albion needed a late rally to beat the Comets the last time.



Kzoo @ Trine --  These two have split the last couple years and have generally played pretty close games against each other.   Trine won the first game with a late push to pull away from the Hornets.   I think this is an absolute must win for Kalamazoo.  Brooks Miller will probably learn what his teams made of after two big losses last week.


**Last year we had 13 season splits out of the 28 series.

[sac]

I would defer to the veterans of this board as to whether a 7 or 8 seed as ever won the tournament championship, or had ever even been there.

If you plan on becoming a long term poster you should become acquainted with this site:
www.miaa.org   In fact every poster here should make this one of your regular stops.  The answer to your question is located there.
When you get to the site in the left column click on winter sports basketball M
On the next page you will have access to the Archives, and one of the items is all time records.
click on MIAA tournament results.  This will give you your answer, and serve as agood learning experience. 

Remember when the MIAA was down to 7 teams the MIAA champion got a bye the first round.

Quick and dirty

No 7 or 8 seed ever won an MIAA Tournament game.

Only one six ever advanced
Only five, five seeds advanced.

Until recently the fun always happened in the semi-finals.