MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[Pat Coleman]

We get pretty close:

http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Albion/Men/2012-13/index

[Chief]

I'm sure these names have been thrown out there already (and hopefully I'm not mistaken on any of these), but looks like Hope should have a pretty solid class if all these kids show up this weekend as expected:

Ben Gardner- Carmel, IN
Brock Benson -- Hinsdale South, IL
Alex Eidson -- Grand Haven
Matt Van Dyk - Imlay City
Zach Dreyer -- Zeeland W.
Jordan Denham --Southfield Lathrup
Jon Maas - Holland Chr.
Sam Otto - Wheaton No.

Jordan Denham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRNqY0Ni2r0

If you want an informative link that will just make you cringe, this one's for you.....but at least it has his stats
http://burneysbytes.blogspot.com/2012/06/air-jordan.html

Is Hope full NAIA or just provisional?

The dude got 3 out of 4 letters right - and two of them are even in the right location 

Unless I'm missing the joke isn't only one letter in the correct location? 

Couple of those guys were thinking Calvin until KVS decided to blow them off....wonder how many recruits he'll lose next year because of his "busy schedule"

Ladies and gentlemen, the 2012-2013 Hope College jv team...

[arena]

I'm sure these names have been thrown out there already (and hopefully I'm not mistaken on any of these), but looks like Hope should have a pretty solid class if all these kids show up this weekend as expected:

Ben Gardner- Carmel, IN
Brock Benson -- Hinsdale South, IL
Alex Eidson -- Grand Haven
Matt Van Dyk - Imlay City
Zach Dreyer -- Zeeland W.
Jordan Denham --Southfield Lathrup
Jon Maas - Holland Chr.
Sam Otto - Wheaton No.

Jordan Denham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRNqY0Ni2r0

If you want an informative link that will just make you cringe, this one's for you.....but at least it has his stats
http://burneysbytes.blogspot.com/2012/06/air-jordan.html

Is Hope full NAIA or just provisional?

The dude got 3 out of 4 letters right - and two of them are even in the right location 

Unless I'm missing the joke isn't only one letter in the correct location? 

Couple of those guys were thinking Calvin until KVS decided to blow them off....wonder how many recruits he'll lose next year because of his "busy schedule"

Well, maybe we won't have to worry about that next year.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Interesting find on the Mississppi College basketball schedule:

http://www.gochoctaws.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&

Friday 12/21/12 8:00pm vs Hope College at the RDV Sportsplex Classic

This is an IN REGION game for Hope.  Totally makes sense cause Mississippi is so close to Michigan (only Minnesota is between them)

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

[KnightSlappy]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

The complaint isn't ever that these games ARE in region, it's that Hope-Carthage, Calvin-Elmhurst, Calvin-Wheaton, etc. (4 hours by car) AREN'T also in-region.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

The complaint isn't ever that these games ARE in region, it's that Hope-Carthage, Calvin-Elmhurst, Calvin-Wheaton, etc. (4 hours by car) AREN'T also in-region.

B - I - N - G - O !!!!

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

I get that arguement... I hear it all the time on end... but here is the deal, it isn't changing and there isn't a solution just yet to make it work (though, the all-games-count-just-play-70%-in-region will help). Remember, this isn't unique to this area... there are teams all over the country that have games that seem close-by that aren't count as regional. But I remind you... since school presidents control things... helping Hope or Calvin pick up a couple of games in Illinois will have larger ramifications across the country and from the track record so far from school presidents... they aren't going to sign off on that kind of change.

[Pat Coleman]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

The complaint isn't ever that these games ARE in region, it's that Hope-Carthage, Calvin-Elmhurst, Calvin-Wheaton, etc. (4 hours by car) AREN'T also in-region.

Similarly, Johns Hopkins-Washington & Lee isn't in-region and a bunch of other games are the same for schools that live on the border between administrative regions. The good news is that the definition has been stable for about seven years now, although I'd still like to see "bordering states" thrown into the mix and I talked to an NCAA person about that again this summer.

[KnightSlappy]

I get that arguement... I hear it all the time on end... but here is the deal, it isn't changing and there isn't a solution just yet to make it work (though, the all-games-count-just-play-70%-in-region will help). Remember, this isn't unique to this area... there are teams all over the country that have games that seem close-by that aren't count as regional. But I remind you... since school presidents control things... helping Hope or Calvin pick up a couple of games in Illinois will have larger ramifications across the country and from the track record so far from school presidents... they aren't going to sign off on that kind of change.

I don't see how this will help things necessarily. It would actually discourage Calvin from continuing the MIAA-CCIW classic games with Wheaton/Carthage. (And discouraging these games is counter to NCAA D3 philosophy.)

I'd still like to see "bordering states" thrown into the mix and I talked to an NCAA person about that again this summer.

How did they receive/react to the inquiry?

[sac]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

The complaint isn't ever that these games ARE in region, it's that Hope-Carthage, Calvin-Elmhurst, Calvin-Wheaton, etc. (4 hours by car) AREN'T also in-region.

Well, if Hope is playing Miss College then we can assume IWU is as well.


Hope vs Miss College -- in region  863 miles   
Miss College vs Illinois Wesleyan  -- not in region  663 miles   
Hope vs Illinois Wesleyan  -- not in region   258 miles   

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Dave & Pat - I get that this is the way it is, it's been like this for seven years,  and this isn't unique to us.  I also get that neither of you are responsible for it - which makes me wonder why you seem to be defending it (or am I mis-interpreting your responses - if so please accept my apologies). 

What I don't get and will not accept is that these administrative regions are geographically ridiculous.  Any 2nd grade geography student can see that.   

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Wouldn't complain... it is a regional game for Hope... and you can find all kinds of long (14 hour by car) distances for regional games across the country (i.e. Maine to DC, Texas to Washington). It is what it is.

The complaint isn't ever that these games ARE in region, it's that Hope-Carthage, Calvin-Elmhurst, Calvin-Wheaton, etc. (4 hours by car) AREN'T also in-region.

Well, if Hope is playing Miss College then we can assume IWU is as well.


Hope vs Miss College -- in region  863 miles   
Miss College vs Illinois Wesleyan  -- not in region  663 miles   
Hope vs Illinois Wesleyan  -- not in region   258 miles   

Maybe we can get a school from Puerto Rico to come to that tournament and Hope can play them instead of IWU     

[sac]

Miss College had been one of D3's quiet elites for a number of years with several tournament appearances and trips to the Sweet 16.   http://www.gochoctaws.com/sports/2007/11/5/MBB_Statistics.aspx?path=mbball

Last year MC finished 9-16 following a 13-13 year in 2011.  Last year was their first losing season since 1988.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

I am not defending anything... I am simply laying down the groundwork and trying to help people better understand the rules. I have talked a ton with people at the NCAA, coaches, and others about everything you can imagine including geography and such... and I have learned a lot. So when I present the "other side" or the facts in the situation, I am simply presenting them.

I understand full well that changes like what you are asking are challenging simply because I know who is in charge of much of this... school presidents. They already opened up geography games to include the geographic districts of the NCAA (something that has been around FOREVER) and 200 miles... they are going to implement "all-games-count" with the 70% restriction (like 50% required to qualify for championship tournaments at this time)... etc. I don't expect them to open up much more. If they do the neighboring states idea, they open up a ton more games that can "count"... and maybe cause other ramifications we don't know about. Does it make sense to count those games? Sure... will they do it? In my experience, no.

Again... I am not defending... but I am trying to portray the other point of view and a better understanding of what is really going on from my years of having these discussions. By the way... the lines have to be drawn somewhere for regions and such... it is NEVER perfect... but when lines have to be drawn... things are never perfect.