MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[Flying Dutch Fan]

NCC always sets up its tourney this way, and has done so for many years. It may be "silly" from your point of view as an opposing fan, but the tourney isn't designed for opposing fans -- it's designed to meet the needs of North Central's men's and women's teams and fans.

So you are referring to the whopping 300 fans that attended last years Friday game, and the 275 that attended on Saturday?   

And I would feel excatly the same way were it held at Hope with 3000+ fans

[Gregory Sager]

NCC always sets up its tourney this way, and has done so for many years. It may be "silly" from your point of view as an opposing fan, but the tourney isn't designed for opposing fans -- it's designed to meet the needs of North Central's men's and women's teams and fans.

So you are referring to the whopping 300 fans that attended last years Friday game, and the 275 that attended on Saturday?   

And I would feel excatly the same way were it held at Hope with 3000+ fans

Hey, as I said before, I'm not defending North Central's tourney scheduling policy. I avoid the NCC Tipoff Tourney because of that scheduling policy, remember? I'm merely explaining why NCC does it that way. If you really want to take up the cudgel with someone who has both the interest and the willingness to defend NCC, Cardinals fan AndOne is always up for a little back-and-forth on CCIW Chat.

http://gbcol.edu/bbmens/index.php/schedule/

You might notice GB will be making two trips to Florida this winter, about 3 weeks apart.

Not to mention their first game is before DIII can begin practice.

Now if we can just figure out who Hope is playing in the North Park tournament???

North Park is wondering how you have Hope in their tournament.  North Park --No, North Central --Yes, potential Senior moment -- most definite

If they would post who is participating in the tournament I wouldn't make those mistakes - for all we know North Park IS one of the other teams 

North Park is scheduled to be at the Calvin tournament that same weekend so, if you're having a really BIG senior moment, you can save the drive and head to Knollcrest and perhaps you'll think you're at the North Central tournament.

Here's a handy color guide for anyone else whose eyes glaze over after reading the word "North" in connection with a CCIW institution: "Central" is red, "Park" is blue.

[KnightSlappy]

NCC always sets up its tourney this way, and has done so for many years. It may be "silly" from your point of view as an opposing fan, but the tourney isn't designed for opposing fans -- it's designed to meet the needs of North Central's men's and women's teams and fans.

So you are referring to the whopping 300 fans that attended last years Friday game, and the 275 that attended on Saturday?   

And I would feel excatly the same way were it held at Hope with 3000+ fans

Hey, as I said before, I'm not defending North Central's tourney scheduling policy. I avoid the NCC Tipoff Tourney because of that scheduling policy, remember? I'm merely explaining why NCC does it that way. If you really want to take up the cudgel with someone who has both the interest and the willingness to defend NCC, Cardinals fan AndOne is always up for a little back-and-forth on CCIW Chat.

http://gbcol.edu/bbmens/index.php/schedule/

You might notice GB will be making two trips to Florida this winter, about 3 weeks apart.

Not to mention their first game is before DIII can begin practice.

Now if we can just figure out who Hope is playing in the North Park tournament???

North Park is wondering how you have Hope in their tournament.  North Park --No, North Central --Yes, potential Senior moment -- most definite

If they would post who is participating in the tournament I wouldn't make those mistakes - for all we know North Park IS one of the other teams 

North Park is scheduled to be at the Calvin tournament that same weekend so, if you're having a really BIG senior moment, you can save the drive and head to Knollcrest and perhaps you'll think you're at the North Central tournament.

Here's a handy color guide for anyone else whose eyes glaze over after reading the word "North" in connection with a CCIW institution: "Central" is red, "Park" is blue.

Also a useful guide: "Central" is ahead by 15 points, "Park" is trailing by 15 points. 

[Pat Coleman]

About the number of regions, I haven't heard anything other than eight. There's also occasionally talk about eight regions for football -- trying to standardize all of the regions except for regional sports such as field hockey or ice hockey or (less regional than ever) lacrosse.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

I have heard nothing about expanding to more than 8... or cutting down. From conversations I have had, 8 will probably still be the number baring a shocking change in direction.

Further more, don't expect the regions to be completely even... it just can't happen. With the Northeast having the most teams and regions near them (East and Atlantic) having the least... I would expect most of the "movement" to be here; moving NE teams into the East and Atlantic.

The biggest "challenge" so far to the process is actually the directive from university presidents stating they want conference teams to be in the same region (expect, obviously, the UAA). This is going to be the tough part because to help with the Northeast, breaking teams into different regions despite being in the same conference makes the most sense (remember, conference games are automatically regional games, so there is no disadvantage to this). Hamilton, for example, moved from the East Region to the Northeast last season when they moved into the NESCAC. Considering Hamilton is located near Utica, NY in the middle of New York state... this move made NO sense. However, presidents apparently want to see conference schools ranked in the same region and not across several regions... but with conference expansion (look at the CAC in the Mid-Atlantic which will have two southern schools joining next season) across regions... getting conferences to fit into regions may not be the smartest move. Do your best to accommodate the idea, but be smart and don't make this be the ultimate determining factor.

Another thing where the presidents may be are coming from and where I do agree regional alignment needs to be done is where some conferences are set-up differently between men's and women's teams. The easiest example I can give you is from my neck of the woods with the CAC and the Landmark. In expansion and shrikage with these conferences over the last few years, schools have NOT moved from region to region to adjust to the conference they are leaving or entering (unlike what happened to Hamilton). In the original CAC, on the men's side it was in the Mid-Atlantic and on the women's side is was in the Atlantic. Now the majority of the men's teams are in the Mid-Atlantic and the majority are still in the Atlantic on the women's side, but not all teams. When the Landmark formed, it was split between the two regions, evenly on the men's side and lopsided on the women's, because no team shifted regions when the conference was formed.

I think getting conferences in the same regions on both the men's and women's side of the equation makes sense. How you do this in each example is up for debate and discussion especially when teams are in different regions to begin with.

Per Pat's point about the number of regions... I have heard indications of adding regions to other sports like lacrosse (which has just two regions and REALLY needs to have a minimum of four). I just don't expect basketball's number to change - I think 8 is the ultimate goal for regions.

Regionally realignment will certainly be a topic of discussion on Hoopsville and something I will concentrate on throughout the next season as I have heard indications that realignment will be put in place before the '13-'14 academic year.

[realist]

Did anyone else see the article in the GR Press about the NCAA requiring future Juco players that transfer must have completed their associates degree?   The sense I got from the article was the NCAA wants to make sure the student athletes are exactly that.  Students, and athletes.

[SKOT]

Did anyone else see the article in the GR Press about the NCAA requiring future Juco players that transfer must have completed their associates degree?   The sense I got from the article was the NCAA wants to make sure the student athletes are exactly that.  Students, and athletes.

The term student athlete is a sham.  If you actually look at the term, athlete is the noun and student is the adjective.  That seems sort of backwards to me.  When the NCAA coined the term in 1953, its sole purpose was to try obscure the employee/employer relationship between scholarship college athletes and their institutions.  The NCAA and its members didn't want to have to pay worker's comp benefits to the athletes injured while participating in sports.  After reading about the NCAA's motivation behind the term, it has made me think twice about using it. 

Here is a link to a decent read about the history of the term.  It starts on page 83 and is actually quite readable for a law journal. 

http://digital.law.washington.edu/dspace-law/bitstream/handle/1773.1/262/81washlrev71.pdf

[KnightSlappy]

Did anyone else see the article in the GR Press about the NCAA requiring future Juco players that transfer must have completed their associates degree?   The sense I got from the article was the NCAA wants to make sure the student athletes are exactly that.  Students, and athletes.

The term student athlete is a sham.  If you actually look at the term, athlete is the noun and student is the adjective.  That seems sort of backwards to me.

Why is it backward that the National Collegiate ATHLETIC Association would coin a phrase describing their ATHLETES as students?

[SKOT]

Did anyone else see the article in the GR Press about the NCAA requiring future Juco players that transfer must have completed their associates degree?   The sense I got from the article was the NCAA wants to make sure the student athletes are exactly that.  Students, and athletes.

The term student athlete is a sham.  If you actually look at the term, athlete is the noun and student is the adjective.  That seems sort of backwards to me.

Why is it backward that the National Collegiate ATHLETIC Association would coin a phrase describing their ATHLETES as students?

I don't think the NCAA (the organization itself and not its member institutions) using it is backwards, but it doesn't fit in the majority of places that it is commonly used (jr. high, high school and non-scholarship collegiate athletes.)  In these cases, something closer to athletic students or athlete-students would be a more accurate depiction. 

I find it tough to use a term that was blatantly created to avoid rightfully compensating athletes that were harmed while performing for their schools. 

[sac]

added Albion to complete the list

Schedule links in one handy place

Adrian:  http://www.adrianbulldogs.com/sports/m-baskbl/2012-13/schedule
*Albion:   http://www.albion.edu/sports/mens-sports/basketball/schedule/flat/date/2012-11-01
Alma:  http://www.goalmascots.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Calvin:  http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mens/basketball/schedule.htm
Hope:  http://www.hope.edu/athletics/mbb/
Kalamazoo:  http://www.kzoo.edu/sports/mb/mb12-13/mbschd12-13.html
Olivet:  http://www.olivetcomets.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Trine:  http://www.trine.edu/athletics/mens_sports/basketball/schedule/

Alternate Albion schedule link ( ie less work for your finger )
* Albion:  http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Albion/Men/2012-13/index

[HopeConvert]

Did anyone else see the article in the GR Press about the NCAA requiring future Juco players that transfer must have completed their associates degree?   The sense I got from the article was the NCAA wants to make sure the student athletes are exactly that.  Students, and athletes.

The term student athlete is a sham.  If you actually look at the term, athlete is the noun and student is the adjective.  That seems sort of backwards to me.

Why is it backward that the National Collegiate ATHLETIC Association would coin a phrase describing their ATHLETES as students?

Well, if we've learned anything over the past months it is that the relationship between the NCAA and member universities is, at best, a distorted one. But most universities have sold their souls on this score.

[13wapiti]

Albion's exhibition with Division I Oakland on 9 November is considered Oakland's season opening game according to their website.


http://www.ougrizzlies.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/083112aab.html

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yep... bit of a loophole... D1 can have those games count... D3 have then as exhibitions. About the only place you can find where a came counts for one team... but doesn't for another (stats can be a bit strange ).

[KnightSlappy]

As of last week, Hope was still looking to find one more game for this upcoming season.

Hope College is still in need of ONE team for either our Dec.7/8 2012 tournament in HOLLAND, MI or our Dec.21/22, 2012 tournament in ORLANDO,FLORIDA.  Please contact Matt Neil at neil@hope.edu OR 616-403-5291.

In my unlearned estimation, it appears that more teams are having difficulty filling their schedule this year than in past years. I wonder why that is? Makes it tough to find quality regional games when you're simply trying to get ANY game.

[Pat Coleman]

I think in general over the pat 6-8 years there have been so many teams looking to host new tournaments that there are not enough to go around.