MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[HOPEful]

While I'm not always happy with Hope College victories, I sure do appreciate the posts on this board by many Hope supports. As Pointlem posted the other day, thanks to all who contribute positively, insightfully, and enthusiastically to D3 Boards. I'm sorry the division III season always seems to end so soon (the division I national tournament starts (generally -- I know last year was an exception) about the time the division III tournament ends, and hs boys basketball is still going on), I'll also miss reading the posts here. Blessings.

Ah, the conflicted feelings of rooting for/against your bitter rival come tournament time. During the season, I occasionally find myself streaming Calvin games and rooting for the "other team"... However, come the NCAA tournament, I am conflicted. Every Calvin win is good for the MIAA, and if I am truly honest with myself, them beating Washington in St. Louis made me happy (and after saying that, I feel like I need to take a shower)...

Still, the thought of sending my children to Holland Christian and cheering for the "Maroons" gives me the heebie jeebies... Guess we'll deal with that one when the time comes

Not necessarily you, setheater, but can someone please explain that statement that I put in bold in your post.  I hear that all the time.  Explain to me how Calvin beating Washington is good for the MIAA.  How did Alma get any benefit out of that win, for example?  Recruits going to start pouring in?

I hear it all the time with Division I as well.  I'm a UM fan and get all kinds of grief from my State fans as to why I don't root for them in the NCAA tournament.  "Every time State wins, it's good for the Big 10" is what I always hear.  I always respond by asking how it benefits Iowa if Michigan State goes to the Final Four.  I can see how it might benefit State directly, but not other schools.  If I am a recruit, I'm looking at academics, facilities, playing time, coaching staff, and history of putting players in the NBA at that school, not whether or not their rival made the Sweet 16 the last couple of years or how the conference might be perceived nationally.

National perpective. No, recruits won't start pouring into Alma or Olivet. But a win like that is remembered. Look at MIAA football. When your conference consistantly loses their first playoff game, you start getting paired with the Whitewaters and Mt. Unions of the world.

Back to basketball, if your conference is consistantly making runs in the playoffs and beating high caliber opponents, it is remembered. And from a national, division 3 perspective, it is hard to think about Calvin or Hope without at least considering the other. Is it really impossible to imagine a committee member remembering Calvin's win at Washington while considering Pool C bids or host options in years to come?

[HOPEful]

Like perhaps an MIAA will get host over a seemingly, more qualified CCIW team?

[sac]

While I'm not always happy with Hope College victories, I sure do appreciate the posts on this board by many Hope supports. As Pointlem posted the other day, thanks to all who contribute positively, insightfully, and enthusiastically to D3 Boards. I'm sorry the division III season always seems to end so soon (the division I national tournament starts (generally -- I know last year was an exception) about the time the division III tournament ends, and hs boys basketball is still going on), I'll also miss reading the posts here. Blessings.

Ah, the conflicted feelings of rooting for/against your bitter rival come tournament time. During the season, I occasionally find myself streaming Calvin games and rooting for the "other team"... However, come the NCAA tournament, I am conflicted. Every Calvin win is good for the MIAA, and if I am truly honest with myself, them beating Washington in St. Louis made me happy (and after saying that, I feel like I need to take a shower)...

Still, the thought of sending my children to Holland Christian and cheering for the "Maroons" gives me the heebie jeebies... Guess we'll deal with that one when the time comes

Not necessarily you, setheater, but can someone please explain that statement that I put in bold in your post.  I hear that all the time.  Explain to me how Calvin beating Washington is good for the MIAA.  How did Alma get any benefit out of that win, for example?  Recruits going to start pouring in?

I hear it all the time with Division I as well.  I'm a UM fan and get all kinds of grief from my State fans as to why I don't root for them in the NCAA tournament.  "Every time State wins, it's good for the Big 10" is what I always hear.  I always respond by asking how it benefits Iowa if Michigan State goes to the Final Four.  I can see how it might benefit State directly, but not other schools.  If I am a recruit, I'm looking at academics, facilities, playing time, coaching staff, and history of putting players in the NBA at that school, not whether or not their rival made the Sweet 16 the last couple of years or how the conference might be perceived nationally.

In D1 its all about money and perceived prestige.  A stronger more successful conference ='s more money on the next television deal. 

In D3 its more passive but I think a conferences perception is still significant.  If you need any more evidence look at the regional rankings and pairings of the HCAC and OAC the last few years.  These are conferences that have generally struggled in the NCAA tournament for most of the last decade.  Or the PAC and AMCC which can barely get an ounce of respect in the regional polls, mostly due to very little success in the tournament.

[sac]

I agree that these sorts of sentiments tend to get overblown, but when the committee chairperson starts throwing out terms like "tournament history" and "eye test" and whatnot, it could help MIAA teams get selection / seeding preference down the road. Maybe not. But maybe. It certainly doesn't hurt the MIAA in the future.

Like perhaps an MIAA will get host over a seemingly, more qualified CCIW team?

Gosh almighty you are terrible at quoting.  Perhaps Pat could have a summer correspondence course on message board quoting.   

[calvinite]

Not necessarily you, setheater, but can someone please explain that statement that I put in bold in your post.  I hear that all the time.  Explain to me how Calvin beating Washington is good for the MIAA.  How did Alma get any benefit out of that win, for example?  Recruits going to start pouring in?

I don't know about cheering for your rival -- I never did this before but have recently 'pulled' for the Hope to do well outside of the MIAA but would not be able to do so in a national championship game -- but I certainly have both figuratively and literally cheered for other MIAA teams to do well for the prestige it brings the MIAA, along with the better rankings if those other MIAA teams are ranked, not to mention the fact that 'my team' is likely to be better prepared for the tournament if they've had some tough games in the MIAA.

I was really disappointed in Adrian this year. Adrian's success prior to this year not only made the MIAA race more exciting, but was good for the league, I think. I hope Adrian can turn things around next year.

[HOPEful]

Is there a manual? Maybe a training seminar?

[Happy Calvin Guy]

Look at MIAA football.

MIAA has football?

[HopeConvert]

Apropos of nothing, really, other than the start of the DI tournament. I was watching the UM/MSU game on Sunday with another Hopie and was lamenting that too much emphasis gets placed on these post-season tournaments. Hope had a better season this year than I expected they would, and all that seems tarnished by the eggs they laid in their last two games. It makes it difficult to appreciate the season for what it was. At the same time, Calvin's last 3 games varnished what might be considered a rather disappointing season for the Knights. I enjoy these tournaments, but they are only tournaments and nothing more, really. I would prefer a system that highlights the importance of regular-season conference play, and would take winning the conference over the course of a grueling season to be the desideratum, and measure of success. The problem with tournament basketball is that only one team feels good when it's all done. I'm not an "every-kid-a-winner" type of person, but I do appreciate the value of winning your conference and beating your arch-rival, and think these things should count for more than so-called "National Championships."

Don't get me started on football. I'm a fan of the old bowl system on that one. The BCS championship (often miscalled a "national championship") just keeps getting worse.

[gohope]

Question:

Is the Men's Final being televised or just video streamed?  Is there a time for the game?  Can't seem to find that info.  Thanks in advance for the help! 

[HOPEful]

Don't get me started on football. I'm a fan of the old bowl system on that one. The BCS championship (often miscalled a "national championship") just keeps getting worse.

Keeps getting worse!? How can you argue that a committee panel with Condoleezza Rice on it isn't a better system then one that is made up of (at least partially) quanititive metrics...

[almcguirejr]

Question:

Is the Men's Final being televised or just video streamed?  Is there a time for the game?  Can't seem to find that info.  Thanks in advance for the help! 

D III championship game is on CBS sports network at 5:30 EDT.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Question:

Is the Men's Final being televised or just video streamed?  Is there a time for the game?  Can't seem to find that info.  Thanks in advance for the help! 

D III championship game is on CBS sports network at 5:30 EDT.

Awesome!!  Even the Buckeyes will be able to watch that game

[gohope]

Question:

Is the Men's Final being televised or just video streamed?  Is there a time for the game?  Can't seem to find that info.  Thanks in advance for the help! 

D III championship game is on CBS sports network at 5:30 EDT.

Thanks Al! 

[almcguirejr]

Apropos of nothing, really, other than the start of the DI tournament. I was watching the UM/MSU game on Sunday with another Hopie and was lamenting that too much emphasis gets placed on these post-season tournaments. Hope had a better season this year than I expected they would, and all that seems tarnished by the eggs they laid in their last two games. It makes it difficult to appreciate the season for what it was. At the same time, Calvin's last 3 games varnished what might be considered a rather disappointing season for the Knights. I enjoy these tournaments, but they are only tournaments and nothing more, really. I would prefer a system that highlights the importance of regular-season conference play, and would take winning the conference over the course of a grueling season to be the desideratum, and measure of success. The problem with tournament basketball is that only one team feels good when it's all done. I'm not an "every-kid-a-winner" type of person, but I do appreciate the value of winning your conference and beating your arch-rival, and think these things should count for more than so-called "National Championships."

Don't get me started on football. I'm a fan of the old bowl system on that one. The BCS championship (often miscalled a "national championship") just keeps getting worse.

I think Calvin's season began to turn with their win at Trine on Feb 15.  They were behind the entire second half until Tyler Kruis hit a 3 with 34 seconds to go.  Trine was a pretty good team and and to come back against them when it looked like a certain defeat was very important. Jordan Daley had a very good second half.  He appeared to have lost confidence in some games prior to that.  The last regular season game against Albion also stands out for how good Calvin was defensively in that game.  It was a preview of what was to come.  It maybe wasn't apparent at the time but Calvin was playing better and it was more than just the last 3 games that they played well. 


I agree with you on the old bowl system and would also like to go back to the real Big 10, Big 8, Pac 10, etc.

[sac]

On the other hand, I don't miss bowl invitations being handed out in early October.