MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[oldknight]

Uh,...... you have to see the end of the Adrian/Kalamazoo game.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUv4D8qVz4E    Fwd to about 1:45:00  you'll have to endure a few timouts.

Pay special attention to the Adrian in-bounds after the technical foul shot and the referee's hand signals.......and watch to the end.  Brutal.

Brutal indeed, particularly by the trailing official who "corrected" the baseline official's ruling that the inbounds pass had been knocked out by the Kalamazoo defender. Not only is it clear on the video that the Kalamazoo player hit it out, but the players on both teams knew the initial call was correct. You can see everyone quickly lining up (without complaint from Kalamazoo) for a second inbounds pass by Adrian.

Your post does mistakenly mention a "technical foul" when the call leading to the winning free throws was for the Adrian defender trying to squeeze his way through the double screen while the made three pointer was in the air. That call was debateable too, though not as horrific as the overrule on the baseline.

There was a technical foul on DaVonte Harris for calling a timeout when they had none.   And the baseline play was reversed because the in-bounder should have been stationary, even though the official signaled he could run the baseline.  The referee comes from way out at midcourt to overturn the play, just bizarre.

And yeah that last foul was debatable and as one person told me, "at that point haven't you done enough damage just let it go".

pbp  http://miaa.org/sports/mbkb/2016-17/boxscores/20170125_060v.xml?view=plays

That whole sequence is the final 9 seconds of the game.

A close friend of mine is an official (does both high school and college) and he heard about this. It seems the news of the fiasco raced through the officiating association and my friend asked me to send him the video link which I did. Here's his verbatim take on it.

Okay, I will attempt to address this wild and wooly situation that I hope never to experience.

•         Excessive time out is an administrative technical foul in college and a team technical in high school.  Men's college rules are different then women's college and high school.  1 technical foul (2 for women and high school) is awarded and the restart is the point of interruption (women is the same restart, but high school ball is awarded to non-offending team at mid court).  Adrian was in possession of the ball when time out was called, therefore restart is throw in at designated spot.  The ball was in the corner and potentially could have been inbound from the sideline vs the base line.  You are correct, that running the base line is not allowed.  It appears that the official informed the player he could run the baseline.  That was an error; however, once the ball is passed and legally touched, the error can no longer be corrected and the official has egg on his face for "misapplication of the rules".  In my opinion, a violation shouldn't have been called because it was too late to make a correction.  If one of the officials not inbounding the ball blew his whistle while the player was running the baseline, the play could have been stopped, a discussion by the officials could have taken place and the throw in correctly administrated without a violation being called. In my opinion, once the ball has been inbounded (or as I stated previously, "legally touched"), it is no longer fixable and a violation should not be called.  We always talk about primary and secondary coverage area.  The inbounding official's primary responsibility is the throw in and is responsible for the thrower and any defender that may be on the base line.  The other 2 officials have different primary responsibilities during the throw in, but can make a call if they see something in their secondary coverage area.  In this case, the official coming to talk with the inbounding official was appropriate.  I just have a problem calling a violation after the ball became dead.  If the other official blew the whistle after the ball was inbounded, a discussion should occur, no violation called and no time put back on the clock, inbound the ball again and make dang sure everyone knows it is at the designated spot. 
•         Regarding which official inbounds the ball after a technical – once again, mechanics for college men, women and high school are different as to where the foul calling official ends up after reporting.  For a non-technical foul, men's mechanics is to go opposite table while women's and high school is to stay table side.  For technical fouls it would be unusual for the calling official to inbound the ball.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Well, I sure hope he (KVS) does a better job in all his other responsibilities than he does on his primary one as men's basketball coach.
Perhaps Wed. night's defeat to Hope can be placed on his being "preoccupied" with his other responsibilities.  His NCAA duties must have clouded his thinking when he pulled 3 starters with a 12-6 lead which. using his own word, "unraveled".  Some of us think he should concentrate on his primary job, and drop the extracurricular activities if 10-15 seasons are the result.

Yes, Calvin has set the bar very high.  President Le Roy has repeatedly said that he expects "excellence" in all areas of campus life.  He expects excellence in the class room, as well as on the playing field or court.  Most coaches would kill for the physical plant, and all the other things that Calvin has to offer potential student athletes.  16-12, 13-13, and 10-15 may be excellent where you are from, but not so much here.

It is John Ross, not Jeff.  Since you are big on facts.

So sorry I misstated the former women's coaches name... I am sure you can understand with the number of coaches names in my head where I might make the mistake, right?

And by the way, I'm pretty sure he wasn't thinking about SOS numbers when coaching his team. He had 3 20+ win seasons when basically doing the same job. Two of those 20+ win seasons he was on the national committee and one he was on the regional committee. I have had a lot of coaches tell me it is a lot of work, but that they make sure their coaching is not affected. I know Kevin Vande Streek doesn't want this job to affect him and his coaching, thus why the school made arrangements to help him. All you have to do is look at the women's side of the equation to notice that more than half of the committee had to be off the call for selections and bracketing because they had successful teams. Being on the committee and it affecting a team is not a correlation that has added up.

And Sager makes another good point about the rest... I know for a fact that his coaching brethren wanted him to chair this year. You don't have that request unless you are respected by your peers and you wouldn't be in that position if you weren't respected by your institution.

As a Calvin fan I would prefer the 20+ win "successful team" seasons.

It is nice to have that high a bar... but let's also be realistic... you can't always have 20+ win seasons, even the best teams in the country can't always get that. My personal opinion is the win-totals mean less than the overall experience of the student. Fan's expectations of 20+ win seasons take a major back-seat to a lot of other priorities and thus calling for a coach's job because not enough games are won - especially at Division III - feels petty to me.

[realist]

Well, I sure hope he (KVS) does a better job in all his other responsibilities than he does on his primary one as men's basketball coach.
Perhaps Wed. night's defeat to Hope can be placed on his being "preoccupied" with his other responsibilities.  His NCAA duties must have clouded his thinking when he pulled 3 starters with a 12-6 lead which. using his own word, "unraveled".  Some of us think he should concentrate on his primary job, and drop the extracurricular activities if 10-15 seasons are the result.

Yes, Calvin has set the bar very high.  President Le Roy has repeatedly said that he expects "excellence" in all areas of campus life.  He expects excellence in the class room, as well as on the playing field or court.  Most coaches would kill for the physical plant, and all the other things that Calvin has to offer potential student athletes.  16-12, 13-13, and 10-15 may be excellent where you are from, but not so much here.

It is John Ross, not Jeff.  Since you are big on facts.

So sorry I misstated the former women's coaches name... I am sure you can understand with the number of coaches names in my head where I might make the mistake, right?

And by the way, I'm pretty sure he wasn't thinking about SOS numbers when coaching his team. He had 3 20+ win seasons when basically doing the same job. Two of those 20+ win seasons he was on the national committee and one he was on the regional committee. I have had a lot of coaches tell me it is a lot of work, but that they make sure their coaching is not affected. I know Kevin Vande Streek doesn't want this job to affect him and his coaching, thus why the school made arrangements to help him. All you have to do is look at the women's side of the equation to notice that more than half of the committee had to be off the call for selections and bracketing because they had successful teams. Being on the committee and it affecting a team is not a correlation that has added up.

And Sager makes another good point about the rest... I know for a fact that his coaching brethren wanted him to chair this year. You don't have that request unless you are respected by your peers and you wouldn't be in that position if you weren't respected by your institution.

As a Calvin fan I would prefer the 20+ win "successful team" seasons.

It is nice to have that high a bar... but let's also be realistic... you can't always have 20+ win seasons, even the best teams in the country can't always get that. My personal opinion is the win-totals mean less than the overall experience of the student. Fan's expectations of 20+ win seasons take a major back-seat to a lot of other priorities and thus calling for a coach's job because not enough games are won - especially at Division III - feels petty to me.

Why is that you continue to equate a mediocre W/L record with "overall experience of the student"? 
There is no doubt in my mind that for the students involved in all 8 of KVS's 20 or more wins seasons their "experience" was vastly superior to that "experienced" by members of the 16-12; 13-13, and especially the 10-15 team. 
The only thing that lowered expectation brings is mediocre performance. 
I have never spoken with a student-athlete that thought winning whatever game they played diminished the "overall experience".

You can sleep soundly tonight.  I am totally happy/petty expecting Calvin to win 20 games a season.
The attendance the other night at the VNA is shown as 3527.   Guess I have a lot of company in not being so happy with what is happening at Calvin.

[almcguirejr]

Tony DeWitte rescues Calvin!

[maroonandgold]

Tony DeWitte rescues Calvin!

I really like this team!  They are not the most talented ever, but they have great heart and really came from behind with a total team effort.  Tony definitely played the key role with his great shooting when they really needed it, but the whole team really pulled together to come from behind and then to hold the lead in the last minute.  Cam Denney and Michael Welch showed great senior leadership with their rebounding, blocks, and some key scores, too.

[iwumichigander]

Well, I sure hope he (KVS) does a better job in all his other responsibilities than he does on his primary one as men's basketball coach.
Perhaps Wed. night's defeat to Hope can be placed on his being "preoccupied" with his other responsibilities.  His NCAA duties must have clouded his thinking when he pulled 3 starters with a 12-6 lead which. using his own word, "unraveled".  Some of us think he should concentrate on his primary job, and drop the extracurricular activities if 10-15 seasons are the result.

Yes, Calvin has set the bar very high.  President Le Roy has repeatedly said that he expects "excellence" in all areas of campus life.  He expects excellence in the class room, as well as on the playing field or court.  Most coaches would kill for the physical plant, and all the other things that Calvin has to offer potential student athletes.  16-12, 13-13, and 10-15 may be excellent where you are from, but not so much here.

It is John Ross, not Jeff.  Since you are big on facts.

So sorry I misstated the former women's coaches name... I am sure you can understand with the number of coaches names in my head where I might make the mistake, right?

And by the way, I'm pretty sure he wasn't thinking about SOS numbers when coaching his team. He had 3 20+ win seasons when basically doing the same job. Two of those 20+ win seasons he was on the national committee and one he was on the regional committee. I have had a lot of coaches tell me it is a lot of work, but that they make sure their coaching is not affected. I know Kevin Vande Streek doesn't want this job to affect him and his coaching, thus why the school made arrangements to help him. All you have to do is look at the women's side of the equation to notice that more than half of the committee had to be off the call for selections and bracketing because they had successful teams. Being on the committee and it affecting a team is not a correlation that has added up.

And Sager makes another good point about the rest... I know for a fact that his coaching brethren wanted him to chair this year. You don't have that request unless you are respected by your peers and you wouldn't be in that position if you weren't respected by your institution.

As a Calvin fan I would prefer the 20+ win "successful team" seasons.

It is nice to have that high a bar... but let's also be realistic... you can't always have 20+ win seasons, even the best teams in the country can't always get that. My personal opinion is the win-totals mean less than the overall experience of the student. Fan's expectations of 20+ win seasons take a major back-seat to a lot of other priorities and thus calling for a coach's job because not enough games are won - especially at Division III - feels petty to me.

Why is that you continue to equate a mediocre W/L record with "overall experience of the student"? 
There is no doubt in my mind that for the students involved in all 8 of KVS's 20 or more wins seasons their "experience" was vastly superior to that "experienced" by members of the 16-12; 13-13, and especially the 10-15 team. 
The only thing that lowered expectation brings is mediocre performance. 
I have never spoken with a student-athlete that thought winning whatever game they played diminished the "overall experience".

You can sleep soundly tonight.  I am totally happy/petty expecting Calvin to win 20 games a season.
The attendance the other night at the VNA is shown as 3527.   Guess I have a lot of company in not being so happy with what is happening at Calvin.

I do not think Dave is equating a medicore W/L season with student experience.  Whether a 20+ or 20- season, the focus in D3 is STUDENT experience not athlete.  This is what he is saying.  Yes. A 20+ season can be more fun for the athlete and all involved including the fans but not at the expense of grades, graduating or student life. 

[oldknight]

After a decent start (an 18-12 lead), Calvin's offense went dormant, scoring a paltry 13 point the next 18 minutes of the game, falling behind 47-32, midway through the second half. At that point Jordan Brink, who had been absent from Van Noord Arena for a very long time, made his entrance in the uniform of Tony DeWitte going el fuego, scoring 14 of Calvin's next 15 points over a four minute stretch, to get the Knights back in the game. Meanwhile, Trine went cold (partly the result of a change in Calvin defensive strategy), and the home team outscored the visitors from Angola 20-2 to take a 53-49 lead. Trine came back to score the next four but Welch made a pretty move past Cummings to give the Knights a lead they would never relinquish. A huge victory for Calvin who now effectively has a three game lead over the Thunder for placing in the post season tournament. Other game notes:

--This may have been the coming out party for DeWitte who—after an indifferent first half (0-3 from the floor) went 7-8 after the break, bagging 19 points. He freed up himself in a variety of ways, combining clever back cuts with the kind of perimeter shooting Calvin fans have been looking for from the frosh from Grandville. I almost felt sorry for the Trine defender who didn't seem to know where the next shot was coming from. It was a clinic by DeWitte, and the kind of performance not seen at VNA since Brink single-handedly hoisted the  Knights on his shoulders the last five minutes of the conference final against Hope a couple of years ago. Great stuff to watch.

--Possibly the most humorous moment in VNA history (admittedly a low bar) occurred with just over six minutes left, when the red hot freshmen completed a four point play and then—to the great dismay of Calvin fans—was removed for a well-earned breather. It's good thing the 2nd Amendment isn't well respected on the Knollcrest Campus (though pitchforks were sighted) because the loud rebellion from the home crowd was enough to cause the Calvin bench turn and look. One smart-aleck endzone spectator piped up by saying "Hey Tony, just go over to the scorer's table and check back in; Kevin won't notice." The banter led to more than a few chuckles from the normally dour assembled Calvinists. In what may have been a response to whoever that endzone smart aleck was, KVS mentioned in his post-game interview that Tony came out because he was so tired he couldn't defend anymore on the other end.

[shknowsbest]

great win by calvin,  the 2 frosh really did a great job!  The officials were very one sided toward trine, they kept calling rinky dink fouls on calvin especially wilks, while they let Cummings go over the back numerous times.   Tony Canonie did an outstanding job on Dixon, holding him to 2-15 fg and than making 3 fts to seal the game.  Great win and a nice bounce back from the bad loss to hope.

[oldknight]

great win by calvin,  the 2 frosh really did a great job!  The officials were very one sided toward trine, they kept calling rinky dink fouls on calvin especially wilks, while they let Cummings go over the back numerous times.   Tony Canonie did an outstanding job on Dixon, holding him to 2-15 fg and than making 3 fts to seal the game.  Great win and a nice bounce back from the bad loss to hope.

Yeah, I should have mentioned that. It was truly a spectacular defensive performance by Canonie. In 37 minutes of court action, Dixon only broke down Tony once off the dribble. Other than that, Dixon couldn't breathe. I was told that after last Saturday's game against Adrian, Javonte Harris told Canonie that Tony's defense was the best played against Javonte in his time at Adrian.

[almcguirejr]

Tony DeWitte rescues Calvin!

I really like this team!  They are not the most talented ever, but they have great heart and really came from behind with a total team effort.  Tony definitely played the key role with his great shooting when they really needed it, but the whole team really pulled together to come from behind and then to hold the lead in the last minute.  Cam Denney and Michael Welch showed great senior leadership with their rebounding, blocks, and some key scores, too.

I thought Welch played a very good game.  He had 4 assists to DeWitte during DeWitte's personal 12 point run.  He has been a very solid and dependable player for Calvin.

Cam Denney is an excellent rebounder and can be a very good passer.  He is a liability when he gets the ball on offense and holds it, and then dribbles, and then twists, turns and throws something at the rim that he feels is a good shot.  He was 2-14 today today. He was 1-10 against Kalamazoo.  It was the same stuff that night.

Tony Canonie's block of a Will Dixon drive late in the second half was a great play.  Dixon drove the right side and attempted a shot,  Canonie got his hand on top of the ball before it was released, and the force of the block drove Dixon to the floor. It was an impressive play by Canonie!

Canonie has been the primary defender on Adrian's Davonte Harris, Hope's Dante Hawkins, and Trine's Will Dixon in Calvin's last 3 games.  He has held them to a combined 12-42 shooting the ball.

[realist]

great win by calvin,  the 2 frosh really did a great job!  The officials were very one sided toward trine, they kept calling rinky dink fouls on calvin especially wilks, while they let Cummings go over the back numerous times.   Tony Canonie did an outstanding job on Dixon, holding him to 2-15 fg and than making 3 fts to seal the game.  Great win and a nice bounce back from the bad loss to hope.

Hold on a second.  The game I watched had Calvin blowing an early lead 18-12 (6 points, like we haven't seen that before).
A.  Calvin never should have blown the lead.  How many times do some of you have to see this before it dawns on you that blowing a lead is not a " great" idea. Have you already forgotten the "painful" lesson we learned from Hope 101 Wed. night?
B.  Managing to come back from a 15 point deficit against a team Calvin beat a few weeks ago, on their court, does not qualify as "great".
C.  Trying to blame the officials for some really lame play by Calvin just isn't fair.






























D. Proper nouns, like Calvin start with capital letters.  P.S.  You went to Alma, right?

[realist]

great win by calvin,  the 2 frosh really did a great job!  The officials were very one sided toward trine, they kept calling rinky dink fouls on calvin especially wilks, while they let Cummings go over the back numerous times.   Tony Canonie did an outstanding job on Dixon, holding him to 2-15 fg and than making 3 fts to seal the game.  Great win and a nice bounce back from the bad loss to hope.

Hold on a second.  The game I watched had Calvin blowing an early lead (like we haven't seen that before).
A.  Calvin never should have blown the lead.  How many times do some of you have to see this before it dawns on you that blowing a lead is not a " great" idea. Have you already forgotten the "painful" lesson we learned from Hope 101 Wed. night?
B.  Managing to come back from a 15 point deficit against a team Calvin beat a few weeks ago, on their court, does not qualify as "great".
C.  Trying to blame the officials for some really lame play by Calvin just isn't fair.
D. Proper nouns, like Calvin start with capital letters.  P.S.  You went to Alma, right?

Speaking of proper nouns, does DickHead have a capital "d" and a capital "h" or just a capital "d"?

Why don't you look at your family letterhead for that answer?

[knightvision]

After a decent start (an 18-12 lead), Calvin's offense went dormant, scoring a paltry 13 point the next 18 minutes of the game, falling behind 47-32, midway through the second half. At that point Jordan Brink, who had been absent from Van Noord Arena for a very long time, made his entrance in the uniform of Tony DeWitte going el fuego, scoring 14 of Calvin's next 15 points over a four minute stretch, to get the Knights back in the game. Meanwhile, Trine went cold (partly the result of a change in Calvin defensive strategy), and the home team outscored the visitors from Angola 20-2 to take a 53-49 lead. Trine came back to score the next four but Welch made a pretty move past Cummings to give the Knights a lead they would never relinquish. A huge victory for Calvin who now effectively has a three game lead over the Thunder for placing in the post season tournament. Other game notes:

--This may have been the coming out party for DeWitte who—after an indifferent first half (0-3 from the floor) went 7-8 after the break, bagging 19 points. He freed up himself in a variety of ways, combining clever back cuts with the kind of perimeter shooting Calvin fans have been looking for from the frosh from Grandville. I almost felt sorry for the Trine defender who didn't seem to know where the next shot was coming from. It was a clinic by DeWitte, and the kind of performance not seen at VNA since Brink single-handedly hoisted the  Knights on his shoulders the last five minutes of the conference final against Hope a couple of years ago. Great stuff to watch.

--Possibly the most humorous moment in VNA history (admittedly a low bar) occurred with just over six minutes left, when the red hot freshmen completed a four point play and then—to the great dismay of Calvin fans—was removed for a well-earned breather. It's good thing the 2nd Amendment isn't well respected on the Knollcrest Campus (though pitchforks were sighted) because the loud rebellion from the home crowd was enough to cause the Calvin bench turn and look. One smart-aleck endzone spectator piped up by saying "Hey Tony, just go over to the scorer's table and check back in; Kevin won't notice." The banter led to more than a few chuckles from the normally dour assembled Calvinists. In what may have been a response to whoever that endzone smart aleck was, KVS mentioned in his post-game interview that Tony came out because he was so tired he couldn't defend anymore on the other end.

One of the coaches smiled? That's the kind of behavior that can draw an excessive celebration flag.  I thought about throwing one of those flags myself this past Wednesday night when a certain endzone smart aleck  cleanly handled a slowly bouncing ball entering the stands and then turned around pounding his chest and pointing at goodknight and me with a big grin on his face.  I can't speak for goodknight, but a) I have never felt safer sitting in the endzone than I did right then; and b) I know there's no way I would have taken you out of the game after a play like that. 

[sac]

Calvin 61  Trine 58

Story of this one was Trine's super hot 3-point shooting in the first half which inevitably had to cool off in the 2nd, which it did to the tune of 1-10.  Canonie certainly did a fine job on Dixon though I think a video review might show a better team effort than people realize.  Dixon beat Canonie a few times only to have a Knight cut him off regularly.    I've probably watched Trine and Dixon close to 20 times the last four years and can't remember a time I saw Dixon force so many shots.  Hope didn't give him any good looks but one in Angola but yesterday Dixon was just throwing stuff at the basket, maybe out of frustration.  Even more strange was Trine seeming to be perfectly happy continuing to let it happen.

Killer stretch for Trine up 15 with 13+ to play and went the next 10+ minutes scoring 2 free-throws.   That's about when DeWitte hit his impressive scoring stretch. 

Big missed opportunity for the Thunder, nice comeback win for Calvin who as Oldknight mention now have a 2 game lead on Trine plus the tie-breaker.  Virtually locks Calvin into no worse than 3rd seed come MIAA Tournament time I would think.


ps   I haven't heard losing an 18-12 lead described as blowing a lead since.......I don't know, 1916 maybe.

pss  Shot selection.......yikes!!!

psss your concessions puts the napkins away too soon

[sac]

Hope 82  Albion 70

Albion still has injury issues and threw some lineups out there I haven't seen including starting Lowe and Larr, playing Larr and Bennett together and virtually no Rubio and less Fordham.  Hope got the same treatment from Albion in the last 5 minutes of the first half as they gave Calvin on Wednesday night.  Tied at 25, Albion rattles off a 15-4 run and Hope's down 11 at the half.

Hope started its Sr's in the 2nd half and even though they never grabbed the lead, they set a nice tone that Hope followed through with the rest of the half.  Hope kind of picked their way back into the game and finally took a very brief lead on a Dante Hawkins 3-pointer which Albion immediately answered.  It went back and forth for a few minutes until tied at 61 Hope made a flurry of a run and in 1 1/2 game minutes were leading by 9.

Season long story for Albion is not being able to get a defensive stop when they need one, and struggling offensively at the end of game..  If I counted right Albion had one defensive stop in the last 6 minutes of the game while being stopped 6 times through missed shots or turnovers.

Great game from Harrison Blackledge.  The only thing that really slowed him down all night was foul trouble.  Mitchell O'Brien had an even better 2nd half than I thought and probably deserves game hero status.  13 points, 10 in the 2nd and forced 4 turnovers and just some overall pretty scrappy play.

Hope might have dodged a bit of a bullet last night.  Turning around an 11 point deficit into a 12 point win seems good though.



This week in bad MIAA officiating:   stopping play for a defensive injury, thanks for leaving 6 seconds on the shot-clock guys.