MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[formerd3db]

sac, check your PMs, my friend.

[wiz]

I agree with others that this was a terrific game, almost a renewal of the great Rivalry games from the past. Wonderful atmosphere with both teams competing hard and--for the most part--quite well. Some games your opponent gives you the win and some games you just snatch it away. Tonight was the latter for Calvin who looked to me to just have a little more gas in the tank down the stretch. Outstanding clutch free throw shooting with the Knights going 18-19 the second 20 minutes. After getting outboarded the first half, Calvin dominated the paint in the second, including 10 offensive boards after the break. Other game notes:

--You won't see Cam Denney play under control for a full game very often but he did tonight. A very quiet and efficient 21 points, 8 points and 4 assists with few mistakes. His well timed, under control, step-in three ball with 2:30 left was the biggest shot of the game and created about as loud a roar from a Calvin crowd as you will ever hear at DeVos.

--Blackledge is a load to guard but it seemed Hope struggled even more with Welch who was money down the stretch in a pressure packed game.

--Dante Hawkins is a warrior, playing the full 40, but I thought he tired late. Siegel, who was sick yesterday also looked tired but Mike did hit an important second half triple.

--Tony DeWitte was also quietly efficient, getting a patient 14 points and grabbing five important rebounds.

--Not a lot of mistakes by either team. Calvin with 8 turnovers and Hope just 7. Quite a contrast from last Saturday's game.

--I'll leave it to goodknight to remind Calvin fans of Bosko's prescient comment in December.

When Calvin defeated Carthage early in the season, the longtime CCIW coach, Bosko Djurickovic, gave a shockingly positive endorsement of the Calvin team, which had started the non-conference portion of the schedule poorly.  In his post-game interview, Bosko asserted, "Calvin is a good team.  They will finish with 17, 18, 19 wins." Calvin fans might have thought Bosco was already deep into the flask of Slivovitz on that late November evening, but he evidently saw something that escaped most of the rest of us.

Speaking of Bosko's shrewdness, I just posted this on CCIW Chat:

I think Bosko is an idiot and the politics that got IWU moved down the regional rankings is a farce.

That's more than a little harsh, USee. Bosko Djurickovic is many things, but "idiot" is not one of them. Idiots don't win two national championships or reach the Final Four from two different schools.

(Bosko said on Friday night after Carthage lost that it would "set a bad precedent" if Illinois Wesleyan got a Pool C berth without having even qualified for the CCIW tournament, a remark that has certainly added to the controversy.)

Reportedly, Bosko also said he thinks it would "set a bad precedent" if Hope gets a Pool C berth when they were only able to beat Calvin one time in three tries.  After all, Calvin is a team that didn't even qualify for the MIAA tournament a year ago and already has 10 losses this year.

[iwumichigander]

Calvin and Hope will not be sent to the same pod. They don't put two teams from the same conference in the same pod anymore unless geography demands it (and it won't in this case). And, being the national committee chair, KVS would probably threaten to fight any committee members who tried to pair them together.

Would this be the same KVS National Committee Chair whose team just won the MIAA tournament and an AQ whom some would like to be fired?

[oldknight]

a camera angle that showed Blackledge with his back pointedly turned to the Calvin celebration while his Hope teammates looked on very disappointed but respectful.  Having been in his shoes in both high school and college, I have had my head down in tears, had to watch others celebrate, and it is no fun at all.  But I really hope that after the video cut out he turned around....he is too fine a player and competitor for this to happen.   

Harrison Blackledge was visibly grieving--not what he'd worked and hoped for--but certainly not dissing the Calvin celebration. As you observed, he's much too fine a player (and person) for that.

And kudos to the Calvin students for allowing the coaches and teams to complete their post-game congrats before their well-deserved storming of the floor. From my perspective, the whole evening was spirited yet class-act sportsmanship from coaches, fans, and players of both sides. And that's why I could walk out last evening feeling disappointed yet also thinking that these student athletes and their mentors had treated us to college sport at its best.

I have no problem with Blackledge and his unhappiness at losing the game. While I understand the reason behind having the losing team stay for the trophy presentation, I don't believe it serves its purpose very well and would dispense with the requirement. Over a decade ago my daughters' team won their regional final over sac's former high school. My daughters' team never led until the final minute of the game and eventually won on a last second shot. The obviously sad losing team dutifully did the handshake line and then simply continued on through the nearby doorway, only to be brought back into the gym to watch the trophy presentation. I felt badly for that team and thought immediately there was no need to do that, despite the noble attempt to display good sportsmanship. To me, the trophy presentation is for the winning team and its fans. I wasn't offended by the Hope fans who left their seats and who were out the door before the trophy was handed to Knights players and I don't think Hope fans would be offended if Calvin fans left after a Hope win.

[sac]

Projected bracket
http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2017/projected-mens-bracket

Sending Hope (or Calvin) to Rochester would certainly be creative but I can't think of any time in any sport they've done this.  With two border crossing I think its unlikely, going around Lake Erie on friendly ground adds 100 miles to the journey putting it over 500 miles.

[Gregory Sager]

I think you're right. Sending Hope across the Canadian border creates serious logistical headaches in this day and age.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Projected bracket
http://www.d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2017/projected-mens-bracket

Sending Hope (or Calvin) to Rochester would certainly be creative but I can't think of any time in any sport they've done this.  With two border crossing I think its unlikely, going around Lake Erie on friendly ground adds 100 miles to the journey putting it over 500 miles.

So, I agree practically.  But the NCAA uses a specific program to determine distances and they still count it, so we went with it.  In reality, the only other viable option is Marietta and we try to split up the regions as much as possible.  You could potentially send them to Hanover and shift things around, moving Hardin-Simmons east - it's just less exciting.

[Young Knight 14]

Hope has three first-team all league players, and one second-team. Calvin has no first-team players and one second-team. Yet Calvin, a team that a week and a half ago Hope fans would likely have unanimously denounced as inferior to their own, has beaten Hope twice in the past week on Hope's home floor. Am I the only Hope fan who finds this concerning? I think the situation requires more analysis than "that was a good game." So what are the possibilities? Here are a few that come to mind:

• Hope simply isn't as good as we thought.
• Calvin's coaching staff ran circles around Hope's coaching staff.
• Hope's lack of depth was exposed.
• Calvin fans have referred to their team's "toughness" and "resiliency." Is this an implicit criticism of Hope?
• Hope simply doesn't match-up well against Calvin.
• Calvin is doing a better job developing over the course of the season.

It's entirely possible I'm missing something. Also possible it's a combination of these things. A neutral observer I talked to, who knows basketball well, said to me "they flat-out outplayed Hope." As I said: this concerns me.

I would agree that its probably a combination of these things.  Hope has a better starting 5, but I would argue that Calvin probably has a better top 8 or 9.  Being able to go to the bench early means things like foul trouble and tired legs are less of a story at the end of the game. (Yes Calvin got in foul trouble Saturday but i'm speaking in general.)  There is a match-up or two that clearly favors Calvin.  For example when Carlson has to guard Kronemeyer in the paint. On coaching/progressing through the season its clear that the Calvin team that played Saturday would beat an early season Calvin team by 20 points.  I think this speaks to coaching, player development, and team chemistry.  I admittedly don't watch as much Hope basketball as Calvin basketball, but I'm not sure late season Hope could beat early season Hope as easily if at all. (feel free to correct me)   Finally Hope is a good basketball team, but if they wanted to be very good or great they had to be able to beat less talented teams at home. 

Side note, I know Hope loves to play a faster pace game and score in transition.  Does anyone have any numbers comparing the last two Saturday games vs the game at Van Noord? I'm just wondering if that game was played much faster than the later two.

[KnightSlappy]

I calculate 67 possessions for the two games at DeVos and 71 possessions for the game at Van Noord. Average tempo is 73 possessions per team per game D3-wide. Calvin's adjusted tempo for the season is about 70 possessions. Hope's is 73.

[Young Knight 14]

I calculate 67 possessions for the two games at DeVos and 71 possessions for the game at Van Noord. Average tempo is 73 possessions per team per game D3-wide. Calvin's adjusted tempo for the season is about 70 possessions. Hope's is 73.

Is it fair to say that playing a slower game was a difference maker in the two games at DeVos?  In theory less possessions would give the "better" team less chances to be better aka score more. Maybe this actually isn't a big deal and more of a hunch.   

[oldknight]

Hope has three first-team all league players, and one second-team. Calvin has no first-team players and one second-team. Yet Calvin, a team that a week and a half ago Hope fans would likely have unanimously denounced as inferior to their own, has beaten Hope twice in the past week on Hope's home floor. Am I the only Hope fan who finds this concerning? I think the situation requires more analysis than "that was a good game." So what are the possibilities? Here are a few that come to mind:

• Hope simply isn't as good as we thought.
• Calvin's coaching staff ran circles around Hope's coaching staff.
• Hope's lack of depth was exposed.
• Calvin fans have referred to their team's "toughness" and "resiliency." Is this an implicit criticism of Hope?
• Hope simply doesn't match-up well against Calvin.
• Calvin is doing a better job developing over the course of the season.

It's entirely possible I'm missing something. Also possible it's a combination of these things. A neutral observer I talked to, who knows basketball well, said to me "they flat-out outplayed Hope." As I said: this concerns me.

I would agree that its probably a combination of these things.  Hope has a better starting 5, but I would argue that Calvin probably has a better top 8 or 9.  Being able to go to the bench early means things like foul trouble and tired legs are less of a story at the end of the game. (Yes Calvin got in foul trouble Saturday but i'm speaking in general.)  There is a match-up or two that clearly favors Calvin.  For example when Carlson has to guard Kronemeyer in the paint. On coaching/progressing through the season its clear that the Calvin team that played Saturday would beat an early season Calvin team by 20 points.  I think this speaks to coaching, player development, and team chemistry.  I admittedly don't watch as much Hope basketball as Calvin basketball, but I'm not sure late season Hope could beat early season Hope as easily if at all. (feel free to correct me)   Finally Hope is a good basketball team, but if they wanted to be very good or great they had to be able to beat less talented teams at home. 

Side note, I know Hope loves to play a faster pace game and score in transition.  Does anyone have any numbers comparing the last two Saturday games vs the game at Van Noord? I'm just wondering if that game was played much faster than the later two.

Calvin seems to use more players than does Hope. Calvin also seems to give their bench more key minutes and gets better production from them. One might argue that is because the Knights don't have a reliable impact player (like Hope does with Blackledge) and thus KVS is always searching for a hot hand or good group of players. If recent games are a proper measure, coach may have finally found it. It seems to me that Calvin's late season resurgence has been fueled by some excellent play by Welch who has matured into a consistent post scorer, and who has been the recipient of some nice dishes from Denney. Michael's confidence seems to have grown the second half of the season. I also think that Kronemeyer coming in from off the bench rather than as a starter is a good thing for him and the team. An up-tempo game was more to Hope's advantage as was clear from Saturday's first half, but in the second 20 minutes, the Knights simply carved up Hope's defense in the half court game. I'm pretty sure KS can run efficiency numbers for the second half but it struck me as exceptional.

[KnightSlappy]

I calculate 67 possessions for the two games at DeVos and 71 possessions for the game at Van Noord. Average tempo is 73 possessions per team per game D3-wide. Calvin's adjusted tempo for the season is about 70 possessions. Hope's is 73.

Is it fair to say that playing a slower game was a difference maker in the two games at DeVos?  In theory less possessions would give the "better" team less chances to be better aka score more. Maybe this actually isn't a big deal and more of a hunch.

Maybe, but the two games were so different. I could see that being the case in the first game (at DeVos) but not as much as the championship game.

Calvin was down 12 at half in the championship game and therefore probably weren't really by the slow pace (fewer opportunities to score = harder to catch up). They won because they scored an unreal 1.57 points per possession in the second half. 52 points is the most they've scored in a half all season (tied with the second half vs. Aquinas).

[KnightSlappy]

Calvin will play host Marietta with Thomas More and Guilford also at the site.

[calvin_grad]

Hope hosts UW-Oshkosh.  Washington U and Ripon also at Hope.

[oldknight]

Calvin will play host Marietta with Thomas More and Guilford also at the site.

Hope hosts UW-Oshkosh.  Washington U and Ripon also at Hope.

The two MIAA teams got probably the best possible scenario they could reasonably expect for each squad.