MBB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[Hopester]

Have you ever noticed how the really "good" teams make their own luck?  Albion knew what to do when the opportunity came.  Calvin bet on stopping Albion from scoring when perhaps they should have figured out how to limit any potential shot to 2 points.  Better to play for the tie than to allow a 3 pt. shot.

Yes.  Thank you.  Why don't coaches protect from a loss by having their players foul before the shot?  Make a kid earn 2 pts. and tie at best rather than risking the loss by allowing a shot?  Mocini had a good look and good form on his shot--nothing like Winkle's fall-away-off-the-glass-wing-and-a-prayer shot of several years ago.  That one was lucky, if any.

Fouling in the situation last night would have been a huge mistake. Mocini on the year is a 39% three point shooter... fairly good, but he is and 82% free throw shooter. the odds are much more likely that he will make two free throws... a shot that he practices over and over since he was 4, than a leaning three point buzzer beater a shot he probably hasn't practiced too much. Even if the stats were relatively even or favoring the other direction, I would say make him beat us with the three. There should have been better defense on the play forcing a much more difficult shot, but regardless you make them get lucky to win rather than you get lucky to survive.

[Civic Minded]

Have you ever noticed how the really "good" teams make their own luck?  Albion knew what to do when the opportunity came.  Calvin bet on stopping Albion from scoring when perhaps they should have figured out how to limit any potential shot to 2 points.  Better to play for the tie than to allow a 3 pt. shot.

Yes.  Thank you.  Why don't coaches protect from a loss by having their players foul before the shot?  Make a kid earn 2 pts. and tie at best rather than risking the loss by allowing a shot?  Mocini had a good look and good form on his shot--nothing like Winkle's fall-away-off-the-glass-wing-and-a-prayer shot of several years ago.  That one was lucky, if any.

Fouling in the situation last night would have been a huge mistake. Mocini on the year is a 39% three point shooter... fairly good, but he is and 82% free throw shooter. the odds are much more likely that he will make two free throws... a shot that he practices over and over since he was 4, than a leaning three point buzzer beater a shot he probably hasn't practiced too much. Even if the stats were relatively even or favoring the other direction, I would say make him beat us with the three. There should have been better defense on the play forcing a much more difficult shot, but regardless you make them get lucky to win rather than you get lucky to survive.

I don't know...his stats may say he's a 39% 3 pt. shooter, but he's been really hot from 3 lately.  <insert dead horse argument about how KVS can't close out a game here?>  Perhaps it's just karma returning some favors...   

[Mr. Ypsi]

I would never deliberately foul with a 2-point lead (unless, perhaps, if the other team was dumb enough to put the ball in the hands of a Ben Wallce-type FT shooter!), but I'm always amazed how rarely teams will foul with a 3-point lead.  Guaranteed win, barring the extremely unlikely make-the-first, miss-the-second-but-tip-in-the-rebound scenario.

[Erm Schmigget]

I would never deliberately foul with a 2-point lead (unless, perhaps, if the other team was dumb enough to put the ball in the hands of a Ben Wallce-type FT shooter!), but I'm always amazed how rarely teams will foul with a 3-point lead.  Guaranteed win, barring the extremely unlikely make-the-first, miss-the-second-but-tip-in-the-rebound scenario.

Maybe it's less of a case of fouling deliberately and more of not being afraid of fouling the guy before the shot.  Play tougher defense and prevent the player from being able to get into position for a shot.  It worked for Adrian vs. Hope several years ago in the MIAA semis.   

That reminds me...

I watched that game from the reserved seats behind the west hoop.  The Calvin coaches were sitting across the aisle, just to my left.  An assistant looked at KVS and said the refs should have called a foul on Adrian, which would have put Hope at the line with a chance to (win? ...tie?).  KVS's response was just a somlemn nod.  Stupid refs!!!      But I'm not bitter!!!     

[Civic Minded]

I would never deliberately foul with a 2-point lead (unless, perhaps, if the other team was dumb enough to put the ball in the hands of a Ben Wallce-type FT shooter!), but I'm always amazed how rarely teams will foul with a 3-point lead.  Guaranteed win, barring the extremely unlikely make-the-first, miss-the-second-but-tip-in-the-rebound scenario.

Maybe it's less of a case of fouling deliberately and more of not being afraid of fouling the guy before the shot.  Play tougher defense and prevent the player from being able to get into position for a shot.  It worked for Adrian vs. Hope several years ago in the MIAA semis.   

That reminds me...

I watched that game from the reserved seats behind the west hoop.  The Calvin coaches were sitting across the aisle, just to my left.  An assistant looked at KVS and said the refs should have called a foul on Adrian, which would have put Hope at the line with a chance to (win? ...tie?).  KVS's response was just a somlemn nod.  Stupid refs!!!      But I'm not bitter!!!     

Arrggghhhhh....that game, more than any other (yes, even Caleb buzzer beaters) is a sore spot for me.  The reffing was deliriously horrid, and I remember that particular foul vividly (someone please pass the Tums). 

[sac]

Check this out, I'm not sure I've ever seen this.

Alma 65 Olivet 63 at Alma
Olivet 65 Alma 63 at Olivet



Now that we're close enough to the tournament, its time to maybe sort some things out.

Currently if the tournament were held today
#8 Olivet/Alma at Hope
#7 Olivet/Alma at Albion
#6 Kalamazoo at Calvin
#5 Adrian at Tri-State

Olivet and Alma are currently in "coin flipping" territory, both have wins over each other and Kzoo. 

Should Hope and Albion end in a tie, Albion has the tie-breaker with two wins over Calvin

Should Hope/Albion and Calvin all tie it gets a bit more complicated, assuming 1 of Hope's losses comes to Calvin;  Albion hold the tie-breaker with  3-1 record vs. Hope and Calvin.....Hope would be #2 by being 2-2, Calvin #3 at 1-3. 

There is no scenario I can think of that can give Hope the tie-breaker over Albion.

Besides winning first round games.  To host the MIAA semi's

Hope must finish alone in First or tie with Calvin
Albion must finish alone in First or in a tie
Calvin must finish alone in First

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Albion is doing some special things on defense this year.

12 of 20 games they've held their opponents to less than 30 points in the first half.

Their last 5 opponents first half point totals
20pts--8 FG's
25pts--9 FG's
26pts--11 FG's
19pts--8 FG's
21pts--9 FG's

Last 4 games they've allowed
18--FG's
17--FG's
16--FG's
20--FG's

[sac]

Albion is doing some special things on defense this year.

12 of 20 games they've held their opponents to less than 30 points in the first half.

Their last 5 opponents first half point totals
20pts--8 FG's
25pts--9 FG's
26pts--11 FG's
19pts--8 FG's
21pts--9 FG's

Last 4 games they've allowed
18--FG's
17--FG's
16--FG's
20--FG's

Hope is on a similar run of games

24pts--8 FG's
27pts-- 10 FG's
24pts-- 8 FG's
21pts-- 8 FG's
27pts --8 FG's

Last 5 games FG's
18--FG's
21--FG's
24--FG's
20--FG's
18--FG's



Calvin has had a three game stretch of
22pts--10 FG's
21pts--8 FG's
22pts--10 FG's

Last 3 games
24-- FG's
16-- FG's
21-- FG's

There's some good defense being played at the top of this league right now.

[Hopester]

There is no scenario I can think of that can give Hope the tie-breaker over Albion.

I got one.. even though the improbability is very high. Kazoo wins out and Calvin loses out, with Tri State also losing two games and Hope losing to Alma, with Albion winning out as well. Yeah not likely, but wanted to point out that it is there. I think it is right because Kazoo would finish in third in this crazy scenario. I know it won't happen, but I thought about it so I had to write about it.

[Mr. Ypsi]

There is no scenario I can think of that can give Hope the tie-breaker over Albion.

I got one.. even though the improbability is very high. Kazoo wins out and Calvin loses out, with Tri State also losing two games and Hope losing to Alma, with Albion winning out as well. Yeah not likely, but wanted to point out that it is there. I think it is right because Kazoo would finish in third in this crazy scenario. I know it won't happen, but I thought about it so I had to write about it.

If I did the numbers right, I think you are correct.  But on the other hand, I think pigs can fly, so...

[GoKnights68]

Anybody know if anything is planned for Calvin's last game in Knollcrest this Saturday?  I think Calvin sent out "special invites" to all the former players to come to the game, but anything else?

[OC_SID]

Check this out, I'm not sure I've ever seen this.

Alma 65 Olivet 63 at Alma
Olivet 65 Alma 63 at Olivet

Good catch, I did not notice that last night.

[Gregory Sager]

HCG:  Not so sure about that adversity thing.  The person who pointed out the 92 loss is a CCIW regular, and was tugging on all your leg just abit.  

Actually, the person who pointed out the '92 loss is a North Park alumnus, and he was tugging on all your legs a lot.

By the way, I'm still trying to figure out what Corey Feldman had to do with that game-winning shot at Albion last night. Did I simply miss the explanation?

[Erm Schmigget]

HCG:  Not so sure about that adversity thing.  The person who pointed out the 92 loss is a CCIW regular, and was tugging on all your leg just abit.  

Actually, the person who pointed out the '92 loss is a North Park alumnus, and he was tugging on all your legs a lot.

By the way, I'm still trying to figure out what Corey Feldman had to do with that game-winning shot at Albion last night. Did I simply miss the explanation?

At the end of the clip, there was a kid jumping around with the fans and team, wearing a hat like the one Mr. Feldman is wearing in the photo NWHF posted, and wearing black clothing.  Somehow that must have reminded NWHF of the star of Goonies, The lost Boys, etc.  Why did he make this connection, you might ask?  Well, maybe this could help understand the mind of my good friend NWHF (and my mind in the process).  We once had part of a conversation go something like this:

NWHF:  Who sings this song?
ES:  Ummm...  Was just on Letterman...wore a big hat...sang with Sinead O'Conner...
NWHF:  Van Morrison!!!
ES:  YES!

Or something like that.  Visually stimulated memory.

[realist]

One last shot at the end of the Albion/Calvin game.  Just like the "prevent defense" we all love to hate so much in football.  The result of Calvin's defense at the end of the game in essence was to allow the very thing  Calvin needed to fear the most.  Namely a good open look in good range by an good 3 pt. shooter.  The odds are much more favorable to put a guy on the line, and force him to make the free throws.  You see football coaches play for the tie many, many times every year.  Why is it in basketball one must play for the immediate win.  Take it if it's there, but go with the safe bet.  To me it is rather obvious why Mocini gets the inbounds pass.  Turner really expected him to get fouled, and he wanted his best ft shooter at the line.  Turner was playing for the tie, and Calvin rewarded him with a W. 
GS:  Good comeback on pulling all our legs.

[hope_hoops1]

In regards to the Calvin-Albion finish, up 2, I don't think you foul.  By calling for a foul as a coach, you would be telling your players that you don't have faith in their defense to get one stop in 5 seconds.  It's easy to look back and say that they should have done this or should have done that, but I think KVS made the right decision in not fouling.  The chances that Mocini hits that shot again are about the same as Albion getting an offensive rebound off of a missed free throw and putting it in to win the game.  Let's not forget that Zoerhof just got a rebound on a missed free throw 30 seconds earlier to help give Calvin the lead.