FB: Southern California Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Gray Fox]

It's probably a form of denial.

[K-Mack]

Same link that I posted for Andy Collins (http://www.wireimage.com/GalleryListing.asp?navtyp=GLS====273595&nbc1=2) has three pictures of Cory Ohnesorge at mini-camp.  A google search still gives him a Giant's website page w/ no info but his college. 

If it was me, I would print it out with a focus on the cutline: "N.Y. Giants QB Andy Collins."

[K-Mack]

And how many of us SCIAC guys took out thousands and thousands of dollars in loans to do what? Play Football at our respected institution.  Any SCIAC player can to a Cal State or UC and get a degree for a much lesser price, but we just have to play football don't we?

I'm guessing that there are a lot of Stags, Sagehens, Tigers, Bullodgs, and Poets who would tell you that football was not the sole . . . or even the motivating reason that they chose their college . . . and would further tell you that the quality of their educational experience at a small private residential liberal arts college gives them advantages over their peers who attended larger, less expensive, public institutions of higher learning.

I don't know ... I always looked at it like you could get an education and make some cool friends anywhere, so yeah, I paid about $80,000 (not all of it in loans of course, lots in scholarships and grants) to play football.

[Browneagle64]

When the coaching staff at Oxy recruits prospective student-athletes, they look for individuals who are competitors first in the classroom and then on the field, who love to play football, and who aren't afraid to make a "dual commitment to athletics and education." In fact, according to all the coaches at Oxy, the staff makes it a priority to let in coming recruits and their parents understand that Oxy is an insituation in which your education is above your extra-curricular activities.

[snoop dawg]

BE

Don't all SCIAC school coaches do the same?

[RFB]

BE

Don't all SCIAC school coaches do the same?

Yes

[Sabretooth Tiger]

I always looked at it like you could get an education and make some cool friends anywhere, so yeah, I paid about $80,000 (not all of it in loans of course, lots in scholarships and grants) to play football.

I didn't mean to suggest that my view is an absolute.  I will, however, stand by my point that most players that I know didn't choose their schools solely or even primarily in order to play football, but rather as one of a multitude of factors, the leading one being quality of education.

And while [Keith . . . edited to correct my egregious error . . . how could I be so careless when it comes to the mighty K-Mack . . . thanks for all of the hard work you put into this site, great information delivered with style and class.], it is true that you can get an education and make some cool friends anywhere, the quality of that education is markedly different depending on where you get it.

I firmly believe based on my experiences a student, and as a teacher at the post graduate level, that the educational experience students get at small liberal arts colleges is vastly superior to that at larger institutions.  This is based on:
(1)  Direct engagement with faculty and developing a relationship with faculty members; (2) Faculty focused on teaching as well as scholarship (so teaching not pawned off on TA's); (3) small class sizes for more engagement by students; (4) more demanding assignments/writing requirements (uniformly, students who came out of small colleges . . . in my experience . . . are better writers on their essay exams than those from large public institutions . . . the reason being that they had to write a lot when they were undergrads . . . something few large institution students have to do based on sheer volume of material it would generate for review); (5) smaller community so more likely that students will be broadly exposed to the entire community which leads to greater exposure to diverse issues and individuals; and (6) residential community rather than commuter, leading to greater involvement and engagement 24/7 in the whole college experience.

So . . . there's my argument for small liberal arts college education and why I think most students don't pay the big bucks "just to play football." 

I'll get off my soapbox now.

tooth

[Gray Fox]

A little inspiration for the SCIAC players working out in the off season.


I'm Popeye the Sailor Man
I'm Popeye the Sailor Man
I'm strong to the finich
Cause I eats me spinach
I'm Popeye the Sailor Man

I'm one tough gazookus
Which hates all palookas
Wot ain't on the up and square
I biffs 'em and buffs 'em
An' always outroughs 'em
An' none of 'em gets nowhere

If anyone dares to risk me fisk
It's "boff" and its "wham", un'erstand
So, keep good behavior
That's your one life saver
With Popeye the Sailor Man.

I'm Popeye the Sailor Man
I'm Popeye the Sailor Man
I'm strong to the finich
Cause I eats me spinach
I'm Popeye the Sailor Man

[Browneagle64]

If only i could have come up with that answer on this thread before i had to report to work i could have sounded like an old wise man. However, Tooth beat me to it .

Tooth points out several key points that makes any student-athlete take into consideration that this is a choice that will make a difference throughout their entire life. Football can only last up to certain points, but a great education can spawn into more opportunities.

haha, btw, G-Fox, the only sciac person signing that song at La Verne was the strength/ & conditioning coach. As mush as they consider him being the top Strenght coach in the sciac, i really don't know what kids he has to work with since many of them didn't have a H.C for such a long time.

[hatchet molly]

Tooth,
To go along with your point, some kids never consider small liberal arts schools in high school unless they happen to get recruited. They might want to continue playing football, but know they can't get into a DI or DII school because of size, speed, etc., and don't want to play at a JUCO so, after visiting a DIII school, find that it's a great fit. I guess sometimes it's a means to an end to use football as getting a great education. 

[SnowLeopard]

well said CarloRossiLep.... If it wasn't for Football, i woulldn't have gone to ULV and I wouldn't be in debt with student loans right now.. I probably would have been at Long Beach State or Cal State East Bay.....
But the money was worth it... Friends and Memories that will last a life time...

Green and Oirange till I die. 8)

[K-Mack]

I always looked at it like you could get an education and make some cool friends anywhere, so yeah, I paid about $80,000 (not all of it in loans of course, lots in scholarships and grants) to play football.

I didn't mean to suggest that my view is an absolute.  I will, however, stand by my point that most players that I know didn't choose their schools solely or even primarily in order to play football, but rather as one of a multitude of factors, the leading one being quality of education.

And while Kevin, it is true that you can get an education and make some cool friends anywhere, the quality of that education is markedly different depending on where you get it.

I firmly believe based on my experiences a student, and as a teacher at the post graduate level, that the educational experience students get at small liberal arts colleges is vastly superior to that at larger institutions.  This is based on:
(1)  Direct engagement with faculty and developing a relationship with faculty members; (2) Faculty focused on teaching as well as scholarship (so teaching not pawned off on TA's); (3) small class sizes for more engagement by students; (4) more demanding assignments/writing requirements (uniformly, students who came out of small colleges . . . in my experience . . . are better writers on their essay exams than those from large public institutions . . . the reason being that they had to write a lot when they were undergrads . . . something few large institution students have to do based on sheer volume of material it would generate for review); (5) smaller community so more likely that students will be broadly exposed to the entire community which leads to greater exposure to diverse issues and individuals; and (6) residential community rather than commuter, leading to greater involvement and engagement 24/7 in the whole college experience.

So . . . there's my argument for small liberal arts college education and why I think most students don't pay the big bucks "just to play football." 

I'll get off my soapbox now.

tooth

Yeah, I didn't take it in a bad way, and my response was only half-serious. Certainly I took a lot of factors into consideration when choosing a school, certainly I'm a big proponent of the small-school experience and I definitely didn't mean "anywhere" as "anywhere," but rather lots of places.

In other words, football shouldn't be the sole factor in choosing a school, but if other things were fairly equal, as they were in my Final 2 situation (Albright vs. Randolph-Macon), it wouldn't be unreasonable or irresponsible in my view, to let that or some other non-academic factor like social life or distance from home be the tiebreaker.

That said, as some others are saying, I would have never considered the school I picked, or the small-school experience if not for football, so I think it runs both ways.

I know I wasn't sure about my choice when I made it, but I am now and definitely wouldn't trade it for the world.

I'll keep in mind that I can hang out on the SCIAC board for some high-level, thoughtful discussion

BTW, it's Keith ... but people have always called me Kevin from time to time.

[K-Mack]

Tooth and the gang,
Also, I don't expect you to follow my posts on other boards and threads, but I'm kind of a soapbox type of dude myself, so we're all thinking along the same lines.

I do stand by the thought that as a high schooler with the grades to get into a lot of different places, that I felt like I could go a lot of different ways (considered 2-3 majors) with my education, and school often being a "what you get out of it is what you put into it" thing, that there were many places I felt I could get a good education, and that other factors (financial aid, social life, distance from home, football situation/tradition, semi-academic opportunities like studying abroad, campus newspaper and internships) were valid ways to separate the schools I considered.

In other words, I knew I was going to study hard and get a lot out of whichever college I went to.

You are right though, that is not the same thing as saying you can get an education anywhere.

[Sabretooth Tiger]

BTW, it's Keith ... but people have always called me Kevin from time to time.

Oops, my bad . . . editing is now complete, please see above revision.  8)

[Tiger Shark]

Andy Collins is headed up to Canada for a tryout with the Montreal Alouettes.