FB: Empire 8

[JQV]

Interesting weekend.

Outside of text message Bomber updates from maxpower, I was all D1 this weekend and am just now catching up on the East Region D3 happenings.

A summary of my thoughts:

-I find it interesting that FA05 would take a leave of absence of E8Nation right when everyone is ready to turn their attention towards the Fisher coaching staff.  Especially interesting since he admitted to having been a member of the staff.

-Super, you really think you didn't try and taunt us after that Hartwick game?  Really?

-Without having seen a single snap or read anything other than the E8Nation analysis, I will say that I am not surprised that Hartwick won nor do I think it can be accounted for by saying Fisher let up.  Boltus and Crea have been two of the most effective offensive players in the nation for three years now.  This team was bound to put it all together eventually.  Neither the Bombers nor the Cardinals can excuse that loss to indifference or oversight.

-Glad to see signs of life on South Hill.  This season may not be a lost project yet.  I think the 'Port is pretty good.

-Urban sure recruits a lot of speed but, apparently, they can't tackle for ish.  Also, is there now some evidence that the great Tebow is human?  Say it ain't so.

-Is it possible that USF is the best team in the Sunshine State?  After seeing them live Friday night I think they may be able to run with the Gators and at least keep it close late.

-How about Chucky and the soon-to-be-NFC Champion Tampa Bay Buccaneers?

[theicdubbz]

Holy Smokes!  WHAT A WEEKEND!

Upsets across the board in the BCS!  oh, oh, and that whole Fisher vs Hartwick thing.  Anyways, the Bomber game was solid.  It was interesting in the FDC as only 3 alumns were in the midst of the 20 yellow T-shirts.  ( or 10 yellow T's and 10 non-yellow sweet 17's.  WHERE WAS ICEMAN WITH THE T's FOR SALE!?)  It was also interesting in the parking lot as Peggy immedietaly restricted who was allowed in due to some bogus faculty member arriving at 1:30 during the Fisher game and not being able to find a spot in the lot.   Well, that and their being Fisher fans and the business school in teh tail gate zone.  NEEDLESS TO SAY the tailgate was dead.   Oh wait a minute, I just remembered HARTWICK beat FISHER! ahahahahaha! hows that shoe feel on the other foot fish fans?  So, technically everyone is still alive again in the E8.   This is what could happen... hey if the mets can nearly lose the NL and we need a 1 game playoff, who knows with the E8.  

Heres what is POSSIBLE...
1) Ithaca wins out and finishes with 2 loses in the E8
2) Alfred loses to Fisher and Ithaca. Alfred finishes with 2 loses in the E8
3) Springfield loses to Ithaca but, wins out and beats Fisher. Springfield finishes with 2 loses in the E8
4) Springfield & Alfred beat Hartwick and Hartwick  finishes with 2 loses in the E8

Thus resulting with records in the E8 looking like this...
A) Fisher = 4-2  (beat B,C,F,G.  Lose to D,E)
B) Ithaca = 4-2 (beat C,D,F,G. Lose to A,E)
C) Alfred = 4-2 (beat D,E,F,G. Lose A,B)
D) Springfield = 4-2 (beat A,E,F,G. Lose to B,C)
E) Hartwick = 4-2 (beat A,B, F,G. Lose to C, D)
F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

[AUPepBand]

Pep- Do you have a Brooks report?  Or did you stay cheap and hit the Neptune?

Bring on the Hartwick Posters... they should arrive just in time to take a beating from Alfred. 

Go Bombers
Go Metros in '08

Pep stayed cheap and did the Neptune....where as a band we planned the escape of the shark swimming around in the Neptune Acquarium.

[Fisher96]

Holy Smokes!  WHAT A WEEKEND!

Upsets across the board in the BCS!  oh, oh, and that whole Fisher vs Hartwick thing.  Anyways, the Bomber game was solid.  It was interesting in the FDC as only 3 alumns were in the midst of the 20 yellow T-shirts.  ( or 10 yellow T's and 10 non-yellow sweet 17's.  WHERE WAS ICEMAN WITH THE T's FOR SALE!?)  It was also interesting in the parking lot as Peggy immedietaly restricted who was allowed in due to some bogus faculty member arriving at 1:30 during the Fisher game and not being able to find a spot in the lot.   Well, that and their being Fisher fans and the business school in teh tail gate zone.  NEEDLESS TO SAY the tailgate was dead.   Oh wait a minute, I just remembered HARTWICK beat FISHER! ahahahahaha! hows that shoe feel on the other foot fish fans?  So, technically everyone is still alive again in the E8.   This is what could happen... hey if the mets can nearly lose the NL and we need a 1 game playoff, who knows with the E8.  



Heres what is POSSIBLE...
1) Ithaca wins out and finishes with 2 loses in the E8
2) Alfred loses to Fisher and Ithaca. Alfred finishes with 2 loses in the E8
3) Springfield loses to Ithaca but, wins out and beats Fisher. Springfield finishes with 2 loses in the E8
4) Springfield & Alfred beat Hartwick and Hartwick  finishes with 2 loses in the E8

Thus resulting with records in the E8 looking like this...
A) Fisher = 4-2  (beat B,C,F,G.  Lose to D,E)
B) Ithaca = 4-2 (beat C,D,F,G. Lose to A,E)
C) Alfred = 4-2 (beat D,E,F,G. Lose A,B)
D) Springfield = 4-2 (beat A,E,F,G. Lose to B,C)
E) Hartwick = 4-2 (beat A,B, F,G. Lose to C, D)
F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

To settle that possibility, it is all the more reason why RPI, Union and Hobart should be added to this conference.   Drop Utica and Norwich.  Split the conference into two divisions, and have a one game playoff to determine the overall Empire 8 champ.    Would never happen, but wouldn't it be GREAT!

[superman57]

Interesting weekend.

.

-Super, you really think you didn't try and taunt us after that Hartwick game?  Really?

no of course you got a little taunt...but considering at the time you lost to hartwick...it was very tame...if this had been last year we would have all been relentless all week leading up to Fisher-IC about you guys losing to hartwick...so considering everything we were vary tame....and you IC fans know that we could have been a whole lot worse...

[AUPepBand]

F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

Pep thinks SOMEONE will win the Norwich vs. Utica game IPHO.

[maninorangehat]

Heres what is POSSIBLE...
1) Ithaca wins out and finishes with 2 loses in the E8
2) Alfred loses to Fisher and Ithaca. Alfred finishes with 2 loses in the E8
3) Springfield loses to Ithaca but, wins out and beats Fisher. Springfield finishes with 2 loses in the E8
4) Springfield & Alfred beat Hartwick and Hartwick  finishes with 2 loses in the E8

Thus resulting with records in the E8 looking like this...
A) Fisher = 4-2  (beat B,C,F,G.  Lose to D,E)
B) Ithaca = 4-2 (beat C,D,F,G. Lose to A,E)
C) Alfred = 4-2 (beat D,E,F,G. Lose A,B)
D) Springfield = 4-2 (beat A,E,F,G. Lose to B,C)
E) Hartwick = 4-2 (beat A,B, F,G. Lose to C, D)
F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

Dubbz  

A.  You have too much time on your hands.  Don't you have a house to be moving into or a dog to be walking?
B.  The odds of this happening are about as good as the Mets making it to the World Series this year.
C.  Your logic is flawed... How can Utica and Norwich both go 0-6 when they play each other?  
D.  I love your optimism.  Go Bombers... There is still hope

[chris7sarge]

I already wrote this once but somehow erased it.  So hopefully i get through this whole thing without doing the same.

Saterday- wow

I talked to a friend that was there, my father who was paying close attention over the net, and looked over some recent pages on here.  Here are some thoughts I came up with.  

First off, I must take a quick look at the last play of the game.  To me there can be several thoughts that come from the mere playcall alone.

1)  My line is bigger and better than yours.  So for that reason we will run the ball straight at you becuase I believe that we are better than you from this distance (2-5 yds?) and REALLY like my chances of reaching the endzone.  Furthermore, if we are as good as we and the rest of the nation believe, then we will be able to convert from here like a championship team should.  Put it on the table and see whose is bigger (if you will).

2)  I have no kicker and/or have no trust in my kicker.

3)  We have been lucky enough just to fight our way back to this point.  Hartwick is better than we are and therefore we would lose in an overtime situation (remember college overtime situations allow both teams a shot with the ball.  Meaning- its not a coin flip).  Therefore I not only need to go for it here, but also need to call a gimmick/trick play using personnel that are not my starters so as to confuse the defense and hopefully execute better on THIS play.

It is hard for me to imagine that SJF was thinking options 2 or 3.  That just doesn't happen with a team of that caliber.  Using this logic (and maybe I'm wrong) I have come to 2 more glaring questions.

1)  Why are you running a trick play with personnel that are not your best players.  If they were your best players, then you would have them starting and playing the whole game.  I am assuming that you feel as though you have one of, if not the best line in the E8 and much of the East.  And from the one game I saw at Alfred last year and the postings on here, you are right and have every reason to think that way.  Why then are you not just lining up and saying "We are better than you.  Here we come.  Our best versus you."  Are you telling me that you have no bread and butter play?  You have no play that you can call when you need 2-5 yds (sorry i'm not sure of the distance) like you were asked to recite the alphabet, a play that is the answer to a question as easy as 1+1?  If this is so, then you shouldn't be going for it.

2)  By going for it, I'm assuming that you have no kicker because otherwise this is tough for me to figure out.  You are ranked 5th in the country, you advanced far in the national playoffs last year, you are playing a team that you have not only beaten, but manhandled in the previous years.  You must feel as though you are a better team.  You must have felt as though you would win this game coming in.  Everyone else in the country, E8, rochester, and pretty much anyone NOT wearing a Hartwick jersey or the mother of someone wearing a Hartwick jersey expected you to win.  You have outplayed them the entire 2nd half and outscored them 21-10.  You have once again driven down the field and now have all the momentum in the world.  Which brings me to the glaring question: WHY NOT KICK THE BALL?  

This should be a gimme, after which you assert your dominance one possession at a time, outscore them, and go home with a scare and an unblemished record.

(Get ready to hate me SJF if not already the case)

Which brings me to the next point, and I am sorry Fisher, but I have to ask this.  Is this not a case of a coach coming back from the brink of disaster only to envision himself as an offensive guru in the headlines the following day because he had the kahunas to call a gadget play?  Does this not scream "Look at me and my offensive playcalling prowess?"  Just something to chew on.

Hartwick- great job!  Hopefully AU doesn't take you lightly and I know they wont.  Should be a great one Saterday.  You deserve a whole lotta credit and you are in the driver's seat, not AU.

AU-  Please take the pole position this saterday and beat Wick.  This is an opportunity this program has been building up to for years and I hope it comes to fruition.

[theicdubbz]

F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

Pep thinks SOMEONE will win the Norwich vs. Utica game IPHO.

Sorry, it was such a long post and I wasnt concerned with their records.

EDIT:
F) Norwich = 0-6 (lose to everyone)
G) Utica = 1-5 (Beat norwich)

[fisheralum91]

sarge- chewed on it the whole ride home and day on sunday.
i honestly have no idea.
but now im loooking to the bport game and want to see how they respond.
there should be a pretty good crowd-reunion wknd- and they should be loaded for bear.

[theicdubbz]

Heres what is POSSIBLE...
1) Ithaca wins out and finishes with 2 loses in the E8
2) Alfred loses to Fisher and Ithaca. Alfred finishes with 2 loses in the E8
3) Springfield loses to Ithaca but, wins out and beats Fisher. Springfield finishes with 2 loses in the E8
4) Springfield & Alfred beat Hartwick and Hartwick  finishes with 2 loses in the E8

Thus resulting with records in the E8 looking like this...
A) Fisher = 4-2  (beat B,C,F,G.  Lose to D,E)
B) Ithaca = 4-2 (beat C,D,F,G. Lose to A,E)
C) Alfred = 4-2 (beat D,E,F,G. Lose A,B)
D) Springfield = 4-2 (beat A,E,F,G. Lose to B,C)
E) Hartwick = 4-2 (beat A,B, F,G. Lose to C, D)
F) Norwich = 0-6 ( lose to everyone )
G) Utica = 0-6 (lose to everyone)

Oh boy, can you say Strength of Schedule.

Dubbz  

A.  You have too much time on your hands.  Don't you have a house to be moving into or a dog to be walking?
B.  The odds of this happening are about as good as the Mets making it to the World Series this year.
C.  Your logic is flawed... How can Utica and Norwich both go 0-6 when they play each other?   
D.  I love your optimism.  Go Bombers... There is still hope

DUDE, you're raggin' me about NORWICH and UTICA?!!  come on!... wait, wait,  this just in... HARTWICK BEAT FISHER!

[AUKaz00]

Alfred State has a football program and has baccalaureate programs but until it has a baccalaureate program for which its 700 occupational trades students can matriculate into, or, perhaps, sell off the program to Jamestown Community College, it's stuck with the junior colleges. Jamestown Community College got its start as an extension campus of Alfred University, much like AU is taking on 400 additional students in Istanbul, (or is that Constantinople?) Turkey.

Currently Alfred State is only 20% baccalaureate students and going DIII would mean that 80% of enrolled students wouldn't be eligible to play sports.  As for the additional 4 year programs, 3 more have been approved this year alone by SUNY.  However, many students complete their associate degrees and then decide whether or not to complete their baccalaureate and thus would need to declare their intentions (and pay the higher tuition rate) in order to play DIII.

I would love to know how much Cortland spends compared to Buff St and Brockport.  Do the head coaches get paid the same?  Is there someone in charge of all athletics at the d3 SUNY schools?  Why can't Buff St. get a grant like Cortland for a stadium?

If the Cortland deal is anything like the deal that Alfred State got for the new football field (opening 2008), then it comes down to appropriations from the state and federal government.  It's all about getting friendly with your senators...

[theicdubbz]

Cortland also got their stadium because it is in the center of the state and made available for every NYS CHampionship in almost all fall sports.

[realistic]

Pat-

Have you any information on the formation of a SUNY football conference? My alma mater needs to step it's game up and start a football program.

Money should be no object, Cortland spends a ton on football I'm sure - hence, the funds should be approved.

Compared to other schools, I would think Cortland spends very little.  The stadium was a one-time grant.  Remember this is a SUNY school we are talking about.  There's not a lot of funds available to throw at sports.

As far as a SUNY conference goes, I just do not see it happening.  Cortland is pretty happy in the NJAC due to the automatic qualifier.  Brockport, Morrisville, and Buff State fought their way to get in too. 

If there were 7 SUNY football teams, I can see the aforementioned breaking their NJAC ties.  I think it would be great for upstate football to see a SUNY conference.  However...

Maritime has shown no interest in playing its SUNY brothers, with the exception of Morrisville.  And they are apparently joining the NAC with New England based schools.  Me thinks they would rather test themselves against Mount Ida than play Brockport.

Albany and Buffalo are both D1-AA and D-1A respectively.  They aren't moving down.

Binghamton discusses adding football every 10 years or so.  It quickly gets squashed by the gender equity folks.  So they continue to play soccer, drive mini-vans, and hand out orange slices.  My guess is they would be a D1-AA team if they started football anyhow, since they are D1 for their other sports.

Who's left?

Even if Geneseo, or somebody else, started up a program it would only add up to 5 schools potentially willing to play in it.  Nobody is going to leave the NJAC and give up the Pool A/C bid for a Pool B selection and an unfilled schedule.

I would love to know how much Cortland spends compared to Buff St and Brockport.  Do the head coaches get paid the same?  Is there someone in charge of all athletics at the d3 SUNY schools?  Why can't Buff St. get a grant like Cortland for a stadium?

I am pretty sure the money spent is closely regulated.  At least it is in how much the coaches, etc get paid.  They cannot offer big $ to get a coach and cannot offer big $ to keep a coach.  C-State lost the National Champ Lax Coach b/c he could make more money teaching and asst coaching at Le Moyne.

As for facilities, Max hit on one big factor for the grant but it is also that the field is not only football, but field hockey, lax, etc.  As for Buff State, I imagine room for a field of that size would be an issue on that campus.  Cortland is lucky to have all that room running from the PER Center to rt 281.

[AUKaz00]

I would love to know how much Cortland spends compared to Buff St and Brockport.  Do the head coaches get paid the same?  Is there someone in charge of all athletics at the d3 SUNY schools?  Why can't Buff St. get a grant like Cortland for a stadium?

I am pretty sure the money spent is closely regulated.  At least it is in how much the coaches, etc get paid.  They cannot offer big $ to get a coach and cannot offer big $ to keep a coach.  C-State lost the National Champ Lax Coach b/c he could make more money teaching and asst coaching at Le Moyne.

As for facilities, Max hit on one big factor for the grant but it is also that the field is not only football, but field hockey, lax, etc.  As for Buff State, I imagine room for a field of that size would be an issue on that campus.  Cortland is lucky to have all that room running from the PER Center to rt 281.

Excluding the University Centers, the 4 year SUNY schools were paying the following ranges in their athletic departments in 2006:

                         Minimum   Maximum   Median
Athletic Director   $71,838    $108,887  $83,724
Head Coach         $43,429    $69,525    $53,567
Athletic Trainer    $36,389    $49,874    $43,740
Coach                 $30,791    $54,253    $40,261
1st Asst Coach     $39,990    $41,981    $40,873
Assistant Coach   $25,142    $37,526    $30,307

The above isn't broken down by sport and not all college have all of those positions.  Plus, some coaches may be faculty and not included in these numbers.  It does give an idea of the salary ranges however.