FB: Empire 8

[defenseiskey]

Is Alfred really the front runner or will their dream collapse the last two weeks of the season when they play the Bombers and SJF?

[sjfcards]

So if Alfred loses to Fisher and IC, and Hartwick, Fisher, and IC run all end up with one loss in conference, the tiebreaker is strength of schedule correct?

If that is the case, does Fisher's loss to Salisbury actually help Fisher get into the tournament? Also does Fisher having 3 losses, and Hartwick and IC each having 1 or 2 overall, hurt IC's and HC's SOS, and improve Fishers? That seems a little rediculous to me.
I know MUC and Salisbury would probably give the strength of schedule nod to Fisher, but losing a game should not help you.

Obviously if AU beats Fisher or Ithaca the point is a non issue, but it is worth mentioning.

[Jonny Utah]

So if Alfred loses to Fisher and IC, and Hartwick, Fisher, and IC run all end up with one loss in conference, the tiebreaker is strength of schedule correct?

If that is the case, does Fisher's loss to Salisbury actually help Fisher get into the tournament? Also does Fisher having 3 losses, and Hartwick and IC each having 1 or 2 overall, hurt IC's and HC's SOS, and improve Fishers? That seems a little rediculous to me.
I know MUC and Salisbury would probably give the strength of schedule nod to Fisher, but losing a game should not help you.

Obviously if AU beats Fisher or Ithaca the point is a non issue, but it is worth mentioning.

SJFs games against MUC and Salsbury are not in region so would not be reviewed as games versus Rochester or Ithaca would.  So it might come down to the silly SOS crap.

[Bombers798891]

SJF has gone from an extremely balanced team over the years into Hartwick 2.0, no rushing threat what-so-ever!!

I havent seen them this year, but could it be because for 7 of the last 10 years they had 2 of the better backs in the history of upstate football?

They've totally gone to the spread option zone read crap instead of being under center and running the zone run scheme that produced those 1,000yd RB's....

Im saying maybe they changed their offense because they don't have those 1000 yard rbs?

Carlton would be alot more effective if he was getting the hand offs from the QB when he came out from under center, he would be hidden by the lineman and his cutbacks would be alot more effective.  Instead of attacking the line with Carlton they are having him run lateral.  They are limiting their entire offense with this, there is no threat of play action what so ever.  Their bootlegs out of the Shotgun require a super human effort by the QB to complete the pass.  It just looks like a total cluster **** out there on offense.

Over their last four games, they're averaging 37 points a game in regulation. What exactly is the problem with the offense again? Could it be that a defense that's allowed 113 points in three losses might be to blame?

No the offense is definitely not as good as it has been.  The defense outside of the debacle that was Salisbury I think has been solid.  No shame in giving up 33 to Mount Union who is averaging 49 points per game against everybody else.  Held Hartwick to 10 points below their season average, but our offense cost us that game.  Then there is holding U of R to 17, Buffalo State to 7 (on a garbage time touchdown), Norwich to 6 points, and Ithaca to 6 points. 

That wasn't my point. My point was, in the three games your team has lost, it hasn't been the offense that was the issue. What is your offense supposed to do against Salisbury? Score 60 points? You say there's no shame in giving up 33 points to MUC, but if you're ok with that, then you can't really expect to score 35 on them. Maybe the Wick game was rough because of the turnovers, but still. I'm so sick of hearing SJF fans complain about their offense every week when, with the exception of the MUC game, which is probably unwinnable anyway, your offense has scored enough points to win every game.

Your offense is not why you're 3-3. Your defense is.

[FisherAlum05]

Well, I think its gonna end in a 3-way tie this year for the E8 title.  If SJF wins out and finishes 7-3, they should be in regardless.  Its looking like Hartwick, IC, and SJF will all make the tournament again this season.  Although Fisher is not consistent, I think we have enough talent to make some noise IF we can make it in.

[sjfcards]

If Fihser wins out and gets to 7-3, I think they could do some damage depending on who they play. If they have to face a Cortland, or Del Valley I think they can win. On a good day they seam to have enough talent to beat those types of teams (see Ithaca Game). On a bad day...not so much (see Hartwick game). The problem is that with 3 losses they have to be seeded very low, if they get the automatic bid. Which could mean big trouble for them (like MUC, or going out of conference to play another big time team....Uh OH...)

[boobyhasgameyo]

SJF has gone from an extremely balanced team over the years into Hartwick 2.0, no rushing threat what-so-ever!!

I havent seen them this year, but could it be because for 7 of the last 10 years they had 2 of the better backs in the history of upstate football?

They've totally gone to the spread option zone read crap instead of being under center and running the zone run scheme that produced those 1,000yd RB's....

Im saying maybe they changed their offense because they don't have those 1000 yard rbs?

Carlton would be alot more effective if he was getting the hand offs from the QB when he came out from under center, he would be hidden by the lineman and his cutbacks would be alot more effective.  Instead of attacking the line with Carlton they are having him run lateral.  They are limiting their entire offense with this, there is no threat of play action what so ever.  Their bootlegs out of the Shotgun require a super human effort by the QB to complete the pass.  It just looks like a total cluster **** out there on offense.

Over their last four games, they're averaging 37 points a game in regulation. What exactly is the problem with the offense again? Could it be that a defense that's allowed 113 points in three losses might be to blame?

No the offense is definitely not as good as it has been.  The defense outside of the debacle that was Salisbury I think has been solid.  No shame in giving up 33 to Mount Union who is averaging 49 points per game against everybody else.  Held Hartwick to 10 points below their season average, but our offense cost us that game.  Then there is holding U of R to 17, Buffalo State to 7 (on a garbage time touchdown), Norwich to 6 points, and Ithaca to 6 points. 

That wasn't my point. My point was, in the three games your team has lost, it hasn't been the offense that was the issue. What is your offense supposed to do against Salisbury? Score 60 points? You say there's no shame in giving up 33 points to MUC, but if you're ok with that, then you can't really expect to score 35 on them. Maybe the Wick game was rough because of the turnovers, but still. I'm so sick of hearing SJF fans complain about their offense every week when, with the exception of the MUC game, which is probably unwinnable anyway, your offense has scored enough points to win every game.

Your offense is not why you're 3-3. Your defense is.

And clearly you are missing my point that outside of the Salisbury game in which the defense was poor, the other 2 loses cannot be pinned on a defense that held both the teams well below their season scoring average.  The offense is so definitely responsible for losing to Hartwick and if there was any signs of offense whatsoever against Mount Union (well they did move the ball well on a few drives but couldn't finish for the life of them) it might have actually been a game. 

[Frank Rossi]

Well, I think its gonna end in a 3-way tie this year for the E8 title.  If SJF wins out and finishes 7-3, they should be in regardless.  Its looking like Hartwick, IC, and SJF will all make the tournament again this season.  Although Fisher is not consistent, I think we have enough talent to make some noise IF we can make it in.

Not sure how everyone is coming to that assumption so quickly -- I mean, unless you're talking about Pool A and assuming a Hartwick loss between now and the end of the season.  Pool C has a LONG way to go, and Hobart and WPI in the LL have a lot to say right now (WPI and Hobart still face each other) -- either would have a better winning percentage than SJF (8-1 or 9-1), and their SoS would challenge SJF's since SJF's only non-league, in-region teams are Rochester and Buff State (and both may perform better vs. Rochester on their way to one loss than SJF did).  If it's a close decision, SJF likely loses in secondary criteria, as the Salisbury and Mt. Union losses are then up for discussion. 

[sjfcards]

I was talking about the SOS debate between Fisher vs. IC and Hartwick. That seems to be what will decide the automatic bid this year, and I think Fisher would have a slight edge in that area (no?). I am no expert on what gets teams into the tournament and what doesn't. I am not thinking that Fisher gets in without the automatic bid. 

[Frank Rossi]

I was talking about the SOS debate between Fisher vs. IC and Hartwick. That seems to be what will decide the automatic bid this year, and I think Fisher would have a slight edge in that area (no?). I am no expert on what gets teams into the tournament and what doesn't. I am not thinking that Fisher gets in without the automatic bid. 

No.  Ithaca would win as of right now pretty easily. 

[redswarm81]

I was talking about the SOS debate between Fisher vs. IC and Hartwick. That seems to be what will decide the automatic bid this year, and I think Fisher would have a slight edge in that area (no?). I am no expert on what gets teams into the tournament and what doesn't. I am not thinking that Fisher gets in without the automatic bid. 

No.  Ithaca would win as of right now pretty easily. 

I'm not sure how you're calculating that.  The fourth tiebreaker (i.e., the only one that counts) is OWP only, right? 

If the season ended today, Hartwick would win the tiebreaker.   However, the numbers will of course change, and Ithaca stands to get a boost in its OWP when it plays Cortland, which would likely shoot Ithaca past Hartwick.  Somewhere I stumbled across a website that calculated OWP for the remaining schedule (based on present records, of course), if I could find that site again it would likely corroborate your testimony.

[Frank Rossi]

I was talking about the SOS debate between Fisher vs. IC and Hartwick. That seems to be what will decide the automatic bid this year, and I think Fisher would have a slight edge in that area (no?). I am no expert on what gets teams into the tournament and what doesn't. I am not thinking that Fisher gets in without the automatic bid. 

No.  Ithaca would win as of right now pretty easily. 

I'm not sure how you're calculating that.  The fourth tiebreaker (i.e., the only one that counts) is OWP only, right? 

If the season ended today, Hartwick would win the tiebreaker.   However, the numbers will of course change, and Ithaca stands to get a boost in its OWP when it plays Cortland, which would likely shoot Ithaca past Hartwick.  Somewhere I stumbled across a website that calculated OWP for the remaining schedule (based on present records, of course), if I could find that site again it would likely corroborate your testimony.

Now add Norwich, Springfield, Utica and Mt. Ida to Hartwick's SoS.  The season doesn't end today for these purposes.

[superman57]

Jose, Congrats.... enjoy the world series

[pg04]

Jose, Congrats.... enjoy the world series

Usually I'm not a baseball guy, but it was pretty exciting to watch!  Good job rays. 

[Caz Bombers]

Jose, Congrats.... enjoy the world series

Seconded...Garza and Price found the stake that could pierce Dracula's heart.  I wouldn't mind if the Phillies won the Series but gratitude demands I pull for the Rays.