FB: Empire 8

[pg04]

me too !

What in the world does this post even reference??

[AUPepBand]

isnt it funny that i have disliked wick since 1987.
when after choosing fisher over wick - i got not one but two nasty phone calls saying that i was making a mistake----and so began fa91's road to disliking hartwick college

I have told this story before....my dislike of 'Wick is not born out of on field football play as we swept Wick in my 'tenure' from '92-95, however, it was their coach in '95 who with the assistance of RPI's coach notified the NCAA that perhaps we had an ineligible OLman.   Ironically the call from the NCAA came soon after we beat 'Wick on a last second FG to go 5-0 on the season.  Outcome: 7-3 season is a 1-9 season in the books....    Apparently, RPI had also recruited the player from Hudson Valley and knew the 'facts' on him

Pep is sure that was the same year that AU's returning starting QB and pre-season All-American defensive back, both Rochester boys, who had helped AU defeat Catholic in D.C. in Week 11 of 1994 (with the guru giving Pep play-by-play of the final three minutes over the phone from the Catholic press box), defected and transferred to Fisher.

Kudos to the guru for providing the play-by-play then, and now providing access to Saxon away games via this site and webcasts! Another reason Pep no longer reads a Sunday newspaper...heck, some don't even run the list of Saturday's scores anymore!

[Bombers798891]

I've always hated that logic Bomber fans bring to Cortaca..."Throw out the records"...the reason we don't want people to know the records is simple...That way, when Bomber teams that have no business losing to Cortland do so, it's an excuse to use, rather than admitting the team underachieved and blew it.

For Example:

1996: A 6-1 IC team--whose only loss was to a D-II AIC, goes to a Cortland team that would end up 6-4 and lose by 28.
1999: 7-1 Bombers face a 4-4 Cortland team in Ithaca, lead 21-7 at the half, lose 26-21
2003: #14 8-1 Bombers face an unranked 4-4 Cortland team at home, lose 16-15
2005: #13 Ithaca faces an "also recieving votes" Cortland at home with a chance to secure a home NCAA playoff game, play a godawful first half, lose in OT

Those are four instances in which a clearly superior IC team lost to a Cortland team that was mediocre.  By contrast, almost all of the recent IC wins have been when IC had a clearly better team:

1998: IC finishes 9-2, Cortland 4-6
2000: IC finishes 7-3, Cortland 4-6
2001: IC finishes 11-2, Cortland 5-5
2004: IC finishes 9-2, Cortland 5-4

None of these finishes should be suprising. It was the better team winning.

Last season might be the only time in the last 15 years that you could possibly argue a better Cortland team was upset by an Ithaca team.  There are games where the talent level is close, and those games tend to go both ways: IC in 1995, Cortland in 1997, Cortland in 2002. But all the "shockers" are Cortland topping IC. If IC wins this year, maybe I'll change my tune. But mostly, I believe the "anything can happen" line is an excuse from IC fans

I don't think you're giving a lot of those C-State teams enough credit....and you can hate that logic all you want, but that doesn't mean the hype and atmosphere of the games have an effect on them.  As cliche as it is, at any level, Rivalry games always are crazy.  I think a great example of this for the Bombers is the years that they had a letdown game vs Buff State in the week after Cortaca.

Whether is Cortaca, the shoes, Johnnie-Tommie, etc....I don't think it's an excuse, I think it's understanding that it's the biggest game of the season.

But the question is, shouldn't the hype and atomsphere have the same effect on teams? It's their rivalry game as much as ours.

I'm not saying those Cortland teams were bad. But, I am saying that there's this mentality from both sides--although I, obviously, only see it from the IC side--that, heading into the game, we can't admit that one team is better than the other because it's a "Rivalry game". I'm a Michigan State fan. Their biggest rival is Michigan. Was their game this season a rivalry game? Yeah. But that doesn't mean that Michigan State should be getting undue congrats for winning it. They were clearly the better team, rivalry game or no. They SHOULD have won the game, so I can't go that nuts over the win

You cannot tell me, for example, that IC wasn't the better team heading into that 2003 game. They'd already beaten a playoff bound Brockprot team by 21. Brockport had beaten Cortland already (IC was the only team to beat Brockport that season). They also beat a SJF team that went 8-3 and wound up beating Cortland. Seriously, Cortland needed a TD with 5 seconds to go to beat a 1-9 William Patterson team. They also only beat 1-9 Kean by three points...they were not that good. Ithaca went to the National QF's that season...Ithaca was the better team.

Also, Dragon, Cortland was an independant in 1999, but playing a lot of NJAC schools...here were their other four wins that year:

0-9 Kean
3-7 Jersey City
2-8 William Patterson
4-6 Springfield

9-30 Total

That's four wins over teams that were terrible. Ithaca's wins weren't terribly impressive, but they did have a win over D-II Mansfield, and Brockport and Hobart teams that finished above .500. The ONLY good team Cortland beat that season was IC. But Ithaca had already beaten better teams than Cortland.

In 2005, other than IC, Cortland's best win came against 6-4 Western Connecticut. IC had already beaten Alfred and SJF. Both teams beat Brockport that year, but their only other common opponent was Buff St. IC won that game by 17, Cortland lost by 7.

Bombers,

One other thing, in 1999, IC had wins over Fisher, Mansfield, St. Lawrence, and Hobart, let's just say Cortland played those teams that season, they would have had a similar record.  As the other poster noted, we played at Wash and Jefferson, Rowan and Montclair when they were both loaded and lost to an NCAA-bound Buff State.  2000 is another story, IC probably had the better team but that series first and goal with less than a minute left still haunts me.

1) But, the point is that all those good teams you played in 1999 you lost to. The only decent team you DID beat was probably IC. IC wasn't a great team, but they were better than the other teams you beat...I will concede perhaps the talent level was closer than I first gave you credit for. But was Cortland definitively better?

2) I can't really buy the 2001 argument. Again, look at your wins:

Buffalo State: 1-8
Jersey City: 1-8
Rowan: 11-2
Kean: 2-7
Utica: 0-8

Yes, the Rowan win was impressive, but those other four teams went a combined 4-31. Now, Ithaca didn't beat anyone terribly impressive...although they destroyed a 5-1 Hobart team 52-13. Again, maybe it was closer than I give it credit for, but come on. This IC team was coming off three wins by an average score of 50-11.. They were flying. There's no way Cortland was the better team, or that this game was a coin flip. IC went into that game knowing they needed to go to the playoffs. Ithaca wound up beating Montclair and RPI on the road with their backup QB in the playoffs

3) As you said, Cortland was better in 2002 and 2006...and they won both games...

4) There's still no defense for '03 and '05.

So, I guess, my main question still stands: When was the last time IC upset a clearly better Cortland team? Has it ever really happened? As I said, there are games that are even, or roughly even, and they can go both ways...but anytime something unexpected happens, it's Cortland upsetting IC

[fisheralum91]

kon artist-
you got burned.
face it
you spoke too soon and needed to take a shot.
yea i played soccer at fisher.
how many guys on here never laced up a single shoe cleat or skate flappin their gums.
yes you indeed are a tool.

[Jonny Utah]

I've always hated that logic Bomber fans bring to Cortaca..."Throw out the records"...the reason we don't want people to know the records is simple...That way, when Bomber teams that have no business losing to Cortland do so, it's an excuse to use, rather than admitting the team underachieved and blew it.

For Example:

1996: A 6-1 IC team--whose only loss was to a D-II AIC, goes to a Cortland team that would end up 6-4 and lose by 28.
1999: 7-1 Bombers face a 4-4 Cortland team in Ithaca, lead 21-7 at the half, lose 26-21
2003: #14 8-1 Bombers face an unranked 4-4 Cortland team at home, lose 16-15
2005: #13 Ithaca faces an "also recieving votes" Cortland at home with a chance to secure a home NCAA playoff game, play a godawful first half, lose in OT

Those are four instances in which a clearly superior IC team lost to a Cortland team that was mediocre.  By contrast, almost all of the recent IC wins have been when IC had a clearly better team:

1998: IC finishes 9-2, Cortland 4-6
2000: IC finishes 7-3, Cortland 4-6
2001: IC finishes 11-2, Cortland 5-5
2004: IC finishes 9-2, Cortland 5-4

None of these finishes should be suprising. It was the better team winning.

Last season might be the only time in the last 15 years that you could possibly argue a better Cortland team was upset by an Ithaca team.  There are games where the talent level is close, and those games tend to go both ways: IC in 1995, Cortland in 1997, Cortland in 2002. But all the "shockers" are Cortland topping IC. If IC wins this year, maybe I'll change my tune. But mostly, I believe the "anything can happen" line is an excuse from IC fans

I don't think you're giving a lot of those C-State teams enough credit....and you can hate that logic all you want, but that doesn't mean the hype and atmosphere of the games have an effect on them.  As cliche as it is, at any level, Rivalry games always are crazy.  I think a great example of this for the Bombers is the years that they had a letdown game vs Buff State in the week after Cortaca.

Whether is Cortaca, the shoes, Johnnie-Tommie, etc....I don't think it's an excuse, I think it's understanding that it's the biggest game of the season.

But the question is, shouldn't the hype and atomsphere have the same effect on teams? It's their rivalry game as much as ours.

I'm not saying those Cortland teams were bad. But, I am saying that there's this mentality from both sides--although I, obviously, only see it from the IC side--that, heading into the game, we can't admit that one team is better than the other because it's a "Rivalry game". I'm a Michigan State fan. Their biggest rival is Michigan. Was their game this season a rivalry game? Yeah. But that doesn't mean that Michigan State should be getting undue congrats for winning it. They were clearly the better team, rivalry game or no. They SHOULD have won the game, so I can't go that nuts over the win

You cannot tell me, for example, that IC wasn't the better team heading into that 2003 game. They'd already beaten a playoff bound Brockprot team by 21. Brockport had beaten Cortland already (IC was the only team to beat Brockport that season). They also beat a SJF team that went 8-3 and wound up beating Cortland. Seriously, Cortland needed a TD with 5 seconds to go to beat a 1-9 William Patterson team. They also only beat 1-9 Kean by three points...they were not that good. Ithaca went to the National QF's that season...Ithaca was the better team.

Also, Dragon, Cortland was an independant in 1999, but playing a lot of NJAC schools...here were their other four wins that year:

0-9 Kean
3-7 Jersey City
2-8 William Patterson
4-6 Springfield

9-30 Total

That's four wins over teams that were terrible. Ithaca's wins weren't terribly impressive, but they did have a win over D-II Mansfield, and Brockport and Hobart teams that finished above .500. The ONLY good team Cortland beat that season was IC. But Ithaca had already beaten better teams than Cortland.

In 2005, other than IC, Cortland's best win came against 6-4 Western Connecticut. IC had already beaten Alfred and SJF. Both teams beat Brockport that year, but their only other common opponent was Buff St. IC won that game by 17, Cortland lost by 7.

Bombers,

One other thing, in 1999, IC had wins over Fisher, Mansfield, St. Lawrence, and Hobart, let's just say Cortland played those teams that season, they would have had a similar record.  As the other poster noted, we played at Wash and Jefferson, Rowan and Montclair when they were both loaded and lost to an NCAA-bound Buff State.  2000 is another story, IC probably had the better team but that series first and goal with less than a minute left still haunts me.

1) But, the point is that all those good teams you played in 1999 you lost to. The only decent team you DID beat was probably IC. IC wasn't a great team, but they were better than the other teams you beat...I will concede perhaps the talent level was closer than I first gave you credit for. But was Cortland definitively better?

2) I can't really buy the 2001 argument. Again, look at your wins:

Buffalo State: 1-8
Jersey City: 1-8
Rowan: 11-2
Kean: 2-7
Utica: 0-8

Yes, the Rowan win was impressive, but those other four teams went a combined 4-31. Now, Ithaca didn't beat anyone terribly impressive...although they destroyed a 5-1 Hobart team 52-13. Again, maybe it was closer than I give it credit for, but come on. This IC team was coming off three wins by an average score of 50-11.. They were flying. There's no way Cortland was the better team, or that this game was a coin flip. IC went into that game knowing they needed to go to the playoffs. Ithaca wound up beating Montclair and RPI on the road with their backup QB in the playoffs

3) As you said, Cortland was better in 2002 and 2006...and they won both games...

4) There's still no defense for '03 and '05.

So, I guess, my main question still stands: When was the last time IC upset a clearly better Cortland team? Has it ever really happened? As I said, there are games that are even, or roughly even, and they can go both ways...but anytime something unexpected happens, it's Cortland upsetting IC

I just remember in 1996 Ithacas first game versus Mansfield whom we beat 59-23 (could have been 99-23).  The week before Cortland had lost to them 18-0 and I always remember going into the cortland game thinking there was no way we were going to lose to them and were looking ahead to the Buff St. game which always meant the playoffs.  A few big plays here and there and we got smoked by Cortland before the fans came on the field and got some helmets upside the head.  What a crappy game.

[SJF Fan]

isnt it funny that i have disliked wick since 1987.
when after choosing fisher over wick - i got not one but two nasty phone calls saying that i was making a mistake----and so began fa91's road to disliking hartwick college

If you played soccer, and the chance to play at Wick, it was probably a mistake to play at Fisher, where all you needed was a pulse to put on the Umbros.

I don't like Wick because they are scrappy, and give Fisher fits. On paper, its a team that we should blast, on the field, it just seems to be a different story.

[fisheralum91]

would have never seen any pt at wick-- d1 school for soccer.
would have had to walk on too.

fisher was the right choice- tho you are somewhat right- we were bad.

[KonArtist33]

kon artist-
you got burned.
face it
you spoke too soon and needed to take a shot.
yea i played soccer at fisher.
how many guys on here never laced up a single shoe cleat or skate flappin their gums.
yes you indeed are a tool.

Sorry. Just assumed people would reference football on a football discussion board. I think it's great that you didn't play football at any level but are still a fan. We need more fans like you, especially on the D-3 level.

It's just there's no need to have a complex because 20 years ago you weren't able to hack it at the Wick. 

[theoriginalupstate]

kon artist-
you got burned.
face it
you spoke too soon and needed to take a shot.
yea i played soccer at fisher.
how many guys on here never laced up a single shoe cleat or skate flappin their gums.
yes you indeed are a tool.

Sorry. Just assumed people would reference football on a football discussion board. I think it's great that you didn't play football at any level but are still a fan. We need more fans like you, especially on the D-3 level.

It's just there's no need to have a complex because 20 years ago you weren't able to hack it at the Wick. 

Are you kidding me?

People at wick now cant hack it, they're just lucky to have Team Boltus carry them every week....

[AUPepBand]

The front page survey asks which game will "live up to the hype..."

Is Ithaca playing Alfred?

[maxpower]

kon artist-
you got burned.
face it
you spoke too soon and needed to take a shot.
yea i played soccer at fisher.
how many guys on here never laced up a single shoe cleat or skate flappin their gums.
yes you indeed are a tool.

Sorry. Just assumed people would reference football on a football discussion board. I think it's great that you didn't play football at any level but are still a fan. We need more fans like you, especially on the D-3 level.

It's just there's no need to have a complex because 20 years ago you weren't able to hack it at the Wick. 

Are you kidding me?

People at wick now cant hack it, they're just lucky to have Team Boltus carry them every week....

Does a rock need to breathe and walk to be successful as a rock? Then how can we say a rock is a lifeless being?

[fisheralum91]

kon artist-
you really need to do homework before you come on here and spout.
hmmm coudnt hack it--- no i could have made the team but not played- wasnt recruited by d1 schools.
didnt bother me.
that was just the beginning of the dislike for wick.
like you said- i have 20 years of other reasons to dislike wick.
and as for not playing football-im a fan--like many others on here that never played--always loved the sport and suppported the team....
i can see your mentality by mocking with feild hockey(must be a girl) reference- and the soccer(must not be a real sport) slams. very mature.
glad to see the education is expanding our intellect.

[AUKaz00]

There's nothing wrong with playing or enjoying either football.  I must admit, I get more exited for a US MNT match than just about any other sporting event.  And just thinking about both matches with the dirty Tris is making me wish it was December already so I can find out what our draw will be in the hex for WC qualifying so I'll know when Landon will have his next opportunity to piss on Mexican soil!

But first, the Saxons need to cancel the Bombers' flight request to the NCAA tournament. 
On Saxon Warriors!!!

[JQV]

There's nothing wrong with playing or enjoying either football.  I must admit, I get more exited for a US MNT match than just about any other sporting event.  And just thinking about both matches with the dirty Tris is making me wish it was December already so I can find out what our draw will be in the hex for WC qualifying so I'll know when Landon will have his next opportunity to piss on Mexican soil!

But first, the Saxons need to cancel the Bombers' flight request to the NCAA tournament. 
On Saxon Warriors!!!

I don't know what any of this means.

EDIT: Read it two more times and still have no idea...

[realistic]

you couldn't be more Southern.

The comish is refering to the sport that those across the pond refer to as Football.  US MNT is US Men's National Team WC is world Cup and Landon is Landon Donovan.