FB: Empire 8

[SJFF82]

The Regions should either stay separate come play-off time, or just wipe em out and seed the top 32.  Why have alleged geographical regions if you are just going to ignore them come play off time anyway.  

You know that this is basically what they do do, just with the 500-mile radius for travel as the overriding factor.

Yep...hence my "second and third thought" change.  I see they do that but the mileage thing puts us right back into regions wtih MUC in the East.  I'll spring for the travel costs to bring the next best #1 seed into the East if the Committee cannot tolerate a 9-1 Cortland as our #1. 

Again....NCAA HAS BILLIONS....i am going to be a socialist for a minute...JT close your eyes....SPREAD THE DAMN WEALTH NCAA!   One lousy 30 sec. GoDaddy.com commercial during the SouthwestDryCleaners Bowl between 6-5 Buffalo and 6-5 Eastern Tenn St. on December 15 could easily pay for all our travels...

[dewcrew88]

Hey,
Not to interrupt this lovefest, but I'll be in town this weekend and need some opinion on whether to go to Carnegie Mellon-Hobart or St. Lawrence-Alfred as a precursor to Rochester-St. John Fisher.

Opinions appreciated (although the 1 pm kick at Alfred might become my "overriding factor" since I fly in Saturday morning).

Also if any board regular would be at either game, that would be nice to know.

wow, I was just thinking today that it would be good for a D3.COM rep to check out the Courage Bowl and what it is all about in as much as it has wonderful implications for the Camp Good Days kids (kids with terminal illnesses).  Are you in touch with the programs?   There are many behind the scenes aspects involving the kids as honorary captains; they attend practices all week and are on the sidelines for the game.  It is an awesome 'program' for the week. Hopefully you will be taking in some of that it even getting here on Sat.  Would be nice to see a d3.com story on those aspects of the 'game' this week.

Have fun and safe travels.

I've never been able to get to a game out there, but I wrote a story about Gary Mervis and the Courage Bowl for the regional column before.

[realistic]

Hey,
Not to interrupt this lovefest, but I'll be in town this weekend and need some opinion on whether to go to Carnegie Mellon-Hobart or St. Lawrence-Alfred as a precursor to Rochester-St. John Fisher.

Opinions appreciated (although the 1 pm kick at Alfred might become my "overriding factor" since I fly in Saturday morning).

Also if any board regular would be at either game, that would be nice to know.

With no real basis, I'd say go to CMU-Hobart.

I'd agree.  I don't see the Larries giving Alfred much of a game.

[AUPepBand]

The Regions should either stay separate come play-off time, or just wipe em out and seed the top 32.  Why have alleged geographical regions if you are just going to ignore them come play off time anyway.  

You know that this is basically what they do do, just with the 500-mile radius for travel as the overriding factor.

Like doggy do poo do do?

Sorry, Pat, Pep hates it when he ends up saying two "dos" together. Some suggest Pep needs counseling. Heck, Pep doesn't suffer from insanity...he enjoys every minute of it!

[AUPepBand]

Hey,
Not to interrupt this lovefest, but I'll be in town this weekend and need some opinion on whether to go to Carnegie Mellon-Hobart or St. Lawrence-Alfred as a precursor to Rochester-St. John Fisher.

Opinions appreciated (although the 1 pm kick at Alfred might become my "overriding factor" since I fly in Saturday morning).

Also if any board regular would be at either game, that would be nice to know.

With no real basis, I'd say go to CMU-Hobart.

I'd agree.  I don't see the Larries giving Alfred much of a game.

While Pep hopes the Saxons handle the Saints, it IS Homecoming at Merrill FIeld and Pep would be happy to give K-Mack a tour of the temporarily condemned bleachers. It will be a festive atmosphere with the annual appearance of AU student clown-turned-long snapper alum Mark O'Meara, who is good for three cheers led with his vintage 1970s red horn. Should be a decent crowd...and there's always that AU Pep Band!

[maxpower]

Again....NCAA HAS BILLIONS....i am going to be a socialist for a minute...JT close your eyes....SPREAD THE DAMN WEALTH NCAA!   One lousy 30 sec. GoDaddy.com commercial during the SouthwestDryCleaners Bowl between 6-5 Buffalo and 6-5 Eastern Tenn St. on December 15 could easily pay for all our travels...

Can't resist this 82.... but in your scenario would you be the one GETTING the check or GIVING it?




EDIT: This reminds me of George Will--GEORGE FREAKIN' WILL--writing a column in Time Magazine about how baseball needs a luxury tax and revenue sharing.

[HScoach]

The Regions should either stay separate come play-off time, or just wipe em out and seed the top 32.  Why have alleged geographical regions if you are just going to ignore them come play off time anyway.  

You know that this is basically what they do do, just with the 500-mile radius for travel as the overriding factor.

Yep...hence my "second and third thought" change.  I see they do that but the mileage thing puts us right back into regions wtih MUC in the East.   I'll spring for the travel costs to bring the next best #1 seed into the East if the Committee cannot tolerate a 9-1 Cortland as our #1. 

Again....NCAA HAS BILLIONS....i am going to be a socialist for a minute...JT close your eyes....SPREAD THE DAMN WEALTH NCAA!   One lousy 30 sec. GoDaddy.com commercial during the SouthwestDryCleaners Bowl between 6-5 Buffalo and 6-5 Eastern Tenn St. on December 15 could easily pay for all our travels...

I've really enjoyed the East Region match-ups.  It provides some excitement for the early rounds because it's a new opponent and you never know what you're going to get in D3 across regions/conferences with so little long distance regular season games.  It's alway fun to see someone new. 

I realize if I was an east region guy, I'd be pissed beyond belief that Mount got moved into MY region.  But as Mount guy it's been a wonderful experience.  Playing Ithaca, Fisher, Hobart, New Jersey and Cortland has been a lot more interesting than the historical North Region pairings.

For what it's worth, I still believe that if Cortland wouldn't have gotten drilled by Ithaca in week 10 last year, Mount never comes east in '08.  An undefeated Cortland State would have been an easy #1 seed. 

For '09 I think the east needs to pull for North Central to win the CCIW instead of Wheaton.  With NCC already having lost to Ohio Northern, if they can beat Wheaton to take the conference title it eliminates the North Region's 2nd toughest conference from having an undefeated team like there was last season.  If the only other undefeated teams in the North are teams like Wabash or Case Western, there is no way Mount is being shipped out and leaving one of them as the North's #1 seed. 

What could also screw all this up is Linfield and Whitewater going undefeated in the West.  Whitewater has already been shipped to the North once and could do so again if the East needs an undefeated and the North only has one real team (Mount).  Then MUC goes East and Whitewater goes North.

It's way too early to be thinking about Week 11, but it beats talking about nothing.........



Good luck to SJF the rest of the year.  You were gracious hosts in the opener and I admire the balls it takes to schedule MUC.

[dlippiel]

What could also screw all this up is Linfield and Whitewater going undefeated in the West.

dlip is thinking Linfield is back for sure and expects big things from them here in 09.

[WICB Sports]

#25 Ithaca welcomes Widener to Butterfield Stadium this Saturday. You can hear the Bombers take on The Pride on 92 WICB (91.7FM) or online at WICB.org. Countdown to Kickoff gets things started at 12:30 with the game kicking off at 1:00. After the game, stay tuned for Bombers Postgame and your chance to win two free tickets to Cortaca by calling in to answer the Bombers Trivia Question.

[E8]

Right on cue, 82.

If SJFC played their best football on Saturday Night and UofR played THEIR best football as well , the score would be (in my opinion only) Fisher: 62  UofR: 24.  But we all know that you can throw records and statistcs out for this game, for UofR always plays Fisher tough.   It is Courage Bowl V, and UofR has yet to beat Fisher.... if UofR does not win another game this year, but beats Fisher in this game...it will be as if they won the Stagg Bowl. 

UofR likes to bring a lot of pressure from their base defense (3-4) so Fisher needs to be ready for that .   If Fisher give's Bailey time...lights out.   Their front three are not game changers, but their linebackers are not too shabby.   If Fisher's running backs can get to the 2nd level...lights out.

If Fisher lets UofR's tailback, Onyrucka (forgive the spelling), run free... Fisher is in trouble.  This will be the best RB that Fisher has seen so far (and yes, that includes MUC) and they need to gang tackle him.   He could be the wrinkle that keeps this game close.   If he has 60+ rushing yards in the first half, this game will be close going into halftime. 

UofR likes the trick plays early, and will try to test the DBs/Safeties of Fisher early as well.   If using game film as an indicator, why wouldn't opposing coaches try it?

The D-Line of Fisher could have a big day against UR's young OL.   

With all of  this being said, UofR is a dangerous opponent as Salisbury looms large for Fisher next Saturday.

[Bombers798891]

If it was going to be a big game last year, then it is a big game. 

This is the difference...i really dont think the game was huge anymore, even last year.  Not after all the blow-outs.  I agree it was touted by SJF posters, myself included, after the '06 game, but it definately cooled and almost disappeared leading up to the game these past few months.

I mene Supes evin disapeered!!! 

I think this is what makes college sports so unique. You get those few special kids together on a team, and a window opens. But, unlike professional sports, there's a shorter lifeline for that.

Fisher was downright nasty in 2006 and if that game were played in SJF, who knows? But, guys graduate and if the pipeline's not refilled, well, the marquee matchup turns into something a little less marquee.

Heck, all these D-I schedules get mapped 7-8 years in advance. I know it isn't like that for D-III, but still I mean, who knows right? Teams get terrible, teams get great, sometimes unexpectedly. And sometimes, the short timeframe renders expectation moot.

For example, a lot of talk might be made in a few months about how Alfred hasn't won at Butterfield in however long (or is it ever? I always forget). But half of these guys weren't there in 2007 and probably none were there in 2005. So how relevant really is that anecdote? It's quirky, and yes, I am aware that there are, sometimes, teams that just can't seem to win a certain game, in a certain place or at a certain temperature. But in the college game, I feel these matter less. Tom Secky's in charge of that offense at Alfred, and since he wasn't there at any other time, I'm not going to be put at ease by a "Yeah, but they never win here."

Ultimately, SJF-MUC 2006 probably shouldn't have caused a ton of excitement for SJF-MUC because it wasn't a given that SJF would be that talented again. (This logic holds true regardless of the teams involved, I'm just using the example brought up.) So often in college sport, we have to look at things on almost a year-by-year basis.

[AUPepBand]

For example, a lot of talk might be made in a few months about how Alfred hasn't won at Butterfield in however long (or is it ever? I always forget). But half of these guys weren't there in 2007 and probably none were there in 2005. So how relevant really is that anecdote? It's quirky, and yes, I am aware that there are, sometimes, teams that just can't seem to win a certain game, in a certain place or at a certain temperature. But in the college game, I feel these matter less. Tom Secky's in charge of that offense at Alfred, and since he wasn't there at any other time, I'm not going to be put at ease by a "Yeah, but they never win here."

Well, since you were wondering, Pep went to the "record books." When Pep hits the record books, you know it's been awhile. All of AU's wins at Ithaca came before it was called Butterfield Stadium. In fact, most probably came before South Hill Field was built....anyone know when the Bombers first called that home? But here are Alfred's wins (and ties) at Ithaca:

1938--Alfred and Ithaca played to a 20-20 tie
1951--Alfred 33, Ithaca 0
1953--Alfred 41, Ithaca 6
1955--Alfred 26, Ithaca 0
1961--Alfred 14, Ithaca 7
1976--Alfred 3, Ithaca 3 (tie)...Pep was there. Pep thinks Lois described it in Wasn't That Fun? as the most boring game ever witnessed. Funny thing about that, a week or so later, the Saxons handed then-powerful St. Lawrence its lone loss that year, a 3-2 Saxon win at Canton! Pep listened to that one on the radio.
1982--Alfred 20, Ithaca 7

BTW, Pep assumes the Ooga Booga Man will be at Butterfield this Saterday, but has anyone heard anything of the First Down Club?

[K-Mack]

I realize if I was an east region guy, I'd be pissed beyond belief that Mount got moved into MY region.  But as Mount guy it's been a wonderful experience.  Playing Ithaca, Fisher, Hobart, New Jersey and Cortland has been a lot more interesting than the historical North Region pairings.

For what it's worth, I still believe that if Cortland wouldn't have gotten drilled by Ithaca in week 10 last year, Mount never comes east in '08.  An undefeated Cortland State would have been an easy #1 seed. 

All the posts on this topic are good.

One thing the "east region" guys would do well to do is put the shoe on the other foot. I realize this involves some disbelief, but imagine Mount Union in a down year, 8-2 or 9-1, and the rest of the North and South region teams within 500 miles having a loss. Wesley, W&J whoever all 9-1. And then you have, say, Cortland/Rowan at 10-0, as well as the Empire 8 champion or the MAC champion.

Wouldn't you prefer the two "east region" teams be No. 1 seeds rather than forcing one of them to be a No. 2 in the East when you could easily build a bracket around a team based in S. New Jersey or Eastern Pa. and another around a team in New York?

I understand what we're saying about the emphasis on regional competition as playoff criteria and then not having true regions in the playoffs. It's weird, but you have to separate the two. I've tried to stop calling them regional brackets because they don't have to be, and geography allows for a lot of crossover in the midwest, mid-Atlantic and Northeast.

I agree about Cortland last year too, FWIW.

[Ralph Turner]

I realize if I was an east region guy, I'd be pissed beyond belief that Mount got moved into MY region.  But as Mount guy it's been a wonderful experience.  Playing Ithaca, Fisher, Hobart, New Jersey and Cortland has been a lot more interesting than the historical North Region pairings.

For what it's worth, I still believe that if Cortland wouldn't have gotten drilled by Ithaca in week 10 last year, Mount never comes east in '08.  An undefeated Cortland State would have been an easy #1 seed.  

All the posts on this topic are good.

One thing the "east region" guys would do well to do is put the shoe on the other foot. I realize this involves some disbelief, but imagine Mount Union in a down year, 8-2 or 9-1, and the rest of the North and South region teams within 500 miles having a loss. Wesley, W&J whoever all 9-1. And then you have, say, Cortland/Rowan at 10-0, as well as the Empire 8 champion or the MAC champion.

Wouldn't you prefer the two "east region" teams be No. 1 seeds rather than forcing one of them to be a No. 2 in the East when you could easily build a bracket around a team based in S. New Jersey or Eastern Pa. and another around a team in New York?

I understand what we're saying about the emphasis on regional competition as playoff criteria and then not having true regions in the playoffs. It's weird, but you have to separate the two. I've tried to stop calling them regional brackets because they don't have to be, and geography allows for a lot of crossover in the midwest, mid-Atlantic and Northeast.

I agree about Cortland last year too, FWIW.

The practical impact of the ECFC, beginning in 2011, will be that the East Region will be almost self-contained.  

Pool A --  6 bids

ECFC, NEFC, E8 (thanks to their new affiliates Salisbury and Frostburg), NJAC, LL, MAC

Look at teams that are closer to the "East Region" (or the northernmost and easternmost) bracket than Mount Union.

Pool B candidates (I think that there will be one Pool B bid in 2011)  CWRU/CMU; Wesley

Pool C:  I think that there will be 6 Pool C bids to let in 2011.

Pool A conferences in the South that might be moved to a more "eastern" bracket:  Pres AC, ODAC, Centennial.

It is almost as if the "ECFC" helps erect a wall against MUC being moved eastward.

[JQV]

Heck, all these D-I schedules get mapped 7-8 years in advance. I know it isn't like that for D-III, but still I mean, who knows right? Teams get terrible, teams get great, sometimes unexpectedly. And sometimes, the short timeframe renders expectation moot.

798891, I don't think there is a D1 equivalent here.  D1 programs don't fluctuate that much.  Some random schools put together good years every now and again but for the most part, the daddies stay the daddies (unless they do something stupid like Notre Dame and sign with NBC and giveaway all that conference money).

You are right about D3, the inability to truly "reload," because recruiting is much more difficult when kids have to cut checks, makes it fun.

I understand what we're saying about the emphasis on regional competition as playoff criteria and then not having true regions in the playoffs. It's weird, but you have to separate the two. I've tried to stop calling them regional brackets because they don't have to be, and geography allows for a lot of crossover in the midwest, mid-Atlantic and Northeast.

I agree about Cortland last year too, FWIW.

KMack.

I think you are right about the Mount issue when you look at it from the North Region's perspective but we aren't inclined to think like that.  An unspoken part of the problem may be that there are only three teams with a realistic hope of winning the whole damn thing.  So, in the end, we are all playing for regional superiority and that gets hard to determine with the elephant in our region.

It leaves us to argue about strength of conference and key wins (which can at least occupy us during the down months) without one East Region Champion, that runs the gauntlet of East Region conferences, to go and face Mount in the Semis.

Finally, since I am on perpetual watch for crap sportscasters have tried to sell us as relevant sport analysis, I am calling this out E8.  What, exactly, does this expression mean?

But we all know that you can throw records and statistcs out for this game