FB: Empire 8

[JQV]

What if they just want it more? 

What if they leave it on the field?

What if they have their game face on?

Then is Fisher in trouble?

[Bombers798891]

Attitude and desire wins over talent.

Not once in the history of sports has this ever been true.  I don't care how many times ESPN, No Fear, and coaches of JV High School teams repeat it.

Amen. You can watch Rudy as many times as you want; the reality is that almost all the time, the better team wins. You either make the plays an execute, or you go home. Like Buffalo State's not going to come in with "attitude and desire"? They should want to win this game as much as Fisher.

[sjfcards]

Lots of good posts this week about Fisher football. Defintely a lack of a desire on and off the field vs MUC. This being my 4th Fisher, MUC game I thought Fisher would put together a game plan that would be more competitive. Mistakes do happen, good coaching and the ability to make adjustments should of kept this a good match-up. Yes Fisher looked good against the run, but MUC could of put up a seventy if the continued to pass. Even the tight ends were wide open. Hopefully they will be prepared to play this week vs Buff State.

I think they can forget about the MUC game.  The real season begins now for them I think.  I think Fisher should handle Buff State pretty handily.   I've been wrong before, however.  Too bad there isn't a Buff State repesentative on the boards to discuss their team.  There actually used to be one. 

I 100% agree with your post. Fisher said it straight in the newspaper article before the season started. "they would love to win the MUC game, but the season really starts and finshes with the conference games. Especially Ithaca and Alfred. I think tonight is a big game for Fisher to prove to themselves they are a good team, and they can get rolling from here on out.

[JQV]

I can't take it anymore.  What is with all the revisionist history from you Fisher people?

Two years ago, after you lost to MUC in the Region finals, all you wanted to talk about was how SJF was now on the National stage and how the home-and-home with MUC would show the nation that you deserved to be in the conversation with MUC, UWW, et al. 

Then, after last year's loss, all we heard was, 'just wait until they come to Pittsford.' 

Now it was just a trial balloon and not a big deal that they squashed you?  Can you really argue with a straight face that Fisher treated that game like a pre-season game after building up to it for three straight years?

I think Fisher deserves a lot of credit for going out and poking the bear.  But don't cheapen that by turning around and say  that you really didn't care about the game, didn't think you could win, won't let it affect your season, etc. 

If you would have accepted credit for a win, you have to take the loss too and not just roll it under the rug like it wasn't supposed to be your program's crowning moment.

[maninyellowhat]

Attitude and desire wins over talent.

Not once in the history of sports has this ever been true.  I don't care how many times ESPN, No Fear, and coaches of JV High School teams repeat it.

Sorry Q, have to disagree.  Saw it firsthand with my 8th grade girls volleyball team last year.

[Knightstalker]

Attitude and desire wins over talent.

Not once in the history of sports has this ever been true.  I don't care how many times ESPN, No Fear, and coaches of JV High School teams repeat it.

I think another team of Cardinals kind of proved that Attitude and Desire can win over talent.  You can't tell me that the Arizona Cardinals have more talent than the Eagles.  The Cardinals got to the Super Bowl and Played so well more on Attitude and Desire than their overall talent.

[pg04]

I can't take it anymore.  What is with all the revisionist history from you Fisher people?

Two years ago, after you lost to MUC in the Region finals, all you wanted to talk about was how SJF was now on the National stage and how the home-and-home with MUC would show the nation that you deserved to be in the conversation with MUC, UWW, et al. 

Then, after last year's loss, all we heard was, 'just wait until they come to Pittsford.' 

Now it was just a trial balloon and not a big deal that they squashed you?  Can you really argue with a straight face that Fisher treated that game like a pre-season game after building up to it for three straight years?

I think Fisher deserves a lot of credit for going out and poking the bear.  But don't cheapen that by turning around and say  that you really didn't care about the game, didn't think you could win, won't let it affect your season, etc. 

If you would have accepted credit for a win, you have to take the loss too and not just roll it under the rug like it wasn't supposed to be your program's crowning moment.

Not that I'm a fisher person obviously, but in the scheme of things the game doesn't really mean anything, especially if Fisher ends up winning the rest of their games.    If they focus on the MUC game, I think it would just bring them down.  It's the best thing for them to do to just move on.  

[JQV]

I think another team of Cardinals kind of proved that Attitude and Desire can win over talent.  You can't tell me that the Arizona Cardinals have more talent than the Eagles.  The Cardinals got to the Super Bowl and Played so well more on Attitude and Desire than their overall talent.

I can't?  They had a former NFL MVP QB having a career year.  Two of the top 5 receivers in the NFL.  Two of the top 20 RBs in the NFL.  Three first round picks in the secondary.  Two first round picks on the DL.  

Philly had the ghost of Donovan McNabb, a dinged up Westbrook that hasn't been Westbrook in years, two fast but otherwise unremarkable receivers, and an aging defense that had lost a step.

Just because Arizona was a joke for a decade doesn't mean they didn't have the most talent.

[pg04]

I think another team of Cardinals kind of proved that Attitude and Desire can win over talent.  You can't tell me that the Arizona Cardinals have more talent than the Eagles.  The Cardinals got to the Super Bowl and Played so well more on Attitude and Desire than their overall talent.

I can't?  They had a former NFL MVP QB having a career year.  Two of the top 5 receivers in the NFL.  Two of the top 20 RBs in the NFL.  Three first round picks in the secondary.  Two first round picks on the DL.  

Philly had the ghost of Donovan McNabb, a dinged up Westbrook that hasn't been Westbrook in years, two fast but otherwise unremarkable receivers, and an aging defense that had lost a step.

Just because Arizona was a joke for a decade doesn't mean they didn't have the most talent.

OK, then explain the 1980 U.S Olympic Hockey team. 

[JQV]

Not that I'm a fisher person obviously, but in the scheme of things the game doesn't really mean anything, especially if Fisher ends up winning the rest of their games.    If they focus on the MUC game, I think it would just bring them down.  It's the best thing for them to do to just move on.  

It might not matter for the NCAA's math but it does matter when something you built up so much falls so flat.  

Of course it will bring them down.  Of course they should just move on.  But that doesn't mean they should pretend like they never thought they were going to shock the world.  That is my only point.

[JQV]

OK, then explain the 1980 U.S Olympic Hockey team. 

I know nothing about hockey because I grew up in Tampa and have only ice skated once.

Nevertheless here are two arguments:

1) Everyone time you hear about that team you hear they were "just a bunch of college kids."  That makes it sound like they were playing intramural floor hockey and drinking beer when Herb Brooks rolled up in a van the week before the tourney and said "can anyone here skate?"

In reality they were all elite D1 athletes playing hockey full time at the US' best collegiate programs.  Just because they were younger doesn't mean they were less talented.  In fact, the Russians' age and longstanding dominance may have hurt them because their talent could have been fading.  I know nothing about the Russian team.

2) Herb Brooks was apparently a pretty innovative coach that, from what I hear, devised a pretty unique strategy no one had ever seen before.  Maybe their scheme was better.  Maybe they executed better.

I never said the most talented team always wins.  I just said that "desire" "attitude" "will" or any other bull**** cliche used by coaches beats talent.  Ever.

EDIT:  Let me add this.  Just because the TV analysts of the era thought the Russians were the better team doesn't mean it was an upset.  Most sports analysts are idiots and create upsets through bad analysis.

[pg04]

I never said the most talented team always wins.  I just said that "desire" "attitude" "will" or any other bull**** cliche used by coaches beats talent.  Ever.

Nice backtrack.  You just tried to argue that Arizona had the most talent to prove your point.  And you don't need to know anything about hockey to know about the 1980 olympic team.  In absolutely no way was the U.S team more talented than the Soviets.   

[JQV]

How did I backtrack?  Arizona was more talented.  They did not beat Philly because of their "attitude."

Similarly, the US Hockey team did not beat the Soviets because of their "attitude."  I don't know if they are more talented or not.  I know ESPN Classic doesn't want them to be.  Even if they weren't, there is another explanation for their win.

Show me where I said the most talented team wins 100% of the time.

[fisheralum91]

e8
what injuries are there for fisher- i havent heard anything.....

[pg04]

Well if "not once" has attitude and desire won over talent, then talent always wins over attitude and desire.

I know it's not "exactly" saying the talented team wins 100% of the time, but I believe that's what your inital implication was.