FB: Empire 8

[Bombers798891]

My E8 rankings after six weeks:

2. Fisher— Another tough loss to Salisbury pretty much dashes the Pool A hopes. And the Pool C ones took a hit with Cortland falling to 3-3 and Otterbein losing their third (with a 4th on the way next week). But this is still a very good team, that is flat out loaded on offense. I don't see them losing the rest of the year. Will it be enough? I don't know, but they're not getting a lot of help from their OOC slate.

I am wondering what everyone thinks about what Fisher would have been in Fenton had started the past 2 years, and Kramer had been in his current role? Those Fisher teams were limited on offense, and As good as Kramer is, he just wasn't a QB. This years team seems to be a bit of the opposite. They can score but have not stopped teams as consistently. I am not sure what I think on the topic yet, but thought I would throw it out there.

I don't know about two year's ago, but last year it would have made a difference and may have change some of the outcomes. Two year's ago SJF faced some very good teams with a very good defenses. I think the Defense two years ago was very decent, but gave up a lot in the big games.

Well, in 2011 they allowed 56, 41, and 45 points in their losses. What game do they lose that year that they win with Fenti?

As for last year, you could say this  version of Fenti might help them win some games, but we don't know if he would have been this good last year. As an example:

Dan Juvan, regular season 2006: 12 TD, 8 INT, 61.1% completion, 185 YPG
Dan Juvan, regular season 2007: 22 TD, 5 INT, 63.5% completion, 230 YPG

Some guys make "the leap". Others are pretty consistent (Tom Secky comes to mind) for their whole careers. We don't know if Fenti was being underutilized, or if he just wasn't ready for the role.

[Upstate]

Well, in 2011 they allowed 56, 41, and 45 points in their losses. What game do they lose that year that they win with Fenti?

That offense was just painful to watch in 2011 and 2012. If they couldn't run the ball they were toast those two years. I'll just pick the Hobart game as an example, first of all this is no slight against Bart at all, they took us to the woodshed. However the start of the game was just completely horrendous for Kramer and SJF.

First Series
0-0
5 plays, 14 yds and 1:19 elapsed.
Kramer- 1/3 8 yds.

Second Series:
0-7
5 plays, 3 yds and 2:09 elapsed.
Kramer- 0/2

Third Series:
0-14
3 plays, 1 yd and 1:06 elapsed
Kramer- 0/1

Fourth Series:
0-21
3 plays, 3 yds and 1:00 elapsed
Kramer 0/2

I'm not saying it's Kramer's fault at all but they could not get out of their own way on offense, in part due to Bart's much improved D from the previous year. They had 1 first down I believe in 4 possessions and a whopping 5 minutes of possession. They put the D in horrible position the entire first half and Bart capitalized each time, again a testament to Bart's team.

If they have a more consistent offense or at least an offense that could move the ball they "probably" don't go into halftime trailing 28-7. Kramer finished 7-19 for 73 yards and was off target all day long.

Sure Fisher still probably loses to that pretty damn good Hobart team that was coming off back to back bye weeks, but a more consistent QB would have given them a chance to stay in the game.

[Bombers798891]

Well, in 2011 they allowed 56, 41, and 45 points in their losses. What game do they lose that year that they win with Fenti?

That offense was just painful to watch in 2011 and 2012. If they couldn't run the ball they were toast those two years. I'll just pick the Hobart game as an example, first of all this is no slight against Bart at all, they took us to the woodshed. However the start of the game was just completely horrendous for Kramer and SJF.

First Series
0-0
5 plays, 14 yds and 1:19 elapsed.
Kramer- 1/3 8 yds.

Second Series:
0-7
5 plays, 3 yds and 2:09 elapsed.
Kramer- 0/2

Third Series:
0-14
3 plays, 1 yd and 1:06 elapsed
Kramer- 0/1

Fourth Series:
0-21
3 plays, 3 yds and 1:00 elapsed
Kramer 0/2

I'm not saying it's Kramer's fault at all but they could not get out of their own way on offense, in part due to Bart's much improved D from the previous year. They had 1 first down I believe in 4 possessions and a whopping 5 minutes of possession. They put the D in horrible position the entire first half and Bart capitalized each time, again a testament to Bart's team.

If they have a more consistent offense or at least an offense that could move the ball they "probably" don't go into halftime trailing 28-7. Kramer finished 7-19 for 73 yards and was off target all day long.

Sure Fisher still probably loses to that pretty damn good Hobart team that was coming off back to back bye weeks, but a more consistent QB would have given them a chance to stay in the game.

Kramer was awful that game. (Frankly, I thought that Fisher team was way overrated, but maybe that's because of the awfulness of their game against the worst IC team I ever saw). But it's pretty unknowable to know how a guy who was making his 3rd ever start would have done THAT much better, against a team as good as that Hobart team was.

[sjfcards]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

[fisheralum91]

Im not going to get all riled up here, but can we stop with the Kramer bashing?
Woulda coulda shoulda.
Fisher was who they were.
Revisionist history to be damned.
Lets move forward and hope we win out and get a pool C yes?

[ITH radio]

Would think a 9-1 season with the strong SOS (28) would help get SJF in a C bid.

[Upstate]

Im not going to get all riled up here, but can we stop with the Kramer bashing?
Woulda coulda shoulda.
Fisher was who they were.
Revisionist history to be damned.
Lets move forward and hope we win out and get a pool C yes?

How is pointing out the obvious "bashing"?

[Bombers798891]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

[Yanks 99]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

I don't remember Boltus playing for the Bombers?

[AUPepBand]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

On the topic of QBs, Bomber, Johnson was 18-of-24 for 283 yards with 3 TDs and 0 interceptions and/or fumbles on saterday. Perhaps AU's freshman signal caller is maturing....

[Bombers798891]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

I don't remember Boltus playing for the Bombers?

Me either, thankfully

[Bombers798891]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

On the topic of QBs, Bomber, Johnson was 18-of-24 for 283 yards with 3 TDs and 0 interceptions and/or fumbles on saterday. Perhaps AU's freshman signal caller is maturing....

It's quite possible, though my "turnover machine" comment was less a prediction about the future and more an (accurate) description of the quality of play Alfred was getting from the position at the time.

[Yanks 99]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

I don't remember Boltus playing for the Bombers?

Me either, thankfully

Hahaha...

[fisheralum91]

Upstate,
For some reason or another Fenti was NOT chosen to play QB.
Ryan was given the nod.
We can play the what if game all day long.
I just would rather look ahead then back.
I have also been a Kramer supporter, which I have never denied.

[AUPepBand]

I don't know what to make of Fenti or Kramer. Obviously the coaches see every practice and they decided Kramer gave the team a better chance to win, but last year I can't imagine an offense with Fenti at QB only scoring 9 points against Buff State. Fisher also lost by 13 to AU, which could have been much closer if Fisher could have moved the ball consistently (not sure they could over come the end of at first half, but you know what I am saying)

Ever wish you could be a fly on the wall when the coaches are having these conversations? It still blows my mind that Ithaca thought a future linebacker was a better fit at signal-caller than the best quarterback in conference history. I really would love to go to August, 2002 and hear that decision-making process.

On the topic of QBs, Bomber, Johnson was 18-of-24 for 283 yards with 3 TDs and 0 interceptions and/or fumbles on saterday. Perhaps AU's freshman signal caller is maturing....

It's quite possible, though my "turnover machine" comment was less a prediction about the future and more an (accurate) description of the quality of play Alfred was getting from the position at the time.

Yeah, you were spot on (unfortunately). +K