FB: Empire 8

[jmcozenlaw]

thewaterboy - How did Widener bail on Wesley since the play nine conference games and the Rowan home-and-hone games were already in stone? I don't think that Widener ever planned to play an 11th game just so Wesley could schedule some D3 games.

[ITH radio]

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

[thewaterboy]

thewaterboy - How did Widener bail on Wesley since the play nine conference games and the Rowan home-and-hone games were already in stone? I don't think that Widener ever planned to play an 11th game just so Wesley could schedule some D3 games.

If you remember, Widener played Wesley to open the 2013 season. That was originally agreed upon as a home-and-home. They opted out to play Rowan. Same with Alfred State. Things like this are an annual occurrence at Wesley. So at the last minute they have to find games in places like California, Alabama, and teams like CoF.   

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

The bracket that year was absolutely insane (especially the HOB-WES quadrant). IMO that Wesley game gave Hobart some serious recognition on the national stage (and rightfully so).

[ITH radio]

I agree. The 2011 team was probably better than the 2012 version, just got a bad seeding b/c of the scheduling. The fact they hung in there with a backup QB, losing their top WR and no PK said a lot about that edition of the Statesmen.

I spoke to some former players who are finishing their degrees this year who said that Wolverines team was the best one Hobart played in the last 4-5 years / in their experience.

[wally_wabash]

This is what happens when no one in Division III wants to play you. Wesley wants to play 10 games. I know Wesley had a campaign and tried to call almost all D3 teams in the nation with an open date (including E8 teams). They have even called some D2, NAIA schools etc. The 5 D3 teams that responded, ended up playing Wesley. They were supposed to play Alfred State, and Widener but they bailed on their agreements. Division III teams don't wanna play Wesley but after this year that wont be a problem.

Most teams probably don't want anything to do with Wesley, but an awfully big part of why Wesley has had a really hard time finding 10 in-division games is because after the first couple of weeks of the season, most teams CAN'T play Wesley.  That's the rub when you are an independent and everybody else is into league play after week 3. 

[ITH radio]

That's true, especially as conferences have expanded to 8-9 teams and things like PAC-MAC eat up rare OOC openings.

[boobyhasgameyo]

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

Thank goodness Hobart fans have that single win over Fisher in the past 12 years to hold on to and snuggle up tight with    

[D3MAFAN]

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

Thank goodness Hobart fans have that single win over Fisher in the past 12 years to hold on to and snuggle up tight with   

That 2011 team was awesome, however as aforementioned, they decided not to play a team and karma bit them in their butt. I believe that if they would have played that game earlier in the season, the loss would not have hurt them and they could have gotten a better seed and really made some noise in the playoffs.

[Bombers798891]

I just want to be clear that I wasn't criticizing Wesley, and I do believe that they tried everything they could to fill the game. I'm also sure that other teams do not make it easy to resolve these situations (and some may actively make it worse)

I'm not really interested in who did what to cause the game to happen. The fact is, it's happening, so I'm merely taking stock of what a game like this means.

And in all probability, we've going to see a game that redefines what non-competitive means at this level, which is disappointing given how the last several weeks have gone for multiple teams. I'm not real sure how the game is good for the team, the fans, or D-III football.

Sure, the squad "plays," but the starters will probably get pulled after a few drives, the backups will probably run the most vanilla stuff in the playbook, and based on how a lot of COF games have gone, they'll probably get limited time because the 2nd half may get cut down to 10 or even 8 minutes. Whatever benefit they might get seems like it could be negated by the injury risk.

I can't imagine fans will enjoy it. I mean I know Wesley fans have seen blowouts, but from what I've read about this team, this isn't the same thing as a small D-II/III school that simply doesn't have great players. This is a team with hand-me-down pads whose coaches work full-time jobs elsewhere. I honestly believe there's going to be a level of play here that we've not really seen.

From what I've read, COF offers guys 2nd chances at an education and life, and that's a fantastic mission. They've done some charity work in the week before their games. That's also great. This game? Not so much

[bman]

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

Bailed?  really?  You make it seem like they were scared to play Hobart...which I seriously doubt...   They were Obligated to play as the conference made an agreement with the PAC...The MAC announced these changes at the end of the 2009 season, making it impossible for Widener to know, or make necesary arrangements with Hobart...
The MAC then went on to schedule the MAV/NJAC challenge which made a lot of sense both from a logistics and recruiting standpoint since much of the recruiting base is in these areas...
It is the same logic that you would use in scheduling LL vs. E8 matchups...

[ITH radio]

Of course Widener wasn't scared. Coach Isaac had been part of Cragg's staff in the early 90's and I am sure both programs were looking forward to the match up. The contract / agreement or what was in place had to be cancelled by Widener after the PAC-MAC deal was arranged and which obviously had higher precedence.

It would be nice if the E8 and LL had a similar arrangement. I know Cragg has been pushing for it for a few years now.

[Bartman]

Widener bailed on a previous agreement with Hobart once the MAC-PAC series was arranged after the 2010 season which ended up causing the Statesmen to have 8 games in 2011. Ironically Wesley reportedly approached Hobart for a game that season but the Statesmen passed, then ended up drawing the Wolverines in Rd1 of the playoffs, getting a worse seeding than the SJF team they beat by 36 earlier in the year.

Thank goodness Hobart fans have that single win over Fisher in the past 12 years to hold on to and snuggle up tight with   

Yes , thank goodness ,that 56-20 win by the 2011 team was very comforting,thank you, and the consecutive wins in 97,98,99,00 and 01 were fairly snuggly too...(I had to stretch it into the last century to get to a Hobart 6-5 advantage  ).... OK, OK so I am sensitive after the playoff pounding last year...would love to see Hobart get another shot at a great/improving SJF team this year(if the Playoff Gods permit)....and  if we get thru the rest of the LL games(Union and Rochester will be motivated and SLU has an awesome defense...could be a great game in Canton)...kind of jealous that E8 is soo competitive as an overall league...certainly helps battle test the E8 champ  for the post season.

[boobyhasgameyo]

Yeah, Fisher won like 4 games in the 1990's.  Everybody got their licks in that decade, up until 2002. 

[Pat Coleman]

It would be nice if the E8 and LL had a similar arrangement. I know Cragg has been pushing for it for a few years now.

Nothing stopping Cragg from scheduling Empire 8 teams anyway.

[Upstate]

Yeah, Fisher won like 4 games in the 1990's.  Everybody got their licks in that decade, up until 2002.

Weird that happens to be the same year Fisher knocked off unbeaten and nationally ranked Hobart 17-14...