FB: Empire 8

[fisheralum91]

killin me

[The Truth 00]

i think what the bomber fans need to realize is that national championship was over 15 years ago. its hard to compare a team from that era to a team from 2006. the landscape has changed in that teams from the northeast have become better. i believe ithaca has to be one of the measuring sticks here in the northeast. in terms of competition, the  utica's, norwich's, and hartwick's have to be on the schedule because of conference affiliation. however, there aren't a lot a conferences that can say that 4 teams were in the hunt for the conference championship coming into the last 2 weeks (except the big east). i think that's very impressive. one thing i think jose forgot to mention (jose, you had a quality post) is that the price to attend school up on south hill is becoming more expensive every year. i'm going to guess that ithaca has to be pushing 40k per year and not all kids from the cny/wny area have the money to afford that. that's why they end up at the cortland's and brockport's of the world. the worst part: prices won't go down. add this in: SJF is on par with the athletic facilities at ithaca and they are close to 10k less in tuition. i think the problem definitely extends beyond the playing field.

[maxpower]

i think what the bomber fans need to realize is that national championship was over 15 years ago. its hard to compare a team from that era to a team from 2006. the landscape has changed in that teams from the northeast have become better. i believe ithaca has to be one of the measuring sticks here in the northeast. in terms of competition, the  utica's, norwich's, and hartwick's have to be on the schedule because of conference affiliation. however, there aren't a lot a conferences that can say that 4 teams were in the hunt for the conference championship coming into the last 2 weeks (except the big east). i think that's very impressive. one thing i think jose forgot to mention (jose, you had a quality post) is that the price to attend school up on south hill is becoming more expensive every year. i'm going to guess that ithaca has to be pushing 40k per year and not all kids from the cny/wny area have the money to afford that. that's why they end up at the cortland's and brockport's of the world. the worst part: prices won't go down. add this in: SJF is on par with the athletic facilities at ithaca and they are close to 10k less in tuition. i think the problem definitely extends beyond the playing field.

Good post Truth. The tuition is pushing 40k and I knew some damn talented kids that transferred out for that very reason. I do think Ithaca's history matters though.... it helps a bundle with recruiting and fundraising, if nothing else. I know Jose bought a national championship shirt, and I've got my eyes on one too.....

[superman57]

You better watch out
You better not cry
Better not pout
I'm telling you why
St. John Fisher is coming to town

They're making a list,
And checking it twice;
Gonna find out Who's defense is weak.
St. John Fisher is coming to town

They watch tape when you're sleeping
They practice when you're awake
They know if your offense has been bad or good
So be good for goodness sake!

O! You better watch out!
You better not cry.
Better not pout, I'm telling you why.
St. John Fisher is coming to town.
St. John Fisher is coming to town.

[The Truth 00]

you need some kind of depth to build a program from the ground up. you need to be able to plug a guy in when a starter goes down. utica had only 8 seniors....WOW.

[JQV]

i think what the bomber fans need to realize is that national championship was over 15 years ago. its hard to compare a team from that era to a team from 2006. the landscape has changed in that teams from the northeast have become better. i believe ithaca has to be one of the measuring sticks here in the northeast. in terms of competition, the  utica's, norwich's, and hartwick's have to be on the schedule because of conference affiliation. however, there aren't a lot a conferences that can say that 4 teams were in the hunt for the conference championship coming into the last 2 weeks (except the big east). i think that's very impressive. one thing i think jose forgot to mention (jose, you had a quality post) is that the price to attend school up on south hill is becoming more expensive every year. i'm going to guess that ithaca has to be pushing 40k per year and not all kids from the cny/wny area have the money to afford that. that's why they end up at the cortland's and brockport's of the world. the worst part: prices won't go down. add this in: SJF is on par with the athletic facilities at ithaca and they are close to 10k less in tuition. i think the problem definitely extends beyond the playing field.

I disagree inasmuch as the facilities go.  Butterfield may be the best home stadium in the East but, Fisher has IC beat in every other facility.  

Tuition is a factor but not a new factor.  IC has had significantly higher tuition at least since Welch took over in '94 if not longer.  I think the athletic program does a good job targeting kids they aren't going to lose on tuition grounds. 

[fisheralum91]

Just checked the Fisher tuition and room and board---
30k is steep- but IC at 40?
Wow.
Had no idea.

[fan of d3]

SC=34,000

[JQV]

Just checked the Fisher tuition and room and board---
30k is steep- but IC at 40?
Wow.
Had no idea.

I think 40 was an exaggeration posted by current students or recent alumni.  IC website says right at 35 as well.

Still a lot considering that it cost me 24 for all three years of law school.

[The Truth 00]

max, absolutely tradition matters and it helps, not to mention the quality education one can receive at ithaca. also, being able to say that your team won a national championship in 1991 is awesome, don't get me wrong...it just seems like a while ago. hell, 3 years ago seems like an eternity to me now though.

speaking of national championships, i think it will be hard for a team from the northeast to compete for 1 against the midwest teams. their recruiting pool is based mainly out of ohio (top 5 hs football in country), wisconsin, minnesota, etc. the best we have is new jersey football (pretty damn good as well) but if you look at northeast teams rosters, there isn't much from jersey. i think ithaca being able to dip into PA definitely helps. bottom line: the mount unions and st. johns of the world are perennial powers that just have better players that come from better high school programs.

[JQV]

I think as a general rule I would agree with the fact that the midwest schools are getting better players but, I think you are missing at least one factor.  While I am not going to argue that NY is a high school football hot bed, I don't think it is that much worse than Minnesota or Wisconsin.  I think the difference is, there are more scholarship programs that recruit NY.

Realistic can correct me but, I understand the options for kids in Minn/Wisconsin/Ohio to be either OSU/UMinn/Wisconsin or Mount Union/St Johns/UW-Insert small town here.  In NY they can slip beyond Syracuse but still fall to the 1-aa and D2 schools lurking with offers.

[The Truth 00]

i'm sure the financial aid pool isn't what it used to be. does ithaca have any plans for renovation to the athletic facilities? also, it may say 35 but that's barebones minimum. in reality, its much closer to 40k unfortunately.

i applaud ithaca players and coaches for deciding that cortland was going to be the last hurrah. i honestly feel that money for an ecac game wasn't a big deal. yea it would cost at least 5k to travel, overnight stay, feed 56 kids 3 meals or so, depending on where they were playing. if it was a home game, then the cost would be significantly less. plus, i think ithaca might have had a chance to host, even at 7-3 because they are ithaca, definitely if they beat cortland. also, maybe they didn't want to waste their time with a potential nefc opponent. that league is bad.

[maxpower]

There was just something passed about a huge new athletic field house or something. I'm sure there's more info on the website, but I'm too lazy to look it up. They're also building a new business school, which will also help the football program. Many of IC's football kids are business majors.


EDIT: Eh, I got over myself:

http://www.ithaca.edu/aecenter/

[The Truth 00]

jose, i think there's some other crazy 1AA-II schools out there that we aren't considering. if you've ever seen the UW schools play, they are legit. they're big, fast, have pretty big crowds...and their d3. i'd say new york isn't a hotbed by any means but its the best we have in the northeast (not including NJ or PA). rowan is consistently good because they get the best NJ kids that don't get offered. 

[JQV]

jose, i think there's some other crazy 1AA-II schools out there that we aren't considering. if you've ever seen the UW schools play, they are legit. they're big, fast, have pretty big crowds...and their d3. i'd say new york isn't a hotbed by any means but its the best we have in the northeast (not including NJ or PA). rowan is consistently good because they get the best NJ kids that don't get offered. 

You may be right about the other scholarship schools in Ohio/Minnesota.  Youngstown State jumps to my mind immediately as do some of the MAC schools.  I was basing that solely on what I have heard other posters say about Mount Union's success.