FB: Empire 8

[fisheralum91]

well said tags!

[JQV]

I would say that Fisher is on IC's level right now.

I never disputed that.  Just the same way Brockport was on IC's level a few years ago, and Buff State was on IC's level a few years before that.  I thought that was the whole point of the discussion.

As for the E8's newly self-appointed fact checker.  Unlike you, I have a job.  Which means I do some quick research and post on here.  If I were unemployed, perhaps I would have time to add the endless caveats you so happily add after I post.  Regardless of whether I typed the word active or not, or the number of Stagg Bowls MUC has been in, I do not see you disputing my point about the quality of IC's program.  I will just assume that your chippy response comes from your envy for our program.  How is Catholic's team doing?

Furthermore, this post was not only on the E8 Board but also pertained directly to Empire 8 football, thereby being directly within the zone of topics you have granted me permission to post about.  If you would like to restrict this zone of topics further, please let me know.

Finally, if you had read the two posts prior to your sarcastic comment about MUC's wins, maybe you would see that kirasdad made the identical point which I conceded.  Thanks for playing Johnny Factchecker but no gold star on this one.

*I fully expect this post to be either edited or deleted, much in the way my posts on other boards and my name have been edited or deleted.*

[maxpower]

Certainly nobody can take away the past successes of IC's program, or how consistent they've been, but my question is how long can you live in the past?

Can you even talk about Fisher in the same breath as IC in the past, definitely not. But in my mind, the only thing that matters is the present, and I would say that Fisher is on IC's level right now.

Of course in your mind the only thing that matters is the present, because that's the only time you've BEEN successful. Are you saying all your years as a SJF fan before this run were wasted?

And don't underestimate the lure of a storied program to promising recruits. All that stuff that Jose quoted above, I would say, carries just as much weight as Fisher's status as an up-and-coming national power, especially when their all-american running back graduated the year before, and the Bills are one year closer to leaving. At IC, what you see is what you get, including banners, and it will for the forseeable future be that way. Nearly every damn MLB player wants to play for the Yankees at some point in their career; that's not any different now that the Yankees blow. Ask a Pirates fan if the present is all that matters. You'd get a radically different answer now than you would have in 1992, I suspect.

Also keep in mind the amount of money a long-successful athletic program can bring in, from alumni and families of alumni, money that can be used to make the school proper more attractive to the student-athlete. Plenty, PLENTY of football players are business students at IC, and the brand new business building going up has to have an effect on similarly minded recruits. This is not meant to be a knock on Fisher's Pharmacy school, but how many football players are looking at that? (This is a serious question, I have no idea.)

Keep in mind how much a storied tradition can lure the best and brightest of the college coaching staffs; would a former DIAA coach have become the defensive backs coach at Fisher? Of course location played a role in that one as well, but watching your team get matched by the DIII athletes from across the valley every couple of years had something to do with it I'm sure.


I think these are the points Jose is trying to make. The past DOES matter in the context of the present and the future. I think what gets under our IC skin is Fisher fans saying that IC's run is "over". Or that "there's a new sherriff in town" or all that crap. Fisher's football team obviously owned IC's last year. We'll see this year if they can do it twice in a row for the first time ever.

[Sir Spiedie]

The best way to prove the run is NOT over is to  win, baby, just win. Right now, the Gators are on top in the Sunshine state. Miami and FSU know it, and they know what they have to do. Same in NY.

[maxpower]

The best way to prove the run is NOT over is to  win, baby, just win. Right now, the Gators are on top in the Sunshine state. Miami and FSU know it, and they know what they have to do. Same in NY.

Well... no, not really. The point I was trying to make is that established success in any athletic program comes from a myriad factors, some of which no one has any control over. And I would say (and I welcome correction on this) that the differences between the SEC/ACC schools do not approach the level of the differences between the E8 schools.

[Pat Coleman]

I would say that Fisher is on IC's level right now.

I never disputed that.  Just the same way Brockport was on IC's level a few years ago, and Buff State was on IC's level a few years before that.  I thought that was the whole point of the discussion.

As for the E8's newly self-appointed fact checker.  Unlike you, I have a job.  Which means I do some quick research and post on here.  If I were unemployed, perhaps I would have time to add the endless caveats you so happily add after I post.  Regardless of whether I typed the word active or not, or the number of Stagg Bowls MUC has been in, I do not see you disputing my point about the quality of IC's program.  I will just assume that your chippy response comes from your envy for our program.  How is Catholic's team doing?

Furthermore, this post was not only on the E8 Board but also pertained directly to Empire 8 football, thereby being directly within the zone of topics you have granted me permission to post about.  If you would like to restrict this zone of topics further, please let me know.

Finally, if you had read the two posts prior to your sarcastic comment about MUC's wins, maybe you would see that kirasdad made the identical point which I conceded.  Thanks for playing Johnny Factchecker but no gold star on this one.

*I fully expect this post to be either edited or deleted, much in the way my posts on other boards and my name have been edited or deleted.*

I have a job. Thanks for your concern. I have had a job since 1994. Just because I chose to leave NBCSports.com doesn't mean I didn't have a new job lined up.

Nor is my role as fact-checker new. I do this on every board. But then again, unlike you, I am well-suited to the role I have chosen. You seem to just spout off without giving any thought. This is a problem since people seem to take you seriously, especially when you take on a fancy title.

And thankfully, I don't live and die by my alma mater. It's great, giving me a neutral perspective on Division III. Also means I don't have to make up facts to try to support it.

[Sir Spiedie]

Do you mean top to bottom in the conference or conference to conference. The gulf is pretty darn wide top to bottom in the SEC and ACC. When do you see Duke or Vandy winning a conference title?

[Tags]

Easy fellas. I think all reasonable football fans in general still have that respect for IC, and they've earned it. I don't think anyone in their right mind is saying "there's a new sherrif in town".

The past & present are two different animals in the context of what I'm trying to say. Right now Fisher is on IC's level, no matter how difficult it is to admit that. Can they sustain it? Who knows. Does IC deserve a kudos for sustaining the program they have all these years - you bet.

As far as your other comments about the past bringing in money from alums, or luring in good talent b/c of a solid tradition, nobody is questioning that.

I wouldn't get too defensive about this - everyone knows that Fisher, or anyone else who wants to be on the level of IC in regards to Football in a long term discussion, needs to sustain a program of success for more than 3 or 4 years.  

[maxpower]

Tags-

Great post. I think that's what everyone (including me) needed to hear. +k.

Spedie-

I'm trying to think of a way to explain myself, but I have to go to work. Until I get around to defending what I said, (which may be never), consider my post withdrawn.

[Sir Spiedie]

If it's dominance we're talking about, I refer everyone to Kenyon College, 26 (or is it 27?)  STRAIGHT NCAA Div III Swimming /Diving titles. Now THAT'S dominance.

[labart96]

Hey Spedie -

Please let everyone on the E8 board that if they ever go golfing in FLA, make sure they don't try and retrieve the ball they hit near or in the water hazards.

http://www.boston.com/news/odd/articles/2007/06/26/golfer_survives_gator_attack_in_florida/

[JQV]

Hey Spedie -

Please let everyone on the E8 board that if they ever go golfing in FLA, make sure they don't try and retrieve the ball they hit near or in the water hazards.

http://www.boston.com/news/odd/articles/2007/06/26/golfer_survives_gator_attack_in_florida/

Growing up in Florida, you learn the zig-zag run in public school.

EDIT: The pre-empt the fact checker, that statement is not, in fact, true.

[Pat Coleman]

My full-time job keeps me from fact-checking your smart-assness.

[AUPepBand]

My vote is for the elder statesmen Pep

Chairman Pep

Pep declines any notion of directing this dissonant band of E8 posters.

[Tags]

My vote is for the elder statesmen Pep

Chairman Pep

Pep declines any notion of directing this dissonant band of E8 posters.

Come now Pep - We all know you could handle keeping us in line!