FB: Empire 8

[Bombers798891]

Bombers798891-

You going to be at the game tomorrow?  I am thinking about heading up?  Is there going to be a big crowd?

I sent you a PM Yanks--supposed to be rain tho

[Yanks 99]

ECAC's all depend on where your program is...

For IC...probably not worth it...for 'Wick, and even Fisher (not trying to piss people off), or Alfred...getting to the playoffs is important...to build the program.

I guess it all depends on where you sit.

[SJFF82]

Look...I am not knocking Fisher...Fisher is an incredilby strong program.  But if they finish with essentially the same record...and 'Wick had the head to head win...and they gave Fisher then bid, it would be criminal...

I would feel the same way if Fisher beat 'Wick, and the roles were reversed and 'Wick got the bid.

If it does happen you'd have to think that the committee took into account their respective schedules.  Knowing that there was a 3 way tie in the conference and the two teams that didnt get the bid were going against each other for the final bid with the same in-region record i'd give it to the one with the harder schedule....

If it happens, it is a travesty...take away the losses to MUC and Salisbury, and the teams basically have the same record...if they were to take a team that lost to another team with the same record head to head, it sets a terrible precedent...it would mean that the regular season doesn't matter and that the head to head match ups mean even less...

That is not me being biased...

Let me try this (BTW, I do agree with you, believe it or not...on this point) If they take SJF over 'Wick in this scenario that you guys are talking about...it means only one thing....they think SJF is a better team despite their 3 point loss to 'Wick.  I mean, is it really impossible (was it you that called it CRIMINAL?) to think that teams with virtually identical records (using your criteria of negating SJF's losses to MUC and Salisbury) and the team that loses to the other by a lousy FG, is not still the overall better team.  Can not the committee hypothesize that SJF is still the better overall play-off squad??  Your point boils down to that you feel that the winner of the head-to-head should hands down get rewarded with the play-off nod, correct?  I have not read that you think 'Wick is the better team, have I? 

Again, I cant say that I dont agree with you, and I certainly would be pissed if the shoe were on the other foot. 

I just see that all this debating boils down to one simple competing concept?  If all else is realtively equal (ie: record, SOS, ETC) do you simply take the winner of a head-to-head that was only decided by a FG, OR do you subjectively analyze which team is the better overall football/play-off squad?

[Yanks 99]

Look...I am not knocking Fisher...Fisher is an incredilby strong program.  But if they finish with essentially the same record...and 'Wick had the head to head win...and they gave Fisher then bid, it would be criminal...

I would feel the same way if Fisher beat 'Wick, and the roles were reversed and 'Wick got the bid.

If it does happen you'd have to think that the committee took into account their respective schedules.  Knowing that there was a 3 way tie in the conference and the two teams that didnt get the bid were going against each other for the final bid with the same in-region record i'd give it to the one with the harder schedule....

If it happens, it is a travesty...take away the losses to MUC and Salisbury, and the teams basically have the same record...if they were to take a team that lost to another team with the same record head to head, it sets a terrible precedent...it would mean that the regular season doesn't matter and that the head to head match ups mean even less...

That is not me being biased...

Let me try this (BTW, I do agree with you, believe it or not...on this point) If they take SJF over 'Wick in this scenario that you guys are talking about...it means only one thing....they think SJF is a better team despite their 3 point loss to 'Wick.  I mean, is it really impossible (was it you that called it CRIMINAL?) to think that teams with virtually identical records (using your criteria of negating SJF's losses to MUC and Salisbury) and the team that loses to the other by a lousy FG, is not still the overall better team.  Can not the committee hypothesize that SJF is still the better overall play-off squad??  Your point boils down to that you feel that the winner of the head-to-head should hands down get rewarded with the play-off nod, correct?  I have not read that you think 'Wick is the better team, have I? 

Again, I cant say that I dont agree with you, and I certainly would be pissed if the shoe were on the other foot. 

I just see that all this debating boils down to one simple competing concept?  If all else is realtively equal (ie: record, SOS, ETC) do you simply take the winner of a head-to-head that was only decided by a FG, OR do you subjectively analyze which team is the better overall football/play-off squad?

I appreciate the thought...but you have to take the team that won the head to head match up.  Especially with the same record in conference and in the region. 

By this arguement, why even play the game?  I know even you are struggling with this one 82, as I suspect even you know the "right" answer.  If somehow SJF gets the AQ , and IC gets the Pool C over us...I will not be happy, but I will completely understand.  We all root for our teams and hope for the best when left out of our hands...but SJF getting a Pool C bid over 'Wick (assuming we all win out and IC gets the AQ) would absolutely be criminal...and I don't think the commitee wants to put themselves in that position.  Bottom line is with the same record...the arguement comes down to who is the better team.  In this case, for this year, 'Wick would have proved they were the better team on the field.

[Knightstalker]

I just looked it up, 98 was the last year of the 16 team tournament.  There were no pools and no AQ's.

[superman57]

listen did you get robbed probably... but the duty of the committie is to take the 7 best teams that don't win there aq...is it out of the realm of posibility that fisher gets the pool c and Wick goes to the ECAC's no... lets go bcs for a second... the Orange bowl chose Kansas over Mizzou last year despite the fact that Mizzou won the head to head

so will it be right if SJFC gets the pool c over wick no... but it's not going to be "criminal"

[SJFF82]

Look...I am not knocking Fisher...Fisher is an incredilby strong program.  But if they finish with essentially the same record...and 'Wick had the head to head win...and they gave Fisher then bid, it would be criminal...

I would feel the same way if Fisher beat 'Wick, and the roles were reversed and 'Wick got the bid.

If it does happen you'd have to think that the committee took into account their respective schedules.  Knowing that there was a 3 way tie in the conference and the two teams that didnt get the bid were going against each other for the final bid with the same in-region record i'd give it to the one with the harder schedule....

If it happens, it is a travesty...take away the losses to MUC and Salisbury, and the teams basically have the same record...if they were to take a team that lost to another team with the same record head to head, it sets a terrible precedent...it would mean that the regular season doesn't matter and that the head to head match ups mean even less...

That is not me being biased...

Let me try this (BTW, I do agree with you, believe it or not...on this point) If they take SJF over 'Wick in this scenario that you guys are talking about...it means only one thing....they think SJF is a better team despite their 3 point loss to 'Wick.  I mean, is it really impossible (was it you that called it CRIMINAL?) to think that teams with virtually identical records (using your criteria of negating SJF's losses to MUC and Salisbury) and the team that loses to the other by a lousy FG, is not still the overall better team.  Can not the committee hypothesize that SJF is still the better overall play-off squad??  Your point boils down to that you feel that the winner of the head-to-head should hands down get rewarded with the play-off nod, correct?  I have not read that you think 'Wick is the better team, have I? 

Again, I cant say that I dont agree with you, and I certainly would be pissed if the shoe were on the other foot. 

I just see that all this debating boils down to one simple competing concept?  If all else is realtively equal (ie: record, SOS, ETC) do you simply take the winner of a head-to-head that was only decided by a FG, OR do you subjectively analyze which team is the better overall football/play-off squad?

I appreciate the thought...but you have to take the team that won the head to head match up.  Especially with the same record in conference and in the region. 

By this arguement, why even play the game?  I know even you are struggling with this one 82, as I suspect even you know the "right" answer.  If somehow SJF gets the AQ , and IC gets the Pool C over us...I will not be happy, but I will completely understand.  We all root for our teams and hope for the best when left out of our hands...but SJF getting a Pool C bid over 'Wick (assuming we all win out and IC gets the AQ) would absolutely be criminal...and I don't think the commitee wants to put themselves in that position.  Bottom line is with the same record...the arguement comes down to who is the better team.  In this case, for this year, 'Wick would have proved they were the better team on the field.

OK, so let me try this one:  Let's say MUC loses to Capital by 3 points...and by some OAC tie-breaker,  another OAC team (say ONU) wins the AQ for the OAC.  Now, just b/c Capital, who happens to be a highly ranked, year-in and year-out team (unlike 'Wick) beat MUC by 3, do they get Pool C over MUC?  Now, before you go beserk  on me, I am NOT comparing SJF to MUC....just trying to show how head-to-head may not always be the answer, when the committee is charged with deciding who the better team is.  Your bold point has been that the winner of the head to head HAS to get the nod or someone should be indicted for a felony!  If Capital got the nod over MUC in the foregoing scenario, then the death-sentence would be in order.

[SJFF82]

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

[Yanks 99]

Bottom line is it would be wrong.  Is there anything I can do about it...no.  But it would absolutely be wrong.  Would it be "unheard" of...no.  But if the roles were reversed, and I were to come on here and say 'Wick could, or SHOULD, get the Pool C over Fisher, I would get destroyed, and rightfully so.

We can go over scenario's all you want, it still wouldn't make it right.  Impossible no...wrong, absolutely...and it is the commitee's job to get it right.  In this case, it doesn't seem confusing even for a second (again...I will even TAKE AWAY the two out of region losses...even though the committee doesn't have too).

[Yanks 99]

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Hahaha...you kidding me?  My wife is away this weekend and there is no way I am missing the 3rd straight Sportscenter in a row right now...

[Bombers798891]

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Hahaha...you kidding me?  My wife is away this weekend and there is no way I am missing the 3rd straight Sportscenter in a row right now...

Yanks--

Was Tremlett a local kid? Why in the world do you remember an average--at best--corner from an IC team from 10 years ago? Did he do something in the ECAC game--like cover someone?

[dewcrew88]

If SJF doesn't get the E8 bid, they need other pool C teams to have 2 losses and I think they can make it. 

Really?... has a three loss team ever taken a pool C Bid? 

Dont know, but they should get some credit for playing the top team in the country.  And that game vs. MUC (and Salsbury) aren't considered (or reviewed for primary criteria on pool C selection.

I mean, who do you take if it comes down to WPI at 8-2 (with losses to RPI and Hobart) or SJF (with losses to Wick, MUC and Salsbury)?  I mean, you wouldn't be that wrong taking SJF but I could see an argument for either side right?

Or what if Hobart is 7-2?  You could even have Hobart winning that league and have a 8-1 RPI team.  

If SJF wins out they'll be 7-1 in region so they could be in line for one if other pool C candidates start dropping in region games....

Right now you gotta figure that the NJAC is going to get a Pool C w/ either Montclair or Rowan getting it.

I see the LL teams knocking each other off as WPI still has to play Bart and Bart still has to play WPI AND RPI.  If RPI wins out and Hobart wins vs WPI it will give their runner up 2 in-region losses.

In the MAC its in SJF's best interest to see DVC win out and take the conference so everyone else in the MAC ends up with 2 in region losses.

So lets say:

-IC wins the E8 on tiebreaker.

-RPI Runs the table.

-Cortland wins the NJAC and Rowan wins out.

-DVC wins out and takes the MAC.

-SJF wins out as well.

I see the NCAA giving the Region to Muhlenburgh!!

1) Muhlenburgh
2) Cortland
3) RPI
4) DVC
5) Ithaca
6) Rowan
7) Curry
8) SJF

Thoughts?

Nope. A 10-0 Cortland is a number 1 seed in the East, I would believe. Wins over all the conference members plus a possible E8 champ Ithaca would be good enough.

[SJFF82]

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Hahaha...you kidding me?  My wife is away this weekend and there is no way I am missing the 3rd straight Sportscenter in a row right now...

Yours too...huh?  Mine has been away for 2 years now....just kiddin, she has been gone for a week, went on vacation with her sister (what a good husband I am )  She will be flyin back from Denver tomorrow to whip me back into shape.

[Yanks 99]

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Yanks99....just concede so we can all go to bed

Hahaha...you kidding me?  My wife is away this weekend and there is no way I am missing the 3rd straight Sportscenter in a row right now...

Yanks--

Was Tremlett a local kid? Why in the world do you remember an average--at best--corner from an IC team from 10 years ago? Did he do something in the ECAC game--like cover someone?

Rome I believe...which is close to where I grew up.  I always thought he was pretty good.  May have had some bad games, but from what I recall, stepped on campus and was a solid corner from day 1.  I thought he had some offers too coming out of HS...Maine, NH, etc...

[Bombers798891]

If SJF doesn't get the E8 bid, they need other pool C teams to have 2 losses and I think they can make it. 

Really?... has a three loss team ever taken a pool C Bid? 

Dont know, but they should get some credit for playing the top team in the country.  And that game vs. MUC (and Salsbury) aren't considered (or reviewed for primary criteria on pool C selection.

I mean, who do you take if it comes down to WPI at 8-2 (with losses to RPI and Hobart) or SJF (with losses to Wick, MUC and Salsbury)?  I mean, you wouldn't be that wrong taking SJF but I could see an argument for either side right?

Or what if Hobart is 7-2?  You could even have Hobart winning that league and have a 8-1 RPI team.  

If SJF wins out they'll be 7-1 in region so they could be in line for one if other pool C candidates start dropping in region games....

Right now you gotta figure that the NJAC is going to get a Pool C w/ either Montclair or Rowan getting it.

I see the LL teams knocking each other off as WPI still has to play Bart and Bart still has to play WPI AND RPI.  If RPI wins out and Hobart wins vs WPI it will give their runner up 2 in-region losses.

In the MAC its in SJF's best interest to see DVC win out and take the conference so everyone else in the MAC ends up with 2 in region losses.

So lets say:

-IC wins the E8 on tiebreaker.

-RPI Runs the table.

-Cortland wins the NJAC and Rowan wins out.

-DVC wins out and takes the MAC.

-SJF wins out as well.

I see the NCAA giving the Region to Muhlenburgh!!

1) Muhlenburgh
2) Cortland
3) RPI
4) DVC
5) Ithaca
6) Rowan
7) Curry
8) SJF

Thoughts?

Nope. A 10-0 Cortland is a number 1 seed in the East, I would believe. Wins over all the conference members plus a possible E8 champ Ithaca would be good enough.

Technically, he hasn't put Cortland at 10-0. All he said is that both IC and C-State win their conference. I would imagine you're right with State if they go 10-0 though...