FB: Liberty League

[Bartman]

dlip just wanted to wish everyone on the LLPP (including Mach) a Happy New Year! dlip really enjoys bsing on here and talking D3 football with all of you. All the best to you and your families!

Right back to you dlip and the rest of the LL contributors......a little over eight months before the first snap of the 2018 season....I'm projecting Ithaca as the early season favorite and the hunted for 2018....I think the Statesmen will enjoy the underdog role.....Happy New Year!

[Oline89]

So what is the general consensus here on the LL board (or the D3 boards in general) regarding D2 football vs D3?  Here in PA, I see a lot of football players considering one of the D2 programs over a much better academic school in D3.  Is there really a significant difference in talent on the field?  I don't see it

[D3viewer]

D2 schools can offer up to 36 football scholarships. The difference between them and D1 is that they can be broken up into "x" amount of parts. And not all D2 schools will choose to offer up 36 scholarships. In the PSAC, I think each school can choose how many scholarships they will utilize (and usually breakup into littler pieces) . Some PSAC schools use all of their allowed scholarship money (36) and some others hardly use any in comparison (6-10).
So, the advantage these schools have over a D3 school. is that they can offer a "football scholarship" to an athlete, even though it may be only a few grand, or combined with academic money. I believe (just my opinion, I have no proof) is that generally a high school player will rise as high as the "football money " does. That is, if a D2 school offers him a "football scholarship" (partial) he will be flattered enough and will be able to go around to people and say "D2 school X" has offered me  a football scholarship. No D3 school can obviously "compete" with that football/wise. And that will allow them to play at a "higher level". So I think a bunch of kids  ( even if good students) will take the football money and "prestige" of playing at Division 2 over a MAC or Centennial school.  I do think these D2 schools who offer football money, have a higher level of play. How can they not when offering that kind of football scholarship money, and they also get more FCS, FBS kids to trickle down I'm assuming.

[Oline89]

D2 schools can offer up to 36 football scholarships. The difference between them and D1 is that they can be broken up into "x" amount of parts. And not all D2 schools will choose to offer up 36 scholarships. In the PSAC, I think each school can choose how many scholarships they will utilize (and usually breakup into littler pieces) . Some PSAC schools use all of their allowed scholarship money (36) and some others hardly use any in comparison (6-10).
So, the advantage these schools have over a D3 school. is that they can offer a "football scholarship" to an athlete, even though it may be only a few grand, or combined with academic money. I believe (just my opinion, I have no proof) is that generally a high school player will rise as high as the "football money " does. That is, if a D2 school offers him a "football scholarship" (partial) he will be flattered enough and will be able to go around to people and say "D2 school X" has offered me  a football scholarship. No D3 school can obviously "compete" with that football/wise. And that will allow them to play at a "higher level". So I think a bunch of kids  ( even if good students) will take the football money and "prestige" of playing at Division 2 over a MAC or Centennial school.  I do think these D2 schools who offer football money, have a higher level of play. How can they not when offering that kind of football scholarship money, and they also get more FCS, FBS kids to trickle down I'm assuming.

I get what you are saying about the D2 scholarship money, FCS teams have the same rules.  D3 teams, offer grant money, which is essentially a scholarship (although, as I have learned, the amount of money available is tied to the amount of money given out as grants to the general student body).  I haven't watched many D2 games, but based on the talent level of players I have seen go to D2 vs the higher echelon D3 schools, I feel there is not huge disparity in overall football quality.  I just fear that a lot of kids are pressured to getting a "scholarship", and falsely believe the football is better at the D2 level.

[Oline89]

So finally the FBS title game is over, and we can begin discussing the LL 2018 season.  I know at least a couple of Hobart recruits have committed in the last few days.  I am sure we will start to hear announcements from the coaches in the next couple of weeks.

[Bombers798891]

I'm super excited for this season, and Swanstrom's first full recruiting class.

It's going to be an interesting year. There's a lot of talent at the top, and not a lot separating them. Hobart could have beaten IC last year, but then again, IC and RPI were tied with like, 6 minutes to go. Union improved drastically, though they were probably a year away last season.

[Oline89]

It should be a very competitive year.  Ithaca's QB has one year under his belt, however the league will now be ready for the Bombers passing game.  Union is no longer the underdog, but has a target firmly implanted on its back.  Although Hobart lost the phenomenal combo of Sweeney-Shed, they return an 4/5 on the Oline and a fantastic group of running backs.

[Bartman]

I'm super excited for this season, and Swanstrom's first full recruiting class.

It's going to be an interesting year. There's a lot of talent at the top, and not a lot separating them. Hobart could have beaten IC last year, but then again, IC and RPI were tied with like, 6 minutes to go. Union improved drastically, though they were probably a year away last season.

Bombers,
      You should be very enthusiastic for the Bombers 2018 season. I believe IC will be the favorite based on last season and the energy in the program. I think Hobart will be in a close second with RPI and Union all having legitimate chances for the title and NCAA bid.
   I revisited the Hobart losses to Ithaca and Union(as painful as it was) and I think Hobart had a good chance to win the IC game and given Hobart's overall talent level should have won the game, but Ithaca was well up to the task and Hobart coaching put too much pressure on D'Antonio to single cover Gladney(12 catches 183 yards) for most of the game. Gladney is one of those special players that you need to account for(I noticed Salisbury held him to one catch in the bowl game, but IC still prevailed) The IC defense was also a solid group in 2017. So, I don't feel bad losing to Ithaca because it was a true battle and IC deserved the win.
       The Union game, however, haunts me. The Hobart squad came out flat and the play calling was also off(or it seemed like Union knew the plays). Nothing against Union, as I am a big supporter of their rise back to winning, I just thought Hobart played one of their worst offensive games until it was too late. The Hobart defense got better during the year, but this was a team based on offense and I don't think the plan or the execution was up to their talent level for three quarters. Walking away from a joyous and  deserving Union celebration that day should motivate every returning Hobart player AND coach to perform at your highest level in 2018. An overachieving team like Union that day is very inspirational for the program and I hope that Hobart gets some of that underdog hunger /inspiration so we can knock off Ithaca and Union later this year when they come to our house. I know the Statesmen were super motivated to beat RPI in 2017 because RPI ruined their season in 2015(no LL title) and 2016(no undefeated regular season) ...and they beat them 30-0. For 2018 we will not lack for motivation given our losses in 2017; however, I am concerned that our talent level has diminished at some key positions, but if the returning Statesmen can max out on motivation the way Ithaca and Union did against us in 2017, it will be that much sweeter to regain the LL title as underdogs.
     I can't wait for the new season to begin , as  LL Football should have some great competition in 2018.Happy New Year to all.

[Bartman]

Rosters are out for the NFLPA Bowl on 1/20 at the Rose Bowl and Brandon Shed is No.85 on the Nationals...good luck Brandon!

[Bombers798891]

  I revisited the Hobart losses to Ithaca and Union(as painful as it was) and I think Hobart had a good chance to win the IC game and given Hobart's overall talent level should have won the game, but Ithaca was well up to the task and Hobart coaching put too much pressure on D'Antonio to single cover Gladney(12 catches 183 yards) for most of the game. Gladney is one of those special players that you need to account for(I noticed Salisbury held him to one catch in the bowl game, but IC still prevailed) The IC defense was also a solid group in 2017. So, I don't feel bad losing to Ithaca because it was a true battle and IC deserved the win.
       The Union game, however, haunts me. The Hobart squad came out flat and the play calling was also off(or it seemed like Union knew the plays). Nothing against Union, as I am a big supporter of their rise back to winning, I just thought Hobart played one of their worst offensive games until it was too late. The Hobart defense got better during the year, but this was a team based on offense and I don't think the plan or the execution was up to their talent level for three quarters. Walking away from a joyous and  deserving Union celebration that day should motivate every returning Hobart player AND coach to perform at your highest level in 2018. An overachieving team like Union that day is very inspirational for the program and I hope that Hobart gets some of that underdog hunger /inspiration so we can knock off Ithaca and Union later this year when they come to our house. I know the Statesmen were super motivated to beat RPI in 2017 because RPI ruined their season in 2015(no LL title) and 2016(no undefeated regular season) ...and they beat them 30-0. For 2018 we will not lack for motivation given our losses in 2017; however, I am concerned that our talent level has diminished at some key positions, but if the returning Statesmen can max out on motivation the way Ithaca and Union did against us in 2017, it will be that much sweeter to regain the LL title as underdogs.
     I can't wait for the new season to begin , as  LL Football should have some great competition in 2018.Happy New Year to all.

1. Hobart absolutely could have beaten IC. They had the lead and the ball with 2:12 to go. The only thing that saved the Bombers was Swanstrom having all three of his timeouts left, which enabled the ensuing three-and-out to give them the ball with 1:46 left and not 1:03 or 22 seconds.

2. I never personally play the "We're going to be motivated!" game because well, it sort of seems insulting to the other team. I heard a lot of that during ICs 7-game Cortaca losing streak: Motivation to keep the non-losing season streak alive in 2011, to get a home playoff game in 2013, to not have the seniors graduate without a Cortaca win in 2014, to send Mike Welch off with a win in 2016. It's not that I think the Bombers weren't motivated. I'm sure they were. But Cortland was probably motivated as well, for whatever reasons. It's really hard to gauge how motivation works, and I think it's often used as an ex-post-facto explanation.

3. I think Hobart has to replace an all-time great at QB, and that's tough. But, they return enough talent on both sides of the ball to be a force in the LL

[Oline89]

  I revisited the Hobart losses to Ithaca and Union(as painful as it was) and I think Hobart had a good chance to win the IC game and given Hobart's overall talent level should have won the game, but Ithaca was well up to the task and Hobart coaching put too much pressure on D'Antonio to single cover Gladney(12 catches 183 yards) for most of the game. Gladney is one of those special players that you need to account for(I noticed Salisbury held him to one catch in the bowl game, but IC still prevailed) The IC defense was also a solid group in 2017. So, I don't feel bad losing to Ithaca because it was a true battle and IC deserved the win.
       The Union game, however, haunts me. The Hobart squad came out flat and the play calling was also off(or it seemed like Union knew the plays). Nothing against Union, as I am a big supporter of their rise back to winning, I just thought Hobart played one of their worst offensive games until it was too late. The Hobart defense got better during the year, but this was a team based on offense and I don't think the plan or the execution was up to their talent level for three quarters. Walking away from a joyous and  deserving Union celebration that day should motivate every returning Hobart player AND coach to perform at your highest level in 2018. An overachieving team like Union that day is very inspirational for the program and I hope that Hobart gets some of that underdog hunger /inspiration so we can knock off Ithaca and Union later this year when they come to our house. I know the Statesmen were super motivated to beat RPI in 2017 because RPI ruined their season in 2015(no LL title) and 2016(no undefeated regular season) ...and they beat them 30-0. For 2018 we will not lack for motivation given our losses in 2017; however, I am concerned that our talent level has diminished at some key positions, but if the returning Statesmen can max out on motivation the way Ithaca and Union did against us in 2017, it will be that much sweeter to regain the LL title as underdogs.
     I can't wait for the new season to begin , as  LL Football should have some great competition in 2018.Happy New Year to all.

1. Hobart absolutely could have beaten IC. They had the lead and the ball with 2:12 to go. The only thing that saved the Bombers was Swanstrom having all three of his timeouts left, which enabled the ensuing three-and-out to give them the ball with 1:46 left and not 1:03 or 22 seconds.

2. I never personally play the "We're going to be motivated!" game because well, it sort of seems insulting to the other team. I heard a lot of that during ICs 7-game Cortaca losing streak: Motivation to keep the non-losing season streak alive in 2011, to get a home playoff game in 2013, to not have the seniors graduate without a Cortaca win in 2014, to send Mike Welch off with a win in 2016. It's not that I think the Bombers weren't motivated. I'm sure they were. But Cortland was probably motivated as well, for whatever reasons. It's really hard to gauge how motivation works, and I think it's often used as an ex-post-facto explanation.

3. I think Hobart has to replace an all-time great at QB, and that's tough. But, they return enough talent on both sides of the ball to be a force in the LL

Uggh, there are so many things that had to wrong for Hobart to lose that game to Ithaca...and they all did.  Inability to get a first down, the only poor punt by our senior punter all year, pass interference and holding penalties....best to not remember.  Motivation from the previous year may help with a Coach's pregame speech, but matters very little on the field.  Hobart will return very strong O and D Line, RB's, WR's and defensive backfield.  The linebacking corps needs to be re-stocked and clearly the QB is a big question.  I know Hobart had a great recruiting class last year, and those kids (like all Freshman) are anxious to hit the field.

[Bombers798891]

  I revisited the Hobart losses to Ithaca and Union(as painful as it was) and I think Hobart had a good chance to win the IC game and given Hobart's overall talent level should have won the game, but Ithaca was well up to the task and Hobart coaching put too much pressure on D'Antonio to single cover Gladney(12 catches 183 yards) for most of the game. Gladney is one of those special players that you need to account for(I noticed Salisbury held him to one catch in the bowl game, but IC still prevailed) The IC defense was also a solid group in 2017. So, I don't feel bad losing to Ithaca because it was a true battle and IC deserved the win.
       The Union game, however, haunts me. The Hobart squad came out flat and the play calling was also off(or it seemed like Union knew the plays). Nothing against Union, as I am a big supporter of their rise back to winning, I just thought Hobart played one of their worst offensive games until it was too late. The Hobart defense got better during the year, but this was a team based on offense and I don't think the plan or the execution was up to their talent level for three quarters. Walking away from a joyous and  deserving Union celebration that day should motivate every returning Hobart player AND coach to perform at your highest level in 2018. An overachieving team like Union that day is very inspirational for the program and I hope that Hobart gets some of that underdog hunger /inspiration so we can knock off Ithaca and Union later this year when they come to our house. I know the Statesmen were super motivated to beat RPI in 2017 because RPI ruined their season in 2015(no LL title) and 2016(no undefeated regular season) ...and they beat them 30-0. For 2018 we will not lack for motivation given our losses in 2017; however, I am concerned that our talent level has diminished at some key positions, but if the returning Statesmen can max out on motivation the way Ithaca and Union did against us in 2017, it will be that much sweeter to regain the LL title as underdogs.
     I can't wait for the new season to begin , as  LL Football should have some great competition in 2018.Happy New Year to all.

1. Hobart absolutely could have beaten IC. They had the lead and the ball with 2:12 to go. The only thing that saved the Bombers was Swanstrom having all three of his timeouts left, which enabled the ensuing three-and-out to give them the ball with 1:46 left and not 1:03 or 22 seconds.

2. I never personally play the "We're going to be motivated!" game because well, it sort of seems insulting to the other team. I heard a lot of that during ICs 7-game Cortaca losing streak: Motivation to keep the non-losing season streak alive in 2011, to get a home playoff game in 2013, to not have the seniors graduate without a Cortaca win in 2014, to send Mike Welch off with a win in 2016. It's not that I think the Bombers weren't motivated. I'm sure they were. But Cortland was probably motivated as well, for whatever reasons. It's really hard to gauge how motivation works, and I think it's often used as an ex-post-facto explanation.

3. I think Hobart has to replace an all-time great at QB, and that's tough. But, they return enough talent on both sides of the ball to be a force in the LL

Uggh, there are so many things that had to wrong for Hobart to lose that game to Ithaca...and they all did.  Inability to get a first down, the only poor punt by our senior punter all year, pass interference and holding penalties....best to not remember.  Motivation from the previous year may help with a Coach's pregame speech, but matters very little on the field.  Hobart will return very strong O and D Line, RB's, WR's and defensive backfield.  The linebacking corps needs to be re-stocked and clearly the QB is a big question.  I know Hobart had a great recruiting class last year, and those kids (like all Freshman) are anxious to hit the field.

I'm a Falcons fan, so I know all about perfect storms losing games. Let's move on, hahaha

[dlippiel]

As dlip sits on his favorite chair pondering his thoughts he is very excited to read the recent LL 2018 talk.

First, how great is it having Ithaca in the league? Dlip means to even be having the Hobart/IC discussion is awesome. Dlip sees a great foundation being built for intense rivalries and tradition between some excellent athletic and academic institutions.

As time goes by Bart and dlip reflects on the Union/Hobart game he certainly hears you. If there was a fifth quarter Bart would have won IDHO. Dlip was so proud of his Dutchmen that day. It was saucy a wonderful coming back to relevance party for his beloved Garnet. With that being said Bart certainly was two different teams that day. Some of which dlip attributes to Union's D but some of which he attributes to Bart coming out a little flat and over confident. Bart's slow starts cost them this season more than once. It will be interesting to see what the Statesmen bring to the 2018 season. Dlip knows one thing for sure. A strong Hobart, Ithaca, Union, and RPI is not only great for the league but for the east region as well. If SLU can bounce back this season may be an all out dog fight.

We'll probably all spar with each other and get pissed because of the competitiveness and intensity of the games but in the end the winner of the LL in 2018 will be one hell of a ****ing football team and one we can all stand behind...even if it's ****ing RPI again...

[ITH radio]

Slow starts were an issue all season, not just the Union game, for Hobart. Recapped that on the CA blog around December. Link is http://gohobart.blogspot.com/2017/12/looking-back-on-2017-season.html if anyone cares.

Heard that Statesmen will have a few new opponents this year given the SJF and Wick contracts were "one and done's". Should have 10 games but right now sitting at 9.

LL should be very competitive again this fall and it makes it more interesting with 4 good teams in the mix. Not sure how SLU and UofR will rebound - kind of surprised a coaching hire hasn't been announced yet at the latter, actually.

[Oline89]

Slow starts were an issue all season, not just the Union game, for Hobart. Recapped that on the CA blog around December. Link is http://gohobart.blogspot.com/2017/12/looking-back-on-2017-season.html if anyone cares.

Heard that Statesmen will have a few new opponents this year given the SJF and Wick contracts were "one and done's". Should have 10 games but right now sitting at 9.

LL should be very competitive again this fall and it makes it more interesting with 4 good teams in the mix. Not sure how SLU and UofR will rebound - kind of surprised a coaching hire hasn't been announced yet at the latter, actually.

I know the Coaches Convention just wrapped up this Wednesday in Charlotte.  There are plenty of jobs to get filled at the FBS and FCS levels, once those get filled, I am sure the dominoes will begin to fall.  The next two weeks should bring lots of coaching news.  Last year, Hobart posted the nine game schedule at the beginning of February, and the SJF game was announced later.   Can't wait to see what OOC games are on the Horizon for all the LL games.  I know Buff State joins the LL next year, but do they begin to schedule games with the league this year?