FB: Liberty League

[Bartman]

Thoughts on the Hobart -IC game today.  Hobart needed a perfect game to be in the game today.  Looked possible after Q1, that targeting call was tough, losing our #1 LB changed the momentum instantly.  It seemed to also change the approach by the Hobart defense, played the rest of the game with a  3 man rush and few (maybe zero?) blitzes.  That is not the way to beat Joe G.  Missing a chip in field goal at the end of the half was painful, game went from 7-3 to 14-0 in 90 seconds.  Lastly, Joe G is for real.  Great athlete, good runner, great passer, and has some serious football sense.  He turned at least 4 plays that should have been tackles in the backfield into big plays (2 for TD's).  He is clearly the difference maker in the LL this year, sets IC way ahead of the rest of the pack

+k to Oline for a fair and difficult post to make after a 34-0 loss for the Statesmen. While we knew it would take a perfect game by the players and coaches given our health and depth, we fell far short of perfection in many ways. Sometimes you just get beat, but it hurts more when you contribute to your own beating. It seemed like we could believe when Hackett lined up for the FG to make it 7-3 , but it didn't happen and boom it's 14-0. I saw the hit that Emmett made from the visitors side and I really thought he led with his shoulder and the IC players helmet then hit the helmet of the Hobart defender on the other side, but I could be wrong and would need to see the film. Of course, in the moment I was weak and contributed to the vocal displeasure in the call .That was a devastating moment for the team that really has played clean under DeWall (least penalized team up until this game)and has not taken the bait to retaliate...but whether the official made the right judgement or not it was just one factor we lost. Our early running game and offense was making first downs and keeping the ball away from The Germ...but just couldn't convert. As far as Joe G, it was a painful pleasure to watch his ability to execute with tremendous athleticism . While I may have issues with the whole transfer scenario as expressed in earlier posts, to say I didn't fantasize what the day would have been like if he played in orange pants, I'd be lying. In comparison, The Hobart QBs just did not execute at a level that could take advantage of a beatable IC secondary. Although the IC defense performed much better than advertised.....obviously, we scored no points.
  So the Statesmen take this defeat and bring their heads up and likely finish the season 8-2, an improvement on a 5-4 season with two painful losses to teams that will battle it out for the LL title in a few weeks. I will say to both Union and IC you should not take RPI lightly based on our defeat of RPI as the Engineers have more ability than that outcome may have shown .
   My last comment is I support Jonny Utah's next man up on this LL board and wait for the return of Bombers and PA, as we patiently waited for Mach to return sans the massive Lime Jell-O...it should all be in fun......hell I can't wait for the banter before the Union-IC game(I think Union will win) and the shoes game( I think RPI will scare the s*** out of the Dutchmen).....and I don't care if we ever get to the Stagg Bowl or if voters don't give us enough love.....I just care that the Statesmen finish the season with pride and kick the s*** out of the Dutchmen and the Bombers at the Boz in 2020. GOBART
   

[UfanBill]

Targeting or No targeting, that is the question 

I was at the Union/St. Lawrence game so obviously I did not see the targeting hit called on Hobart OLB Emmett Forde. I did witness a similar targeting personal foul and ejection called in the 2nd quarter on #9 Union safety Austin St. Pierre. These plays happen so fast that it is very hard to see exactly what happened. All I knew was that it was a huge, violent hit...the flag was thrown and after a conference by the officials the 15 yards was marked off and St. Pierre was ejected. OK, I didn't like it but it seemed like the right call. *It is important to note that targeting calls are reviewable if live video is available. This is not the case for most DIII football.

Just like the ejection of Forde, St.Pierre's loss immediately changed the game. St. Lawrence began working pass routes in the direction of his replacement which also put pressure on the CB on that side. The Union defense was having a hard time adjusting which greatly contributed to St. Lawrence QB Tyler Grochot throwing for 300+ yards in the first half. It was 17-17 at halftime and really the Larries should of had the lead.

Then something unusual happened. When the Union defense took the field for the 2nd half St. Pierre was back out there. I was confused. I thought a first half targeting call meant you were out for the remainder of that game. (a 2nd half call and you miss the 1st half of the next game)...What was I missing? Well, there is a new provision of the targeting rule that allows officials to review video at halftime and reconsider their ejection ruling. Apparently this is what happened with St. Pierre...To you Hobart fans who didn't think the ejection of Forde was justified, let me say that in all likelihood the refs reviewed the Forde hit and decided to let it stand. That's all you can ask from the officials.         

[Pat Coleman]

Targeting or No targeting, that is the question 

I was at the Union/St. Lawrence game so obviously I did not see the targeting hit called on Hobart OLB Emmett Forde. I did witness a similar targeting personal foul and ejection called in the 2nd quarter on #9 Union safety Austin St. Pierre. These plays happen so fast that it is very hard to see exactly what happened. All I knew was that it was a huge, violent hit...the flag was thrown and after a conference by the officials the 15 yards was marked off and St. Pierre was ejected. OK, I didn't like it but it seemed like the right call. *It is important to note that targeting calls are reviewable if live video is available. This is not the case for most DIII football.

Just like the ejection of Forde, St.Pierre's loss immediately changed the game. St. Lawrence began working pass routes in the direction of his replacement which also put pressure on the CB on that side. The Union defense was having a hard time adjusting which greatly contributed to St. Lawrence QB Tyler Grochot throwing for 300+ yards in the first half. It was 17-17 at halftime and really the Larries should of had the lead.

Then something unusual happened. When the Union defense took the field for the 2nd half St. Pierre was back out there. I was confused. I thought a first half targeting call meant you were out for the remainder of that game. (a 2nd half call and you miss the 1st half of the next game)...What was I missing? Well, there is a new provision of the targeting rule that allows officials to review video at halftime and reconsider their ejection ruling. Apparently this is what happened with St. Pierre...To you Hobart fans who didn't think the ejection of Forde was justified, let me say that in all likelihood the refs reviewed the Forde hit and decided to let it stand. That's all you can ask from the officials.       

Yes, that is correct. And they will review it on game film if need be.

[Pat Coleman]

Disappointed to see two people leave the board yesterday.

[Oline89]

Targeting or No targeting, that is the question 

I was at the Union/St. Lawrence game so obviously I did not see the targeting hit called on Hobart OLB Emmett Forde. I did witness a similar targeting personal foul and ejection called in the 2nd quarter on #9 Union safety Austin St. Pierre. These plays happen so fast that it is very hard to see exactly what happened. All I knew was that it was a huge, violent hit...the flag was thrown and after a conference by the officials the 15 yards was marked off and St. Pierre was ejected. OK, I didn't like it but it seemed like the right call. *It is important to note that targeting calls are reviewable if live video is available. This is not the case for most DIII football.

Just like the ejection of Forde, St.Pierre's loss immediately changed the game. St. Lawrence began working pass routes in the direction of his replacement which also put pressure on the CB on that side. The Union defense was having a hard time adjusting which greatly contributed to St. Lawrence QB Tyler Grochot throwing for 300+ yards in the first half. It was 17-17 at halftime and really the Larries should of had the lead.

Then something unusual happened. When the Union defense took the field for the 2nd half St. Pierre was back out there. I was confused. I thought a first half targeting call meant you were out for the remainder of that game. (a 2nd half call and you miss the 1st half of the next game)...What was I missing? Well, there is a new provision of the targeting rule that allows officials to review video at halftime and reconsider their ejection ruling. Apparently this is what happened with St. Pierre...To you Hobart fans who didn't think the ejection of Forde was justified, let me say that in all likelihood the refs reviewed the Forde hit and decided to let it stand. That's all you can ask from the officials.       

It was reviewed at halftime. I am amazed that your officials actually admitted they were wrong.  I saw the Forde play in person and have seen it since. 100% a judgement call.  It was a violent hit, but was to the shoulder, not helmet, receiver was not vulnerable, he bounced right up.  Just a shame kid was tossed, our defensive MVP was missed.

[Jonny Utah]

Targeting or No targeting, that is the question 

I was at the Union/St. Lawrence game so obviously I did not see the targeting hit called on Hobart OLB Emmett Forde. I did witness a similar targeting personal foul and ejection called in the 2nd quarter on #9 Union safety Austin St. Pierre. These plays happen so fast that it is very hard to see exactly what happened. All I knew was that it was a huge, violent hit...the flag was thrown and after a conference by the officials the 15 yards was marked off and St. Pierre was ejected. OK, I didn't like it but it seemed like the right call. *It is important to note that targeting calls are reviewable if live video is available. This is not the case for most DIII football.

Just like the ejection of Forde, St.Pierre's loss immediately changed the game. St. Lawrence began working pass routes in the direction of his replacement which also put pressure on the CB on that side. The Union defense was having a hard time adjusting which greatly contributed to St. Lawrence QB Tyler Grochot throwing for 300+ yards in the first half. It was 17-17 at halftime and really the Larries should of had the lead.

Then something unusual happened. When the Union defense took the field for the 2nd half St. Pierre was back out there. I was confused. I thought a first half targeting call meant you were out for the remainder of that game. (a 2nd half call and you miss the 1st half of the next game)...What was I missing? Well, there is a new provision of the targeting rule that allows officials to review video at halftime and reconsider their ejection ruling. Apparently this is what happened with St. Pierre...To you Hobart fans who didn't think the ejection of Forde was justified, let me say that in all likelihood the refs reviewed the Forde hit and decided to let it stand. That's all you can ask from the officials.       

It was reviewed at halftime. I am amazed that your officials actually admitted they were wrong.  I saw the Forde play in person and have seen it since. 100% a judgement call.  It was a violent hit, but was to the shoulder, not helmet, receiver was not vulnerable, he bounced right up.  Just a shame kid was tossed, our defensive MVP was missed.

You see the same In division one football games all the time and I'm guessing the only difference is that the d3 level doesn't have the ability for a quick replay for officials to view. I don't think it's the officials "getting it wrong" because that's just the way the rule is written.  Automatic ejection until a replay.  Referees don't ever call targeting in college without the automatic ejection. 

[Oline89]

Well isn't it by definition getting it wrong if they change it from targeting (and ejection) to something else?  I guess it gets downgraded to unnecessary roughness.  My opinion was the flag against Forde could have been unnecessary roughness as well, he didn't target a head shot, it wasn't helmet to helmet, the receiver wasn't in a vulnerable position.

[Jonny Utah]

Yea I'll have to look it up but they get overturned all the time and I always was under the impression that the ejection was written into the rule because there was replay readily available for view (at the d1 level). Certainly makes the rule a lot different at each level.

But it's one of those penalties that is pretty hard to get right live.  Plays like those can look a lot different in replay which is why I think the rule is written that way.

[Caz Bombers]

well looky who just walked in the door at #25

https://d3football.com/top25/2019/week7

IC up to 8, just 9 points shy of catching North Central

[D O.C.]

Union can thank LINFIELD for making way for them.
Oh!...
Johns Hopkins

Missing posters! Please come back!

[Bartman]

Union can thank LINFIELD for making way for them.
Oh!...
Johns Hopkins

Missing posters! Please come back!

D O.C.,
     If you know any recruits from Cali that would prefer the East Coast for any crazy reason,  please send them Hobart's way so we can surpass Ithaca and Union......it would be  appreciated, Bartman

[D O.C.]

That's a reasonable request.
I let one get away to Williams once.

[Machiavelli]

That's a reasonable request.
I let one get away to Williams once.

Doesn't count.

[UfanBill]

It's clear that I'm a big believer in this year's Union team but in the first half Saturday my confidence in them was weakening. The offense was fine but the D gave up over 300 passing yards to St. Lawrence and it's excellent QB Tyler Grochet. They're having all they can handle from the Larries what will Ithaca and Joe G. do to them? Maybe they're not as good as I thought.

I got my answer in the 2nd half. Good teams find a way. They make adjustments. Union came out going to their strength...first taking the lead by throwing repeatedly to WR Andre Ross Jr. (St. Lawrence inexplicably thought they could single cover him, they couldn't) and then with the lead turning to RB Ike Irabor to control the ball and the clock. They successfully kept the St. Lawrence offense on the sidelines. Grochet only threw for 40 yards and zero points in the 2nd half. Union won comfortably and I can keep believing. 

[Jonny Utah]

It's clear that I'm a big believer in this year's Union team but in the first half Saturday my confidence in them was weakening. The offense was fine but the D gave up over 300 passing yards to St. Lawrence and it's excellent QB Tyler Grochet. They're having all they can handle from the Larries what will Ithaca and Joe G. do to them? Maybe they're not as good as I thought.

I got my answer in the 2nd half. Good teams find a way. They make adjustments. Union came out going to their strength...first taking the lead by throwing repeatedly to WR Andre Ross Jr. (St. Lawrence inexplicably thought they could single cover him, they couldn't) and then with the lead turning to RB Ike Irabor to control the ball and the clock. They successfully kept the St. Lawrence offense on the sidelines. Grochet only threw for 40 yards and zero points in the 2nd half. Union won comfortably and I can keep believing. 

Well I think Joe G. on his own makes Ithaca favorites in the Union/IC game, but Ithaca has not seen a run game or running back like Ike all year.  That might close the gap in this game and make it even.  I don't have concerns with Ithaca's defense that some have talked about, but a Ross Jr. with a run game does make me worried that Union may be able to expose a young IC defense that hasn't seen an offense like Unions with some experienced skill players.. Ithaca's run game is solid but not great, and overall this game might come down to turnovers, who comes out fired up, coaching adjustments, big/trick plays, special teams, and maybe the biggest factor is Joe G.  Can union force him into a bad game?  Can union start out like they did with Hobart and just keep a cushion long enough to grind out a win?