FB: Liberty League

[SJFF82]

However, I also believe that the MAC was a lot up this year.

+k for being right on with this statement. dlip recalls early in the season when Leb Val, Del Val (even after the loss to Wesley), and Albright seemed hot, some, myself included, hesitated to recognize the strength of this conference and wanted to wait and see how things played out. Well they played out and hats of to the MAC and its top three teams.

Why do I say the E8 is much more up on the LL this year?  Because it is my belief that if you combined the 2 conferences, Alfred, St. John Fisher, and Springfield would probably come in 1 - 2 - 3.  And MAYBE Ithaca would even take 4th...I think Hartwick was garbage this year so Union beating them doesn't make my nads perk up.  I think the Super Conference standings would have gone down like this:

1.  Alfred
2.  Springfield
3.  St. John Fisher
4.  Susquehanna
5.  Ithaca
6.  Union
7.  Hobart
8.  Hartwick
9.  Rochester
10.  RPI
11.  MMA
12.  St. Lawrence
13.  WPI
14.  Utica

Based on...?

Science

Interesting science since Union beat Ithaca head to head.

Frank of all people....you know better than to make such a bald assertion.  How do you propose to numerically rank teams if A beats B, and B beats C, and C beats A and so on....Besides he has them 5 and 6 not 5 and 17....cmon Frank....your better than that logic.

[dewcrew88]

Ok, so i'll shut up on the topic after this...but to appease Frank, I made a breakdown, without manually changing the #'s to make them even.  I even adjusted some #'s (Fisher/Susq/Springfield - Hobart/Roch/Hartwick - Union/Ithaca) after thinking about them more, and to make people happy.  Here is what I came up with with.  1/2 points don't exist in my logic because there is no such thing as the 1.5 best team.

1   Alfred
2   StJohnFisher
3   Susquehanna
4   Springfield
5   Union
6   Ithaca
7   Hobart
8   Rochester
9   Hartwick
10   RPI
11   MMA
12   StLawrence
13   WPI
14   Utica

LL - 3+5+7+8+10+11+12+13 = 69/8 - 8.625
E8 - 1+2+4+6+9+14 = 36/6 = 6

Not that I even care because I don't feel numbers are needed, the E6 is slightly better than the LL top to bottom this year.  They are stronger at the top, relatively the same in the middle, and marginally weaker at the bottom with what i consider the worst team of the 14, however, I think Utica, WPI, St. Lawrence, MMA would have a sick Round Robin tourney.
[/quote

Yeah I'm basically on the same page with this (maybe bracketing slightly differently), but the bottom line is that the E8 is better because they have top 2 teams and they don't have as much at the bottom due to only having six teams - kind of like the DI lax debate about whether the ACC is a conference when it's only 4 unreal teams (UMD, UNC, UVA & Duke), or is it more of a coalition when comparing with the ECAC, CAA, GWLL or, now, Big East. 

And Dew, I knew you'd comment on UC vis-a-vis the other bottom two or three teams, but 12-14 are fairly interchangeable doesn't mean much. 

It would change the numbers, that's why i commented.

[SJFF82]

Here, Terd.  I did what you did, except, I applied relative distancing based on my assessments of the seasons each team had.  No, I didn't juice the numbers.  Here's what I came up with based on my personal assessments, backed by my arguments from the last couple days:

1. Alfred
1.5. Susquehanna
2. Union
2.5. Springfield
3. SJF
4. Hobart
4.5. Ithaca
5. Rochester
6.5. RPI
8. St. Lawrence
11. MMA
13. Hartwick
14. WPI
15. Utica

Average positioning:  

LL -- 1.5+2+4+5+6.5+8+11+14 = 52/8 = 6.5

E8 -- 1+2.5+3+4.5+13+15 = 39/6 = 6.5

Like I said, my nod, based on OOC fluff goes to the LL.  However, losing Susquehanna obviously changes the "this point forward" comparisons.

translation..."I did juice the numbers and this is just my subjective silly opinion just like everyone else's"

[SJFF82]

How can you honestly have SC over SJF?

SJF blasted them two weeks ago by 27

Ask Joy Solomen and Mike DeLong.  That's how they had it... But I'll grant you that point.  Flip them and it doesn't affect my numbers.

sorry Frank...this is beat up Frank day...another fine assessment....because Springfield's coach says they are better than SJF they must be...thanks for the strong unbiased evidence there.

[SJFF82]

Frank, what would you put the spread at on AU-Susq if they had to play today in a game that mattered?  How bout SJF-Susq. ?

[SaintsFAN]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

[Yanks 99]

However, I also believe that the MAC was a lot up this year.

+k for being right on with this statement. dlip recalls early in the season when Leb Val, Del Val (even after the loss to Wesley), and Albright seemed hot, some, myself included, hesitated to recognize the strength of this conference and wanted to wait and see how things played out. Well they played out and hats of to the MAC and its top three teams.

Why do I say the E8 is much more up on the LL this year?  Because it is my belief that if you combined the 2 conferences, Alfred, St. John Fisher, and Springfield would probably come in 1 - 2 - 3.  And MAYBE Ithaca would even take 4th...I think Hartwick was garbage this year so Union beating them doesn't make my nads perk up.  I think the Super Conference standings would have gone down like this:

1.  Alfred
2.  Springfield
3.  St. John Fisher
4.  Susquehanna
5.  Ithaca
6.  Union
7.  Hobart
8.  Hartwick
9.  Rochester
10.  RPI
11.  MMA
12.  St. Lawrence
13.  WPI
14.  Utica

I think UC could beat slu, wpi and maybe even mma

I think you could maybe move Utica to #13, and ahead of WPI...but even that is suspect.  I think MMA is better (they had a win against a "quality" opponent this year is Susquehana) and I think SLU is better (they beat MMA pretty badly, and played everyone tough at the end of the year when they could have packed it in and went home...with only one monkey stomp loss to Ithaca way back in September).

My god...are we really arguing that our worst team is not worse then your worst team...

[PBR...]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

LOL...nice why dont u bite pbr and take that loser of a d3football team benjamin moore w/ ya... if dvc were to play them this saterday dvc would be favored by 60+ points....

[Doid23]

too bad urban warfare just went on record saying no thx to the domers...

didn't Saban say that also (tersely) when he was with the Dolphins?  Though, SF believes Brian Kelly is the #1 candidate here for the Domers.

the amount of money ND would have to eat (pun intended) on the weis contract and what they would have to pay urban pbr just doesnt see it happening. especially in this economy. in fact wouldnt surprise me to see weis there 1 more year just to slice another year off that contract and make it less painful to swallow for a buy out. of course we all would love to see weis there another year...

It would stun me if he makes it another year, but I agree, I would LOVE to see him there next year.

FREE CHARLIE WEIS!!

[Yanks 99]

too bad urban warfare just went on record saying no thx to the domers...

didn't Saban say that also (tersely) when he was with the Dolphins?  Though, SF believes Brian Kelly is the #1 candidate here for the Domers.

the amount of money ND would have to eat (pun intended) on the weis contract and what they would have to pay urban pbr just doesnt see it happening. especially in this economy. in fact wouldnt surprise me to see weis there 1 more year just to slice another year off that contract and make it less painful to swallow for a buy out. of course we all would love to see weis there another year...

It would stun me if he makes it another year, but I agree, I would LOVE to see him there next year.

FREE CHARLIE WEIS!!

I am a huge Notre Dame fan...but Weiss probably has to go...

Go figure...the AD that gave him that stupid contract is now the AD at Duke...how does that guy have a job anywhere???

[SaintsFAN]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

LOL...nice why dont u bite pbr and take that loser of a d3football team benjamin moore w/ ya... if dvc were to play them this saterday dvc would be favored by 60+ points....

its johnny a. moore and who the hell is dvc??  we'd have to spot them 60 points just because of their uniform colors --- 

[PBR...]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

LOL...nice why dont u bite pbr and take that loser of a d3football team benjamin moore w/ ya... if dvc were to play them this saterday dvc would be favored by 60+ points....

its johnny a. moore and who the hell is dvc??  we'd have to spot them 60 points just because of their uniform colors --- 

figures you know about colors since your school is named after a paint company....

[SaintsFAN]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

LOL...nice why dont u bite pbr and take that loser of a d3football team benjamin moore w/ ya... if dvc were to play them this saterday dvc would be favored by 60+ points....

its johnny a. moore and who the hell is dvc??  we'd have to spot them 60 points just because of their uniform colors --- 

figures you know about colors since your school is named after a paint company....

i got nothing for that

[PBR...]

pbr,

(in the spirit of today's Liberty League pissing match)

why don' t you go back to your home on whore island??!!

LOL...nice why dont u bite pbr and take that loser of a d3football team benjamin moore w/ ya... if dvc were to play them this saterday dvc would be favored by 60+ points....

its johnny a. moore and who the hell is dvc??  we'd have to spot them 60 points just because of their uniform colors --- 

figures you know about colors since your school is named after a paint company....

i got nothing for that

+k SF... our teams are still standing in the battlefield!

[SaintsFAN]

+k SF... our teams are still standing in the battlefield!

indeed... and SF feels Del Val could match up well with MUC.  They are physical enough to give them a game.

+K