FB: Liberty League

[lewdogg11]

dlip doesn't understand the issue here fellas??? He believes he made it clear that he is not placing all the blame on Union's struggles (not even close) on the aforementioned topic. With that said you should be able to see that within an athletic department that has all d3 sports and 1 D1 sport that even at that level is behind the eight ball (not giving scholarships) how in the name of the lord could they compete without taking resources like admissions exceptions, some $, and the overall prioritization of the sport over others. If you think that Union Football is getting the same attention and focus from the athletic department that they used to you are just flat wrong. Is this the complete reason that the football team is fledgling? No but it clearly has a role.

Utah so what your saying is that if Ithaca all of a sudden fielded a D1 hockey program that did not give scholarships and wished to compete in the top echelon of the division that IC could make that happen AND provide football with the same attention it gets now?

Well that's what I'm asking.  If you still have the same coaching staff, the same facilities, the same recruiting budget, the same amount of financial aid that I assume within the rules must be consistent with all student a regardless of divisional sport (again, like I said, I am not that knowledgable about non- scholarship financial aid and admissions for d1 sports and if that has some sort of exemption) then no, football probably shouldnt be effected.

I'm asking for specifics.  Like union used to spend x on football and now they spend y because money was diverted to Nother sport, or that the financial aid and admissions offices no longer bend for football players, instead they diverted those resources towards hockey players.

Without specifics, I don't think you can just say hockey takes away from football because they won a national championship.  I'm not implying that you said it is a major factor either, just that I don't really see that as a reason at all unless I see some sort of actual data.

What is the need for data when you have perception?

[dlippiel]

dlip doesn't understand the issue here fellas??? He believes he made it clear that he is not placing all the blame on Union's struggles (not even close) on the aforementioned topic. With that said you should be able to see that within an athletic department that has all d3 sports and 1 D1 sport that even at that level is behind the eight ball (not giving scholarships) how in the name of the lord could they compete without taking resources like admissions exceptions, some $, and the overall prioritization of the sport over others. If you think that Union Football is getting the same attention and focus from the athletic department that they used to you are just flat wrong. Is this the complete reason that the football team is fledgling? No but it clearly has a role.

Utah so what your saying is that if Ithaca all of a sudden fielded a D1 hockey program that did not give scholarships and wished to compete in the top echelon of the division that IC could make that happen AND provide football with the same attention it gets now?

Well that's what I'm asking.  If you still have the same coaching staff, the same facilities, the same recruiting budget, the same amount of financial aid that I assume within the rules must be consistent with all student a regardless of divisional sport (again, like I said, I am not that knowledgable about non- scholarship financial aid and admissions for d1 sports and if that has some sort of exemption) then no, football probably shouldnt be effected.

I'm asking for specifics.  Like union used to spend x on football and now they spend y because money was diverted to Nother sport, or that the financial aid and admissions offices no longer bend for football players, instead they diverted those resources towards hockey players.

Without specifics, I don't think you can just say hockey takes away from football because they won a national championship.  I'm not implying that you said it is a major factor either, just that I don't really see that as a reason at all unless I see some sort of actual data.

What is the need for data when you have perception?

Well dlip has to admit that much of it is dlip's perception from what he hears. Does dlip have specifics? No, and that is an absolutely valid thing to ask for Utah. However to dlip, knowing the insides of the way college hockey works, he cannot even imagine that Union is able to compete on the ice without almost all of their financial and admissions efforts/exceptions, etc going towards hockey and being taken away from other areas.

dlip does not mean this in a snarky manner (you guys know dlip is not a dick on here...anymore) but to dlip it seems as if it would be/is obvious that this is happening at least to some degree. However, with that said in fairness to Utah, what are the specific examples of this? dlip has to answer that honestly, he doesn't have any. Lew is right on, it is really all dlip's perception at this point. Could it be wrong? Sure. dlip just doesn't think it is.

[Bombers798891]

With that said you should be able to see that within an athletic department that has all d3 sports and 1 D1 sport that even at that level is behind the eight ball (not giving scholarships) how in the name of the lord could they compete without taking resources like admissions exceptions, some $, and the overall prioritization of the sport over others. If you think that Union Football is getting the same attention and focus from the athletic department that they used to you are just flat wrong.

I'm going to agree with Utah here. I mean, get Dlip's point that, if you're just offering D-III sports, the newly-added D-I sport that you're nationally elite is will probably become top priority within the athletic department.

But you have to provide evidence of what this affect is on football. Are there fewer admissions exceptions? What exactly does getting "less attention and focus" from an athletic department do to a football team?

You know the one thing I've seen from being around IC's athletic department? With rare exceptions, no one is happy with the attention they're getting. Everyone wants more recognition, money, help. Bad teams. Good teams. Nationally-elite teams. I've heard this story from more people than I can remember: When Jim Butterfield retired, IC was considering a highly-successful coach who essentially said he'd take the job if he got the same institutional support Butterfield did.

He did not get the job. From everything I've heard, Mike Welch did not get that level of support either.

Adapt or die. Make do with less. Is it frustrating? No doubt. But you've got to figure out a way around that. Sure, there are the lucky teams that are getting more, but given how higher education itself is having its own issues, you're much more likely to be on the downswing (or at least a relative holding pattern) than the upswing in an athletic department

[dlippiel]

With that said you should be able to see that within an athletic department that has all d3 sports and 1 D1 sport that even at that level is behind the eight ball (not giving scholarships) how in the name of the lord could they compete without taking resources like admissions exceptions, some $, and the overall prioritization of the sport over others. If you think that Union Football is getting the same attention and focus from the athletic department that they used to you are just flat wrong.

I'm going to agree with Utah here. I mean, get Dlip's point that, if you're just offering D-III sports, the newly-added D-I sport that you're nationally elite is will probably become top priority within the athletic department.

But you have to provide evidence of what this affect is on football. Are there fewer admissions exceptions? What exactly does getting "less attention and focus" from an athletic department do to a football team?

You know the one thing I've seen from being around IC's athletic department? With rare exceptions, no one is happy with the attention they're getting. Everyone wants more recognition, money, help. Bad teams. Good teams. Nationally-elite teams. I've heard this story from more people than I can remember: When Jim Butterfield retired, IC was considering a highly-successful coach who essentially said he'd take the job if he got the same institutional support Butterfield did.

He did not get the job. From everything I've heard, Mike Welch did not get that level of support either.

Adapt or die. Make do with less. Is it frustrating? No doubt. But you've got to figure out a way around that. Sure, there are the lucky teams that are getting more, but given how higher education itself is having its own issues, you're much more likely to be on the downswing (or at least a relative holding pattern) than the upswing in an athletic department

A good post here Bombers. +k to you and the page

[ITH radio]

SC vs. HOB - epic rush O vs. top ranked rush D. Is HOB as good as we think? Or have the Bartmen taken a step back? SC looks like a legit squad. Looking forward to how this pans out.

SLU vs. RPI - probably the best game on the (LL) schedule. Very evenly matched teams with excellent passing QBs, WRs and defenses. Winner stays 3-0 in the LL and on a crash course with winner of SC/HOB game.

WPI vs. UNI - The Dutchmen need a W. They should get it against WPI who's not at 100% but has a tough D.

UofR vs MMA - big game for these teams in keeping them at .500 and getting a 1st LL W

Curious how Utica vs. Sals pans out and I think Buff St will give IC a good run but the Bombers will prevail.

Lyco vs. DelVal should be a good one too in the MAC. Winner of that game in the driver seat for a shot at the MAC title.

In NJAC, who'da thunk Cortland vs. TCNJ would be 0-4 vs. 1-3? Man...

And finally, a tip of the cap to Coach Chad Martinovich (Hobart '94) on MIT's 4-0 start. They will probably improve to 5-0 when they beat Nichols (currently 1-4) this wkd.

[lewdogg11]

ITH kind of beat me to the punch as I was putting together LewDogg11's BOLD predictions for the first time this season:


Hobart - 31
Springfield - 21
I think Springfield is probably pretty decent.  But Hobart tends to step up against better competition.  Hobart by 10+.

RPI - 34
SLU - 17
This game looks close on paper.  I think RPI is the better team and it's a big day and will be in front of a decent crowd.  I think RPI takes care of business.

Union - 49
WPI - 35
For some reason I thought Union had a BYE week.  Doh!  Against WPI howver, it's kind of like a bye week.  I think Union gets in the W column finally.  If they don't, i'd clean house on Sunday.

Rochester - 17
MMA - 14
Tough one to pick here.  I was gonna pick MMA but after seeing them last week, I don't think they are good...at all.  So i'm gonna say Rochester in a snoozer.

Utica - 28
Salisbury - 24
I think this is an upset, but I really have no idea.  Utica does what Fisher can't.

Buff St - 17
Ithaca - 10
Another upset I think?  The E8 is pretty confusing because i don't know who the favorites are in half the games.  I think Buff St. takes care of this one and FINALLY wins an important game.

St. John Fisher - 56
Hartwick - 13
I think Fisher is pissed and they come out with something to prove.

And there you have an installment of LD11's BOLD predictions.

[Bombers798891]

Buff St - 17
Ithaca - 10
Another upset I think?  The E8 is pretty confusing because i don't know who the favorites are in half the games.  I think Buff St. takes care of this one and FINALLY wins an important game.

And there you have an installment of LD11's BOLD predictions.

Buff State's 4-1, but they had the miracle win against Cortland, and needed a late 4th-quarter comeback to down Salisbury.

This would be an upset, and I have no idea what to think. Buffalo State always gives IC trouble. One the one hand, Buffalo State has a great offense, but Ithaca's got the best defense in the conference. Buffalo State's defense isn't very good, but Ithaca's offense might be the 2nd weakest behind Frostburg State's. Ithaca's got the advantage in the return game, but Buff State's got a long-range kicker few can match.

I could buy the Buff State pick, but I might up the scoring a tad. Like, 23-19 or so.

[lewdogg11]

Buff St - 17
Ithaca - 10
Another upset I think?  The E8 is pretty confusing because i don't know who the favorites are in half the games.  I think Buff St. takes care of this one and FINALLY wins an important game.

And there you have an installment of LD11's BOLD predictions.

Buff State's 4-1, but they had the miracle win against Cortland, and needed a late 4th-quarter comeback to down Salisbury.

This would be an upset, and I have no idea what to think. Buffalo State always gives IC trouble. One the one hand, Buffalo State has a great offense, but Ithaca's got the best defense in the conference. Buffalo State's defense isn't very good, but Ithaca's offense might be the 2nd weakest behind Frostburg State's. Ithaca's got the advantage in the return game, but Buff State's got a long-range kicker few can match.

I could buy the Buff State pick, but I might up the scoring a tad. Like, 23-19 or so.

I felt like Ithaca loves those 'grind it out' type of games.  Looking back the last couple of years, there aren't many Ithaca games where either team has had above 30 points.  With Buff St. it totally good be higher scoring but who the heck knows.  That's why it's a BOLD prediction.  Haha.  And with the Cortland win, crazy things happen at the beginning of the year.  That game could have broken Cortland's spirit for the entire season so for when it was played, it is a big win in my book.

[ITH radio]

That / those are BOLD

[dlippiel]

****ing love when we start picking!

Dlip goes with

Pumpkins over Pride 34-28.

Dlip really does not THINK Hobart is a top ten team. However he hopes they are...if they can squash Springfield in convincing fashion, more convincing than Dlip's score prediction, maybe then Dlip buys in some more.

Engineers over Saints 28-17

RPI's "We're Kind of Back" party. Dlip likes what he has seen from the Engineers thus far. Happy Isernia is having success in Troylet. LL is MUCH BETTER when RPI is relevant!

Dammit Dutchmen it's About Time over WPI 34-10

Union finally plays a poor team...and will take out their anger on them...if Eck starts. If Geller goes than more like 24-10 taking the learning curve into account. We lose this...

Yellow Jackets sting the Sea Merchants...kind of 28-20

Not trying to be dick but not much to say here this week about these two. In Dlip's heart he is pulling for MMA!

Gulls Drop Bird Poop on Pioneers 42-27

Salisbury WILL NOT let down after a BILLY FUCCILLO HUGE WIN OVER SJF! Connor B and Anthony A will not be enough against a down, but starting to build back up Salisbury squad.

Bombers ****ING BOMB Bengals 24-17

To Dlip this will be close. However no IC mess-up will be enough to take the Bengals here. Both good teams but IC is more consistent. They show it here.

[lewdogg11]

Does anyone else purposefully ignore the icon on the NESCAC board, then get bored and figure 'F, it, let's see what these guys are talking about, it's gotta be interesting.'  And then you click it, and you are so mad that you did because there is nothing worth even scrolling through and it's just more boring drivel about the same crap over and over and over? 

Anyone?  Yeah?   Well.....I just did that again.  UGH!!!

[Bombers798891]

I can't add to Dlip's insight, but I can predict a game he didn't:

TCNJ 20, Cortland 17: The Red Dragons appear to be on their way to their first victory of the season, up 17-14 with the ball and seconds remaining. However, rather than take a knee, they fumble a handoff and TCNJ recovers for the winning score. In the locker room after the game, Dan MacNeill tells running back Dylan Peebles he quit, and blames him for the loss. Cornerback Tyler Anderson, who had committed a crucial pass-interference penalty late in the game, stands up and tells MacNeill that he quit. MacNeill angrily throws Anderson off the team.

Later that night, vandals dump garbage at MacNeill's house, and Ambrose is seen by the coach. In response, MacNeill blacklists Anderson, preventing him from taking part in the team's annual kickball party. Anderson angrily confronts MacNeill at the game, and delivers the crushing line: "You know, MacNeil, you are not God! Huh? You're just a typing teacher!" The coach, realizing he was wrong, allows Anderson to play in the season-ending Cortaca Jug, where Anderson picks off Tom Dempsey in the end zone in the final seconds, giving Cortland their only win of the season. As we fade to black, Anderson walks off into the Cortland evening with his girlfriend, Lea Thompson.

[lewdogg11]

I can't add to Dlip's insight, but I can predict a game he didn't:

TCNJ 20, Cortland 17: The Red Dragons appear to be on their way to their first victory of the season, up 17-14 with the ball and seconds remaining. However, rather than take a knee, they fumble a handoff and TCNJ recovers for the winning score. In the locker room after the game, Dan MacNeill tells running back Dylan Peebles he quit, and blames him for the loss. Cornerback Tyler Anderson, who had committed a crucial pass-interference penalty late in the game, stands up and tells MacNeill that he quit. MacNeill angrily throws Anderson off the team.

Later that night, vandals dump garbage at MacNeill's house, and Ambrose is seen by the coach. In response, MacNeill blacklists Anderson, preventing him from taking part in the team's annual kickball party. Anderson angrily confronts MacNeill at the game, and delivers the crushing line: "You know, MacNeil, you are not God! Huh? You're just a typing teacher!" The coach, realizing he was wrong, allows Anderson to play in the season-ending Cortaca Jug, where Anderson picks off Tom Dempsey in the end zone in the final seconds, giving Cortland their only win of the season. As we fade to black, Anderson walks off into the Cortland evening with his girlfriend, Lea Thompson.

+K for the detail, but I'm surprised there was no reference to lighting houses on fire, turning over cars, and throwing things at cops.

[Bombers798891]

I can't add to Dlip's insight, but I can predict a game he didn't:

TCNJ 20, Cortland 17: The Red Dragons appear to be on their way to their first victory of the season, up 17-14 with the ball and seconds remaining. However, rather than take a knee, they fumble a handoff and TCNJ recovers for the winning score. In the locker room after the game, Dan MacNeill tells running back Dylan Peebles he quit, and blames him for the loss. Cornerback Tyler Anderson, who had committed a crucial pass-interference penalty late in the game, stands up and tells MacNeill that he quit. MacNeill angrily throws Anderson off the team.

Later that night, vandals dump garbage at MacNeill's house, and Ambrose is seen by the coach. In response, MacNeill blacklists Anderson, preventing him from taking part in the team's annual kickball party. Anderson angrily confronts MacNeill at the game, and delivers the crushing line: "You know, MacNeil, you are not God! Huh? You're just a typing teacher!" The coach, realizing he was wrong, allows Anderson to play in the season-ending Cortaca Jug, where Anderson picks off Tom Dempsey in the end zone in the final seconds, giving Cortland their only win of the season. As we fade to black, Anderson walks off into the Cortland evening with his girlfriend, Lea Thompson.

+K for the detail, but I'm surprised there was no reference to lighting houses on fire, turning over cars, and throwing things at cops.

True, but I was going for a direct movie rip-off with this one, and I felt like the vandals dumping garbage was a pretty close approximation to Cortland. I'll try to do better next week if Cortland remains winless

[boobyhasgameyo]

Does anyone else purposefully ignore the icon on the NESCAC board, then get bored and figure 'F, it, let's see what these guys are talking about, it's gotta be interesting.'  And then you click it, and you are so mad that you did because there is nothing worth even scrolling through and it's just more boring drivel about the same crap over and over and over? 

Anyone?  Yeah?   Well.....I just did that again.  UGH!!!

+k for describing one of my monthly rituals.  I hate myself for it every single time.  To the point where I look in the mirror for lengthy periods and openly question my existence.