FB: Liberty League

[admirals_vt]

You guys & your 300 thousand word essay arguments are killin me over here.

Thank you

[superman57]

You guys & your 300 thousand word essay arguments are killin me over here.

I went to Fisher I can't reed...that's why I always liked RT pictures....Pat Please put Carmen Electra back up....

Sincerly
Super Illiterate Man

[union89]

KnightStalker......you have a trade offer up in LLPPSCFJFFL with the ClownPunchers.

[Knightstalker]

KnightStalker......you have a trade offer up in LLPPSCFJFFL with the ClownPunchers.

I just sent you a counter proposal.

[stimulator]

Promise no more legal briefs ..

You could always just scroll to the posts with the pole dancing, head bandaged patients, camouflaged couch potatoes, crack damaged ex divas, lime headed cats, intrepid explorers, bullwinkle, coneheads or my latest favorite the toilet seat horseshoes tournament.

You know your right that compilation does sound more intruiging than SOS.

[Jonny Utah]

Im thinking Ithacas only hopes are this.......(and it could happen)

Hobart beats Union
RPI beats Union
Ithaca beats Alfred
Ithaca beats Cortland
Springfield beats Hartwick

Then here is what I think happens......

Ithaca (8 at RPI (1)
Albright (7) at TCNJ (2)
Hobart (6) at Curry (3)
Salsbury (5) at SJF (4)

-If Alfred beats IC or Hartwick beats SC and Alfred loses, one of those teams will replace IC......

-If Union wins the LL, they will be the 6/7 seed at 2/3 Curry

-These seeds are based on travel too, not on who is better (with Curry already ranked high in the ncaa anyway)
********************************************

Other playoff thoughts........

-Am I being too biased towards upstate, or does the NJAC have a chance at a pool c? I guess if Ithaca beats Alfred and then loses to Cortland and Hartwick loses, Cortland gets in..........

-And if Union beats Hobart and RPI wins out, does the LL get a pool C bid? (if rochester loses again)

[sorry for the edited post]

Jonny U, you gotta be smokin' crack if you think there is any way that IC gets in. The most likely case for two from E8 are AU & SJF. Remote chance of HC & SJF, but they would both need to win out.

Ok, then if you arent smoking crack and this happens............

Hobart beats Union
RPI beats Union
Ithaca beats Alfred
Ithaca beats Cortland
Springfield beats Hartwick

Then you tell me who gets in?

And.....

- Curry got a brand new stadium a few years ago and although it is small, I believe it has enough to host.

-Frank, (Im not going to post the whole thing again, but wouldnt a two loss IC get in over a 2 loss Montclair?

[PBR...]

Promise no more legal briefs ..

You could always just scroll to the posts with the pole dancing, head bandaged patients, camouflaged couch potatoes, crack damaged ex divas, lime headed cats, intrepid explorers, bullwinkle, coneheads or my latest favorite the toilet seat horseshoes tournament.

You know your right that compilation does sound more intruiging than SOS.

come on its science stimulator....

[Apple Jack]

Either way, regardless of schedule, we all would like to be where RPI is right now.  Being in control of your own destiny, regardless of how they got there, is worth it.

THANK YOU JOSE!!

This is the point RT was trying to make. All that SOS stuff and other numbers Frank and others throw out there is just crap to RT. The bottom line is, win your conference and you're in, otherwise, pray for a Pool C. All these SOS numbers and other stats are just noise to RT that people throw out there to compensate for their team not being in control of its own destiny. Seriously, someone give me a good reason for RT to look at those "stats" as meaningful? Right now, RT's team is 7-0, first in Upstate rankings, and on a definite path to the NCAAs if they win out. If they drop one, then it becomes a little more involved.  Is this where SOS matters?..if so, then RT will care but RT is not the type who likes to have others control his fate. The net is that "we win, we're in".

Should the men of Troy feel any less about their accomplishments if they were to go 9-0 and make it to the dance but didn't play a rediculaz schedule?? Isn't that what happened in 2003?....same "soft schedule" and ironically, RPI got waxed by Hobart in the last game in 2003 and made it to the final 4.  Enough said.....go cry yourselves to sleep on your meaningless statistic pillows as RPI is competing for the NCAAs.

Why is RT so ornery??

Is he mad at the polls....
Is he mad at the pollsters....
Is he mad at Fran Rossi's giant brain....
Is he mad at Kieth....
Is he mad that no one will acknowledge that RPI controls thier own destiny....
Is he mad that Union controls their own destiny as much as RPI...

RT seems upset, but U89 can't figure out who or what he is pissed about....must be some kind of inner struggle...

I think  RT is so upset because Frank chose someone else to pose with other than RT  in his google images....

[Apple Jack]

OK Frank now let me say the last post irritated me..

Let me see if I can logically summarize

1) You say the rules favor RPI with the 1 loss tie breaker

2) You detest the fact that as you suggest RPI does not schedule the hardest OOC opponents.

3) You admit that this serves RPI well later in the season with the rules as they are.

4) You assert this will only prove to somehow hurt the program?

5) You reference a player who was attracted to the program because they were in the playoffs?

I believe 1, 2, and 3 don't equal #4. 

As for # 5, If I was a player coming out of HS and was evaluating my options ala D3, my preference would be in order to play for a winning program, play in a competitive league and play for a team that had a realistic shot at the NCAA's.  I would be less interested in whether our OOC schedule included Muhlenberg or Albright. 
Let's see the coach says "we've made the NCAA's 3 of the last 5 years" or "look at our tough schedule"

Your crusade seems to be misguided.  RPI plays a soft OOC schedule.. others do not... that is a given and not debated by anyone on the site.

Should RPI be penalized for following a strategy of building their teams confidence early in the season while at the same time putting themselves in a good situation come tiebreaker time as the rules currently exist?  No

Should the rules be changed?  Appears so. 

Is RPI ranking deserved.. maybe.. maybe not.  Can Union do something about RPI appearing in the playoffs.... sure. 

Think outside of the box for a second.  There are two ways a team can broaden its recruiting reach effectively:

1) Gain traction deep into the playoffs; or

2) Have exposure in areas where you have interest in kids who may not have considered the school before.

There are a lot of teams that finish 9-1 and 8-2 (or in RPI's case, 8-1 and 7-2) routinely, but it doesn't mean they've scored well in the recruiting game (see NEFC teams).  Pennsylvania is a hotbed of high school talent that seems to go untapped by RPI -- and what exposure does RPI have to Pennsylvania?  With the exception of Susquehanna now -- not much.  Same goes for New Jersey.  

With the current state of RPI's schedule, I find another 2003 very unlikely in RPI's future.  Joe King's comment about scheduling earlier this season spells a pretty ugly scenario for how he's going to be able to attract 2003-type attention in the future for his team.  This will not make it easy to recruit kids from other states that might read message boards like these and watch the bottom of ESPN's screen during the Division 3 playoffs -- kids in states like Louisiana, Florida and out west.

Now, I'm going to take a step back and say I like Joe King and his entire family.  His wife was my sixth grade teacher at St. Mary's in Ballston Spa, and I used to go to the track with his sons as they were schoolmates of mine growing up.  I always see his son Joey in church when I'm up there, and I consider them all friends still.  So, when I make these comments, realize that I'm not making them in the whole "RPI Sucks" mode (that's all in good fun with the Shoes Game coming up in less than two weeks) -- I'm making them in more of a "a strong RPI helps make a strong Liberty League in the future" mode.  I've said it before -- if every team in the LL adopted Joe's philosophy about scheduling, then the LL would be relegated to NEFC status.  Since RPI is enjoying at least playoff berth success, or the stronger possibility of such success, year in and year out, then there is incentive for other LL teams to do the same thing as RPI does in their scheduling...and I think we all agree, that's a terrible position to take.

Curry is a winning program, Stim...does that mean it automatically goes high on a high-schooler's list of schools to check out by that fact alone?  No.  So, I think you need to take a step back and think about the grand scheme of what could happen over the next few years instead of knee-jerk by saying 9-1 with a first-round loss is acceptable every year for recruiting purposes.

Well stated with the RPI/NEFC analogy.  If RPI continues to schedule cream puffs OOC they are mirroring the weak schedule, untested until playoff time approach.....bottom line is, the LL playoff qualifing system must change.

Frank, you stated that RPI does not do well in areas like PA because they do not schedule games there.....PA is probably not a target of thiers.  Beating the snot out of Endicott probably gains them a good deal of attention in MA.....they seem to always do well in MA....aside from those 2 lugheads LewDogg11 & AppleJack.......

AJ might be a masshole now but he will always be Section II  for life!!!!

[admirals_vt]

Hobart beats Union
RPI beats Union
Ithaca beats Alfred
Ithaca beats Cortland
Springfield beats Hartwick

Then you tell me who gets in?


There is at least one game you conveniently left out. AU/SJF

The winner of that game following your scenario above gets the E8 AQ.
            - Which ever one wins only has one conference lost.

I think a 2-loss pool C is slim at best.
       

[JQV]

Hobart beats Union
RPI beats Union
Ithaca beats Alfred
Ithaca beats Cortland
Springfield beats Hartwick

Then you tell me who gets in?


There is at least one game you conveniently left out. AU/SJF

The winner of that game following your scenario above gets the E8 AQ.
            - Which ever one wins only has one conference lost.

I think a 2-loss pool C is slim at best.
       

I won't put words in his mouth but I presume JU's scenario assumes that SJF beats AU.  That would give AU three losses in their final three games and functionally eliminate them from Pool C.  If the Pool C comes from the E8 IC would have the argument that they finished the year on a 7 game win streak.  Hartwick would obviously have the head-to-head advantage over IC.

['gro]

Would a 2 loss Ithaca (wick, SJF) get in over a 2 loss Hobart (RPI, Dickinson)?

[JQV]

Would a 2 loss Ithaca (wick, SJF) get in over a 2 loss Hobart (RPI, Dickinson)?

I think a 2 loss IC gets in over a 2 loss RPI because that would mean RPI is going the wrong direction at the wrong time.

I think Hobart, on the other hand, probably gets in ahead of everyone.

In the end, I really think the loss to Wick cost IC a shot at the playoffs.  Even if Wick wins the E8, a loss to Wick is a loss to Wick and is a bad mark on a season.

['gro]

1st off, I think all the 2 loss teams are going to need miracles to get in, it just seems like that kind of year. Last year 2 very good 1 loss teams didn't get in.

IC's loss to wick wouldn't be that bad if it wasn't for the wick/wnec debacle.  Same could be said for Union losing to Springfield on an off year.

[Jonny Utah]

Hobart beats Union
RPI beats Union
Ithaca beats Alfred
Ithaca beats Cortland
Springfield beats Hartwick

Then you tell me who gets in?


There is at least one game you conveniently left out. AU/SJF

The winner of that game following your scenario above gets the E8 AQ.
            - Which ever one wins only has one conference lost.

I think a 2-loss pool C is slim at best.
       

There wont be any 1-loss poll C teams anyway right?  

And I was assuming that AJF beat Alfred in the scenerio, Jose is right.

And I think I meant if Hobart loses to Union......I think......

so here are my re-done chances for IC to make it......(and the chances I think each would happen.......

Union beats Hobart [40%]
RPI beats Union [60%]
Ithaca beats Alfred [60%]
Ithaca beats Cortland [50%]
Springfield beats Hartwick [50%]
SJF beats Alfred [75%]

And I would guess that both Ithaca and Hobart would get pool C bids if IC beat Cortland.......