World Cup and European leagues

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Yeah.  Basically the diving is what is pushing me to root for the French this weekend (something I would never do under normal circumstances).

As far as the games I saw this World Cup, there were three nations (and obviously every nation has there share of faults in this area) that stood out as having a diving problem.

1. Spain (although they shaped up a bit in the knock-outs, their diving bouts in the group stage matches were just utterly inexcusable).

2. Portugal (we've talked at length about the whinning and diving).

3. Italy (although their overall high level of play otherwise has proven then to be worthy of a high ranking--I am still a bit suspiscious of this Berlusconi rumor).

[Flea]

It will be interesting to see what Cristiano Ronaldo's return to Man U. is like (he's the one who asked the ref for the red card on Rooney and winked at the bench afterward).  Not that Rooney didn't deserve the red card--but I doubt there will be much love for C. Ronaldo at Old Trafford. 

Don't you think a huge majority of the fans realize the players need to do what they can to win in the Cup . . . and that their actions would not carry over to the professional leagues?

I think the fact that CRon was booed by the impartial Germans at the France-Portugal match might be telling. 

Good . . . I'm glad my assumption was off.  It seems like so many players play up the drama for ref that the fans would have to overlook it, even in the extreme.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Of course, to a large degree perception is shaped by who you're rooting for.  That 'widely admired' announcer Marcelo Balboa will whine incessantly about the diving, then a minute later proclaim 'man, he really sold that penalty - great job'!

I'd definitely like to see more cards for diving, but often the ref IS fooled.  They should also give out suspensions after-the-fact for clear-cut cases of diving caught on film.  And I still contend that a replay official could be used for game-altering calls: goals, PKs, and (at least red) cards - in each case play is stopped long enough anyway that the replay need not interrupt the flow of the game.

[Mr. Ypsi]

While Henry probably had the single most blatant dive of the Cup (acting like he was Brian McBride, except McBride had the blood to prove it!), my nominee for worst diver would be C Ronaldo.  Unless his own team and coach have not caught on, I can't believe the protest they made on the (correct) no call for a PK a few minutes after Zidane made the winning PK!  Rather than a PK, I'd say it should have been a yellow on Ronaldo for a blatant dive (in the box).  A fabulous talent, but I swear that guy could take maturity lessons from Rooney (though a slightly more evolved role-model might be even better )!

Figo probably should have been suspended for his (unnoticed by the ref) head butt (against England?), and could easily have been carded for a blatant dive against France, but I'm kinda glad neither happened since Saturday is his last day of a glorious career anyway.

Other nominees for the "All-Diving Team"?

[Greek Tragedy]

I love Manchester United.  I love the players that play for Manchester United, but even with that said, I hate whiners and divers...even if it gets us the win.

Two years ago Arsenal came into Old Trafford on some 50-game unbeaten streak and Rooney took a dive in the box, got a penalty kick and R.v.N scored to give them a 1-0 lead.  Rooney followed that up with a goal at the end to seal the victory.  Though Rooney's dive got us the win, I still cursed him for diving. 

Ronaldo's first year at Old Trafford was marred by constant diving every time he was touched.  I think that really hurts him, not only in the eyes of the fans, but to the opponents and refs.  Sometimes Ronaldo would actually get fouled pretty hard, but since the ref was so used to Ronaldo diving, he just let the game continue.  That's where the reputation of diving really hurts. 

Bobby McMahon, over on FSC commented that Ronaldo's tendency to dive finally took a back seat this past year in the EPL, but it has resurfaced it's ugly face in the World Cup and that's too bad.  I think it's telling when, not only the English supporters whistle and boo Ronaldo, but when EVERYONE does it. 

I think the worst part of the diving is when they fake an injury, the opposing team kicks the ball out and then the guy gets up like nothing happened (probably because nothing did happen).  Sooner or later opponents won't do that anymore and just say, "Too bad if you're hurt...game on!"

[Greek Tragedy]

Should've done that at the beginning of the tourney, just to see how people guessed...that would've been cool!

3rd place:  Germany 2 Portugal 1

Final:  Italy 0 France 0 AET (Italy wins 4-3 on PKs)

[Stinger]

I don't want to see C. Ronaldo in Spain, period.  Id rather see him in France or Portugal where in fact I won't have to see him ever.

I do not see Spain as bad as divers as Portugal and Italy. Cannavaro as a defender, is a constant diver intending to ward off attacks. If Lippi calls him the world's best defender, perhaps lost in translation, he really meant diver. 

I again am rooting for the French side. I'd love to see Zidane go out on top. Any chance, however,  they can withold Henry's winner's medal for being a whiny little bastrd?

Will De Rossi play?

Ypsi, Figo will still be playing in Italy, no?  Inter won't be sent down to Serie B or C like Juve and Milan, and I've only heard of him retiring from international play.

BTW, this isn't the first time the Italian league has been involved in match fixing. If Buffon et. al were involved in this, they should be banned from the sport a la Charlie Hustle.

[David Collinge]

Rooney stomps on the groin of a man lying helpless on the ground...and C. Ronaldo comes out of the incident as the bad guy?   

[Mr. Ypsi]

Rooney stomps on the groin of a man lying helpless on the ground...and C. Ronaldo comes out of the incident as the bad guy?   

I won't speak for others, but for me you are making a linkage that doesn't exist.

There has been talk of CRon being unwelcome back in Chelsea due to that incident (the wink to the bench WAS a bit much), but I'm more concerned with his overall diving tendencies.  (To me, Rooney was obviously deserving of a red card, and CRon should not have involved himself.)  I've put forth that one Cristiano Ronaldo is THE worst flopper/diver/whiner of the 2006 World Cup - so far, no one has challenged that assertion.

I also like Beckenbauer's suggestion that anyone lobbying for a card (by waving an imaginary card at the ref) should himself be carded for dissent.

[sac]

Who'd a thought 3 years later we'd all be rooting for the French.  


Missed both semi's this week, enjoying a fine holiday in beautiful Columbus, Oh.  Really can't comment on the games themselves but you have to be really impressed that  France has made it to the finals.  Consider their last two crashouts in the Cup 02 and Euro 04 and that they got off to a slow start this year I think its amazing they are where they are.  Throw in Zidane's last go around and its just hard to not root for them.  Tremendously talented team who have finally found a way to scrape a few goals.  Henry when he's at his peak is just special to watch, I'm not sure we've seen his best like was in the Champions Cup.


Diving........if video replay shows no contact the player should be banned for 10 games in international play and 15 in league play after the fact.   If the offense occurs in the first half he should be red carded at the break.

The only way it will ever get better is if refs throw around the red card for dives even if they are bad calls.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Good grief - FIVE consecutive predictions with France scoring zero goals!  Look, I realize that Italy's defense is amazing (zero goals to opposition scorers the entire Cup), but don't you realize that Zinedine Zidane is FATED!!

He WILL score.  And if Italy scores, he WILL score again.  Maybe directly, maybe on the assist, maybe on the pass that sets up the assist, but he WILL score whatever is necessary.

(And to think - until a week ago I had almost forgotten that Zidane existed!)

[Flea]

Who'd a thought 3 years later we'd all be rooting for the French.  

No frikkin' way I'd ever cheer for the frogs.  I don't care how old Zidane is and that it's his last game. 

My World Cup rootin' schedule:

June 12 ... go Nati
June 18 ... go Taeguk Warriors
June 23 ... go Les Eperviers
June 27 ... go La Roja
July 01 ... go O Esquadrão de Ouro
July 05 ... go Portugal
July 09 ... go Azzurri

. . . my encouragement didn't help.

[Pat Coleman]

Alright, well ... today was copy editing hell for me. One person in this conversation will appreciate this story a touch more than the rest.

About a half-hour before deadline this afternoon, our front-page World Cup preview hit the copy desk at ... uhh ... my paper. It's the one with the name of the country in the title.

It contains a five-column headline, across the width of the page.

It has a three-column, three line subhead.

It has two standalone photos (photos that aren't necessarily illustrated in the story, so they require more involved captions to be written).

And it has a banner at the top that says "World Cup final: Italy vs. France" blah blah blah ... so I can't use that information in the headline or the subhead.

UGH.

What's worse ... or maybe better, come to think of it ... is that this version of the story went solely into our overseas edition. So none of you will likely see it tomorrow, or complain about it on this board.

¡GOL! ¡GOL! ¡GOL! ¡GOL! ¡GOL! ¡GOL! ¡GOL!

Cup comes down
to border battle

[Jim Matson]

3rd place: Germany 2, Portugal 1

Final: Italy 2, France 1 (OT)

[Mr. Ypsi]

Hannibal knew what to do with that border!  Go Hannibal, go Zidane!