FB: Midwest Conference

[scottie]

Scots get the ball in place to try a 41 yard FG to tie the game.
Ripon calls timeout.
Scots put their offense back in.
Touch down pass Scots!
No way!!
What's that?
Flag?
Off-sides, Monmouth.
Another flag?
Unsportsmanlike conduct penalty.  Monmouth bench.
Referee chats with Coach Bell.
Referee goes to chat with the line judge.
Referee comes back to chat more with Bell.
The call stands.
Mark off the yardage.
Hail Mary....
Incomplete.
Ripon wins the Defense Optional Bowl 50-47.

[Ash Park]

IC 50 Cornell 28

[fightingscots13]

Radio guy doing the MC game said the initial flag with 9 seconds left was a false start - was that the actual call, or was it something else?  If a false start is called, shouldn't the play be dead?  Why did the play continue? 

[gbpuckfan]

final
Knox beats Lawrence
63-42   

[TitanPride]

It's fun to have a Week 11 that matters in the conference race.

I just finished going through box scores and here is how quarters led breaks down for each team in the championship discussion:
     Lake Forest 21
     St. Norbert 22
     Illinois College 30

Scenarios:
1.)  Lake Forest takes care of business at St. Norbert.  They win the conference title outright and earn the Pool A bid.
2.)  St. Norbert beats Lake Forest, while Carroll knocks off Illinois College.  St. Norbert and Lake Forest both finish 8-1 in the MWC as co-champs.  St. Norbert earns the Pool bid because of H2H.
3.)  St. Norbert and Illinois College both win.  Illinois College has a commanding led in quarters led and will win the Pool A bid because of the quarters led tiebreaker.

[scottie]

Radio guy doing the MC game said the initial flag with 9 seconds left was a false start - was that the actual call, or was it something else?  If a false start is called, shouldn't the play be dead?  Why did the play continue?

GOOD question.  Almost as if the flag was thrown after the catch.....  It appeared that Bell's argument was convincing enough that the referee had to go ask the line judge if he was sure of the call. A big pot of home-cooked stew if you ask me.   

[Maverick]

Radio guy doing the MC game said the initial flag with 9 seconds left was a false start - was that the actual call, or was it something else?  If a false start is called, shouldn't the play be dead?  Why did the play continue?

GOOD question.  Almost as if the flag was thrown after the catch.....  It appeared that Bell's argument was convincing enough that the referee had to go ask the line judge if he was sure of the call. A big pot of home-cooked stew if you ask me.   

Too bad the shootout had a controversial ending...would be better to not give up 50 points and put ourselves in that position in the first place though.  It's in the past and nothing anyone can do about it now, other than finish the season on a high note by beating Knox again!  Hopefully alot of these young Scots are learning lessons in these oh-so-close losses and will carry them into the off-season as well as into next season so it doesn't come down to the "Week 11 that matters", which fulbakdad and TitanPride seem to be so in love with.

[fulbakdad]

This tie breaker is actually pretty unfair.  Think about it.

The only reason we may end in a three way tie, is because Ill Col didn't play St Norberts.  If they had, one of them would have won and the other lost.  Either way this only could have produced a two way tie which would have been decided by head to head.

The way it is, St Norbert ends up being the loser in the situation.  They can't move on, even if they win.  Ill Col has the potential of sliding in even though they lost to Lake Forest.....

[Maverick]

This tie breaker is actually pretty unfair.  Think about it.

The only reason we may end in a three way tie, is because Ill Col didn't play St Norberts.  If they had, one of them would have won and the other lost.  Either way this only could have produced a two way tie which would have been decided by head to head.

The way it is, St Norbert ends up being the loser in the situation.  They can't move on, even if they win.  Ill Col has the potential of sliding in even though they lost to Lake Forest.....

St. Norbert can still get into the playoffs.  See Scenario #2 posted above by TitanPride.  Agreed on the rest though...this 11-team, unbalanced schedule is a mess.

[fulbakdad]

I meant if there was a three way tie.....If Ill Col wins next week and Norberts beats LFC, then Ill Col moves on even though they had lost a head to head, and Norbert hadn't.

[Maverick]

I meant if there was a three way tie.....If Ill Col wins next week and Norberts beats LFC, then Ill Col moves on even though they had lost a head to head, and Norbert hadn't.

Now I see what you're saying.  Should be interesting to see how next Saturday plays out and who ends up being upset the most with the tie-breakers.

[scottie]

I meant if there was a three way tie.....If Ill Col wins next week and Norberts beats LFC, then Ill Col moves on even though they had lost a head to head, and Norbert hadn't.

Now I see what you're saying.  Should be interesting to see how next Saturday plays out and who ends up being upset the most with the tie-breakers.

F-Dad: Text as many people as you can with this complaint.  Apparently, that is the way you get ahead in the MWC nowadays.   

[gbpuckfan]

It would be interesting to know what the vote was on the tiebreakers ... what other options were considered ... and if it will be revisited for next season.

All that said, everyone knew the rules going into it. SNC could have taken care of business against Monmouth and we'd be having a different discussion.

And, correct me if I'm wrong, but SNC and IC played the same schedule, right? Both teams faced the other nine conference teams. So, while one could make an argument for using point differential (which I haven't looked up but believe IC would also win) as opposed to quarters led, QL does become and indicator of who 'outplayed' the rest of the conference more substantially. And, does so without encouraging teams to run up the score (if you have any objections to that, which not all do).

I guess what I'm saying is I could think of worse senarios (ie. when the conference didn't have an overtime policy in place for the title game, or having a simple coin flip instead of something game-based).

Meanwhile, our friends in the WIAC will continue to lament that its 2nd place team could likely wax our champion and yet LFC/SNC/IC will be going to the playoffs and UW-Platteville (7-2) won't.

Yes, SNC could come out on the short end of the stick, so to speak. And maybe in a conference that really isn't going to get an at-large bid, playing a closed-loop schedule wouldn't be so bad. But that's a discussion for next year.

Go Knights! Go Pioneers!

[sncsid]

A little historical perspective - I've been in this conference for 14 years now and the quarters led rule has always been the next tie-breaker after head-to-head. So for all I know that set-up has been the same going on its third decade now.

[TitanPride]

It would be interesting to know what the vote was on the tiebreakers ... what other options were considered ... and if it will be revisited for next season.

All that said, everyone knew the rules going into it. SNC could have taken care of business against Monmouth and we'd be having a different discussion.

And, correct me if I'm wrong, but SNC and IC played the same schedule, right? Both teams faced the other nine conference teams. So, while one could make an argument for using point differential (which I haven't looked up but believe IC would also win) as opposed to quarters led, QL does become and indicator of who 'outplayed' the rest of the conference more substantially. And, does so without encouraging teams to run up the score (if you have any objections to that, which not all do).

I guess what I'm saying is I could think of worse senarios (ie. when the conference didn't have an overtime policy in place for the title game, or having a simple coin flip instead of something game-based).

Meanwhile, our friends in the WIAC will continue to lament that its 2nd place team could likely wax our champion and yet LFC/SNC/IC will be going to the playoffs and UW-Platteville (7-2) won't.

Yes, SNC could come out on the short end of the stick, so to speak. And maybe in a conference that really isn't going to get an at-large bid, playing a closed-loop schedule wouldn't be so bad. But that's a discussion for next year.

Go Knights! Go Pioneers!

Good post, gbpuckfan.  Have you watched any Lake Forest games online?  How is the St. Norbert offense looking?  Besides the games against the conference bottom feeders, it looks like the Knights might struggle to move the ball/score.  Is that accurate?  If so, it is due primarily to line play, QB, lack of weapons?

On the other side of the ball, the box scores seem to indicate that St. Norbert's defense has been outstanding (similar to LF's).  Can you give us a better of idea of their relative strengths and weaknesses -- against the run, pass, etc.?  Lake Forest has been very balanced all season, nothing flashy but very effective.