FB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[HSCTiger74]

Further if any of these Virginia based ODAC schools create a football program they are assured 5 games a year which get alumni back on campus. Also with 3 or 4 of those being ODAC home games they are assured some excellent gates. 9000 people at 5 games with concessions is $100k. That nearly pays you back on suiting each player. It could also be now or never. If ODAC adds SVU there may not be room to add another team down the road.  Then you're face with being independent and/or playing in a far away conference.  I was just reading that 65-70 players net about 2 million in tuition for a school. D3 football is profitable.

  While I agree with everyone that having one of our current ODAC brethren add football is the best scenario, I don't think that it would be the slam dunk you describe here Tigerfan, especially in respect to attendance. I did some quick checking of the NCAA's official figures for 2014 and found the following:
                Highest avg. attendance (conference)      MIAC             3,462
                Highest avg. attendance (team)              St. John's       7,752
                Avg. attendance ODAC (#4 nationally)                          2,832
                Highest attendance ODAC                       HSC               7,252
                Avg. attendance all D3                                                1,970
   I realize that the number of people who are actually AT a game is frequently higher than the official attendance number, but I don't see any way that a new program would achieve that figure of 9,000 you used in your post. D3 football can certainly be profitable, but it probably wouldn't be due to attendance.
   

[Ron Boerger]

Details aside, the fact that a number of schools keep adding football to attract more male students shows that it must be at least revenue neutral, otherwise they wouldn't be doing it.   Don't think a lot of small school administrations have a hankering to add football if it's a money loser, and I don't think they're doing it *just* to balance the ratio of women:men (it's certainly a nice side effect).

[jknezek]

You aren't going to make money on attendance. Heck, W&L doesn't even charge. Lots of schools don't. Or only charge if you walk in one specific area (which I always try to do at B-SC and Huntingdon, but many folks don't bother with the $5 ticket). No, you make your money on tuition. But that's a slow recap to a large outlay when starting a team. I'd love it if one of the ODAC schools added football. I think it's inevitable at least one will want to in the future. The question becomes is one interested, and free enough with the cash, to do it now so there is only a year or so gap between when Catholic leaves and when someone else comes in. If no one is on tap, the ODAC has to look for an affiliate. The scheduling problem gets too intense without at least 8 conference members.

Even with an affiliate, the ODAC would be in fine shape for one or two more schools to add football. I'm not a huge fan of 10 team conferences  with one OOC simply because it limits any exterior comparisons, but I do understand the massive benefit for scheduling and wouldn't have a problem with the ODAC going that route internally.

[jknezek]

Ron you beat me to it by a few minutes!

[HSCTiger fan]

To clarify I was thinking 5 games totaling 9000 fans or 1800 fans per game.  According to the 2014 NCAA attendance report ODAC teams averaged over 2800 per game. If you remove HSC (7200) and EH (5300) then the remaining 6 teams averaged 1795 fans per game. So that number seems reasonable and not pie in the sky thinking. Especially considering the proximity to other ODAC schools. I know some schools don't charge admission but others do. If you're a new program pinching pennies you might need to charge. 9000 times $8 is $72k add in concessions and boom $100k. That certainly helps pay for something.  The local community should love it too. I bet there's not a single hotel room available this weekend in Farmville. Friday the restaurants will be full. It's a actually busy in Farmville on game weekends. HSC uses the games as a backdrop to recruit interested students - not football players, regular students. Football does a lot for schools that's hard to measure.

[hasanova]

To quote someone "in the know" at Guilford, "We can't afford to equip 140 men for practice and games, but on the other hand we can't afford not to with the value they add to tuition and enrollment."  Look at schools who've added football in the last 20 years ... yes, it adds to the overall school "experience", but it's financial also.  Just off the top of my head, I know of Greensboro, Averett, NC Wesleyan, Methodist, LaGrange, Berry, Hendrix, Southwestern, Brevard, St Vincent, Stevenson and others.

With Randolph going coed, maybe we could talk Hollins into starting a team ... the Hollins University Fightin' No Names!

[jknezek]

To quote someone "in the know" at Guilford, "We can't afford to equip 140 men for practice and games, but on the other hand we can't afford not to with the value they add to tuition and enrollment."  Look at schools who've added football in the last 20 years ... yes, it adds to the overall school "experience", but it's financial also.  Just off the top of my head, I know of Greensboro, Averett, NC Wesleyan, Methodist, LaGrange, Berry, Hendrix, Southwestern, Brevard, St Vincent, Stevenson and others.

With Randolph going coed, maybe we could talk Hollins into starting a team ... the Hollins University Fightin' No Names!

Anyone want to see a Hollins, Mary Baldwin, Sweet Briar league???  It can be done better than the awful, chauvinistic, miserable, lingerie football league. I have to believe that...

[HSCTiger fan]

The D3 Revolution - How America's Most Violent Game is Saving Liberal Arts Colleges http://www.sbnation.com/longform/2013/10/1/4786810/diii-football-revolution

How D3 Colleges Profit from Football No One Watches http://deadspin.com/how-division-iii-colleges-profit-from-football-no-one-w-1440369611

[y_jack_lok]

Details aside, the fact that a number of schools keep adding football to attract more male students shows that it must be at least revenue neutral, otherwise they wouldn't be doing it.   Don't think a lot of small school administrations have a hankering to add football if it's a money loser, and I don't think they're doing it *just* to balance the ratio of women:men (it's certainly a nice side effect).

My wife went to Southwestern University in Georgetown, TX and at a reunion about four years ago she spoke with their then president Jake Schrum (now president at Emory & Henry) who said they were adding football in order to attract more male students and balance the male/female ratio which was getting close to 30/70 at the time. They were losing male students primarily to Trinity in San Antonio and Austin College in Sherman, TX.  He said lots of prospective male students either wanted to play football or go to a school that had a football program because they liked football. I'm sure they did their research on this and also a cost benefit analysis and concluded that it would ultimately benefit the college financially and in terms of male/female student ratio.

[hasanova]

Don't know if anyone noticed, but Austin and Southwestern of the now 4-team SCAC (with TLU and Trinity) are playing each other twice this season - home and away.  That's one way to fill your schedule!

[jknezek]

Don't know if anyone noticed, but Austin and Southwestern of the now 4-team SCAC (with TLU and Trinity) are playing each other twice this season - home and away.  That's one way to fill your schedule!

Next season I think all 4 of those teams plan on home/home to fill the schedule. Too much bad blood between the SCAC and ASC I guess. Trinity and Southwestern have done home/home the last two years. I think TLU is the loser in this, although Trinity at least looks off the rocks they've been stuck to the last few years. But TLU had such a great claim last year essentially finishing second in the ASC even if that wasn't their conference. They soften that schedule with these home/home games and they'll lose some of the benefit of the doubt they get. Since they are competing against UMHB (or whoever wins the ASC) for the sole "B" bid, I suspect having a softer schedule won't play well on the committee tables.

[hasanova]

Don't know if anyone noticed, but Austin and Southwestern of the now 4-team SCAC (with TLU and Trinity) are playing each other twice this season - home and away.  That's one way to fill your schedule!

A friend of mine, who began his academic career at HSC before finishing at JMU, started his working career as a teacher in the Virginia portion of the Delmarva Peninsula.  He said the High Schools were tiny and the travel distances were unreasonable for playing football outside the peninsula, so all 6 teams in the league played the other 5 at home and away for a 10 game schedule.

[tigerFanAlso2]

be pretty cool to play RMC two times each year. I'm all in on that one !!!!

[tigerFanAlso2]

For all of those planning to attend HSC vs. CUA game. All on campus activities scheduled for Parents weekend have been postponed. The football game has been moved to a high school in Lynchburg (not sure which one, formal notice pending) and will kick off at 1pm. Not having turf makes weather conditions like these very problematic.

Good luck to all this weekend, minus CUA of course.

[HSCTiger fan]

It's been moved to Jefferson Forest HS.  Game time still at 1:00.

Advantage to teams who can run this weekend. Not sure it helps WL or not. I know they run but it's not stick it in the RB's gut and let him dig it out running offense. Triple option in the rain needs all 3 players not to slip. Should make for an interesting weekend.