FB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[WLU78]

...actually the insinuation was a dig about the lack of postseason success by either team.

Remember the W&L Generals have two national championships under their belt!!  

I looked on the W&L football site but could find the mention of only one national championship: 1961 College Division title awarded by Washington Touchdown Club.  To my knowlege W&L has only been to the post season once losing to Wyoming in the 1951 Gator Bowl.  That leaves W&L with an 0-1 playoff record compared to the 10-6 playoff record owned by Bridgewater who remains to this day the only ODAC school to ever win a playoff game not to mention play for a national championship.

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

We have a poultry plant nearby ... beat that.

[Olinemom]

...actually the insinuation was a dig about the lack of postseason success by either team.

Remember the W&L Generals have two national championships under their belt!!  

When?

I'm guessing 1873 and 1890, right?

Zing!!  Way to go, Endzoneking6.  I miss you already!!!-

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Man, don't be so down and out on Guilford so early! Its only a scrimmage. I remember a few years ago when McDaniel got waxed in a scrimmage I believe against Salisbury. Point being, one week later McDaniel beat BC in Westminster. I personally think that Guilford will open the newly renovated stadium with a win. I guess I must be one of the few.

Go ODAC!

I agree Llama.  I was at the McD/Salisbury scrimmage in 04 (yes it was Salisbury) and the Green Terror looked absolutely horrible.  No push on the line and couldn't tackle.  I thought the Eagles would soar in an easy one....I guess that's why they play the game, huh?!!  Of course the Gulls went on the have a pretty good season too.

I think scores in scrimmages mean absolutely nothing, but I do think one week before the season starts, how a team plays means a lot.  Even if the 1s just play in the 1st quarter or half, the fact that Guilford's high-powered offense could only stick it in the end zone once means a little something.  And I think enzoneking6's analysis of the first half is even more telling than the only seven points they scored.

Now, do I think Vogelbach and Co. will be ready against Ferrum?  Sure.  But let's keep in mind that Salisbury and Newport News are two different beasts (no offense, nnasid!).  Last year, the Gulls scored 77-unanswered against the Builders.  I think that suggests that the Quakers should have had a little more success than what enzoneking6 described in his first-half breakdown.

Before he posted on the scrimmage, I still thought Ferrum would win this season opener.  Here is my analysis I posted on the pick 'em page;

The Panthers lost a lot of offensive starters, but return their stud QB (8.2 yards per carry and 2.8-to-1 touchdown to interception ratio), their All-Region TE (12 catches, seven for touchdowns) and a handful of experienced linemen. Their defense brings back almost everybody, but will have to improve upon their 27.4 points given up per game with Guilford's high-powered offense. Last season, Ferrum gave up a conference-worst 238.2 passing yards a game ... Guilford's QB racked up 268 yards on 22 completions ... but the Panther defense forced six turnovers and held the Quakers to only seven points, which came with four minutes left in the game. Even with the Quaker offense being back, I like Ferrum's run game and experienced defense to win this one. Beware of something that is always the case when a passing attack faces a running attack - if Ferrum gets down by a couple scores early, they should be forced to throw, but they will probably stick to their running game. Problem is, both times that happened last season, they went down 24-0 in the first quarter and lost both games (their only two losses). If Ferrum takes care of the ball, they should be able to control the clock and win.

[abnrgr]

LLama
You're right. Too early to snivel but I have learned to suffer............................

[enzoneking6]

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

We have a poultry plant nearby ... beat that.

And a free par 3 course   ...Greatest place to work on your short game!!!

[enzoneking6]

Man, don't be so down and out on Guilford so early! Its only a scrimmage. I remember a few years ago when McDaniel got waxed in a scrimmage I believe against Salisbury. Point being, one week later McDaniel beat BC in Westminster. I personally think that Guilford will open the newly renovated stadium with a win. I guess I must be one of the few.

Go ODAC!

I agree Llama.  I was at the McD/Salisbury scrimmage in 04 (yes it was Salisbury) and the Green Terror looked absolutely horrible.  No push on the line and couldn't tackle.  I thought the Eagles would soar in an easy one....I guess that's why they play the game, huh?!!  Of course the Gulls went on the have a pretty good season too.

I think scores in scrimmages mean absolutely nothing, but I do think one week before the season starts, how a team plays means a lot.  Even if the 1s just play in the 1st quarter or half, the fact that Guilford's high-powered offense could only stick it in the end zone once means a little something.  And I think enzoneking6's analysis of the first half is even more telling than the only seven points they scored.

Now, do I think Vogelbach and Co. will be ready against Ferrum?  Sure.  But let's keep in mind that Salisbury and Newport News are two different beasts (no offense, nnasid!).  Last year, the Gulls scored 77-unanswered against the Builders.  I think that suggests that the Quakers should have had a little more success than what enzoneking6 described in his first-half breakdown.

Before he posted on the scrimmage, I still thought Ferrum would win this season opener.  Here is my analysis I posted on the pick 'em page;

The Panthers lost a lot of offensive starters, but return their stud QB (8.2 yards per carry and 2.8-to-1 touchdown to interception ratio), their All-Region TE (12 catches, seven for touchdowns) and a handful of experienced linemen. Their defense brings back almost everybody, but will have to improve upon their 27.4 points given up per game with Guilford's high-powered offense. Last season, Ferrum gave up a conference-worst 238.2 passing yards a game ... Guilford's QB racked up 268 yards on 22 completions ... but the Panther defense forced six turnovers and held the Quakers to only seven points, which came with four minutes left in the game. Even with the Quaker offense being back, I like Ferrum's run game and experienced defense to win this one. Beware of something that is always the case when a passing attack faces a running attack - if Ferrum gets down by a couple scores early, they should be forced to throw, but they will probably stick to their running game. Problem is, both times that happened last season, they went down 24-0 in the first quarter and lost both games (their only two losses). If Ferrum takes care of the ball, they should be able to control the clock and win.

I was stunned with the play of Guilford on Saturday. I expect Guilford to beat numerous ODAC teams this year but with the performance I witnessed, they will have get it together in one week. I think alot of it was laziness and going through the motion. They seem to be dead after they drove to the other side of the 50 and the QB threw a INT.

With the way the Guilford defense was abused by Newport News apprentice running attack. Ferrum's powerful running game will be hard to stop.


Kid, If there is still room in the pick em let me know because I have ferrum running away with this game. Unless Guilford's #40 get some much needed help in the front seven.

Guilford get it together.

Good Luck all ODAC teams going into their opener..

Go Eagles

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Kid, If there is still room in the pick em let me know [...]

Yeah man ... get in it ... go here;

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=3704.0

[Llamaguy]

With the way the Guilford defense was abused by Newport News apprentice running attack. Ferrum's powerful running game will be hard to stop.

You saw Guilford's scrimmage firsthand so I definitely believe they need work before next week;however, I don't get everyone raving about Ferrum's powerful running game. Yes that was the case in 2005, but this is 2006. They have 4 returning starters on offense, one guard, an TE, a FB, and of course Jermaine Pitts at QB. I know Pitts can run the option but who is he going to pitch it too? The FB is a bulldozer, not a tailback. I know they picked up Owah from Harrisonburg High but I would assume it may take a few games to get the option game fluid. They may rush for 300yrds against Guilford, but I just don't see it happening. Guilford knows it has to stop 2 things, the QB on the option and a TE who can catch a pass. Guess we will know come Saturday night. You can rib me when Ferrum puts up gaudy stats and runs away with the day.

[Hampton U SID]

Hey kid....you didnt need to remind me of that 77-point explosion last year in Salisbury......took me a month to not see Sea Gulls and think of that ..... GULP.

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

With the way the Guilford defense was abused by Newport News apprentice running attack. Ferrum's powerful running game will be hard to stop.

You saw Guilford's scrimmage firsthand so I definitely believe they need work before next week;however, I don't get everyone raving about Ferrum's powerful running game. Yes that was the case in 2005, but this is 2006. They have 4 returning starters on offense, one guard, an TE, a FB, and of course Jermaine Pitts at QB. I know Pitts can run the option but who is he going to pitch it too? The FB is a bulldozer, not a tailback. I know they picked up Owah from Harrisonburg High but I would assume it may take a few games to get the option game fluid. They may rush for 300yrds against Guilford, but I just don't see it happening. Guilford knows it has to stop 2 things, the QB on the option and a TE who can catch a pass. Guess we will know come Saturday night. You can rib me when Ferrum puts up gaudy stats and runs away with the day.

A couple things to consider...

1) Ferrum played 14 offensive linemen last season, eight of which are returning

2) Their returning "fullback" is listed as only eight pounds heavier than their star running back who graduated [sounds like another Anthony Frates (Shenandoah) situation to me ... a RB-body labeled a fullback]

3) That returning "fullback" led the team in carries last season, and averaged 5.8 yards a rush

4) Guilford's defense was/is pretty horrible, especially considering their total defense fit right in with the 11 schools who didn't win a game last season;

369.4 - Mass. Maritime (0-9)
377.9 - Nichols (0-9)
378.9 - Wesleyan (0-8)
408.0 - Macalester (0-9)
408.0 - Guilford (5-5)
475.2 - Lewis & Clark (0-4)
482.9 - Tri-State (0-10)
492.3 - Concordia, Ill. (0-10)
493.1 - Menlo (0-10)
503.6 - Heidelberg (0-10)
522.7 - Juniata (0-10)

*No stats were available for Becker (0-8)

Oh, and their 408.0 yards given up per game was ranked 14th-worst in the nation.

I'm not suggesting Guilford won't be good.  Their offense will definitely keep them in games, and if their defense forces some turnovers then perhaps they'll be better than expected ... but just because you have a nice passing offense doesn't mean you'll be great.  Last year's top two passing offenses (Catholic and Louisiana College) went a combined 6-13.

Having said all this, would I be shocked if Guilford won?  Nope.  I think it'll be a good game - last year's fifth-ranked passing team versus the top-ranked rushing team.

[hasanova]

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

We have a poultry plant nearby ... beat that.

To continue the poultry theme, Guilford won the 1974 postseason Poultry Bowl versus the William Penn University Statesmen of Oskaloosa, Iowa.  The game was played in driving rain and actually ended in a 7-7 tie, but the Quakers got the trophy on overall stats.  I swear, I am not making this up!  lol

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Hey kid....you didnt need to remind me of that 77-point explosion last year in Salisbury......took me a month to not see Sea Gulls and think of that ..... GULP.

Been there before, my friend.  I still recall our 66-0 game, which could have been 112-0 had the Raiders not kicked FGs on first downs.

Needless to say, that was a looooonnggg 346-mile trip back to Bridgewater.

[Forma80]

...actually the insinuation was a dig about the lack of postseason success by either team.

Remember the W&L Generals have two national championships under their belt!!  

I looked on the W&L football site but could find the mention of only one national championship: 1961 College Division title awarded by Washington Touchdown Club.  To my knowlege W&L has only been to the post season once losing to Wyoming in the 1951 Gator Bowl.  That leaves W&L with an 0-1 playoff record compared to the 10-6 playoff record owned by Bridgewater who remains to this day the only ODAC school to ever win a playoff game not to mention play for a national championship.

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

Please remember that not all Generals opinions are reflected in these statements. Program history is obviously important, but since that Gator Bowl game W and L hasn't exactly been racking up post-season success as mentioned by several naysayers. I'm very enthused about the upcoming season, and extremely proud of the Generals recent upturn, but even putting the Division I programs in the same sentence is more than slightly absurd. 52 years is a very long time, and I'm not sure too many people remember "playing with the big boys" back in Lexington. The same logic used, "better to have played with the big boys than not played at all" could be thrown right back by Bridgewater, saying it's better to have been to a National Championship game (2001) than not at all (in recent history).

Keep up the enthusiasm, but let's not get ahead of ourselves.

[hasanova]

...actually the insinuation was a dig about the lack of postseason success by either team.

Remember the W&L Generals have two national championships under their belt!!  

I looked on the W&L football site but could find the mention of only one national championship: 1961 College Division title awarded by Washington Touchdown Club.  To my knowlege W&L has only been to the post season once losing to Wyoming in the 1951 Gator Bowl.  That leaves W&L with an 0-1 playoff record compared to the 10-6 playoff record owned by Bridgewater who remains to this day the only ODAC school to ever win a playoff game not to mention play for a national championship.

If you scroll back a couple dozen pages I provide a link citing the national championships.  And what is wrong with having played, and albeit lost in the Gator Bowl?  I think Michigan, LSU, South Carolina, West Virginia, and many other colleges can say the same thing, they lost a Gator Bowl game. 

Better to have played with the big boys and lost, than to never have played with the big boys at all.

BTW the new U.S. News and World Report rankings are in and the Generals rank #17 for the top Liberal Arts Colleges in America.  So we have some national championships in football, 10 of the past 12 ODAC Commissar's Cups, and an endowment that would choke a horse!!  Not to shabby eh? 

How does your school stack up?

Hey, everyone concedes W&L is a fine school!  I think it's great!  I know some folks who are alumni and it's a very prestigious degree.  The campus is beautiful, the history is rich, the endowment is huge and the student body is smart and well-prepared.   Someone once told me, however, that music is often a lot sweeter when it is not played by blowing your own horn.  W&L certainly has a lot of reasons to be proud and it is, I believe, the academic class of the ODAC.  With that said, I think every other ODAC school except one was ranked in this year's US News & World Report edition (I sincerely apologize if I overlooked school #14!).  No, the ODAC is not the Ivy League or the University Athletic Association, but it's truly a great academic and athletic conference from top to bottom.

By the way, I believe your penultimate sentence, "Not to shabby eh?", should have been written as "Not too shabby, eh?"   This corrected rendering is also giving you the benefit of the doubt for there being no subject and no verb.   What do I know, however, since I earned a degree from an ODAC college and a graduate degree from an SEC university and they are both not, sadly, W&L?  lol  Peace