FB: Old Dominion Athletic Conference

[Pat Coleman]

No, I haven't seen Guilford play in probably four years but I don't need to to know that Vogelbach is not the best quarterback you've seen. I understand your bias, but there should be some realism ... somewhere.

Put Micheli in your system and he doesn't throw 26 picks.

[hasanova]

No, I haven't seen Guilford play in probably four years but I don't need to to know that Vogelbach is not the best quarterback you've seen. I understand your bias, but there should be some realism ... somewhere.

Put Micheli in your system and he doesn't throw 26 picks.

OK.  Again, I defer to your clearly superior knowledge of DIII football.  I do have a considerable amount of realism and lack of bias, but Guilford football today is not Guilford football of four years ago.  In fact, I believe I have a good bit more realism and lack of bias than many of your posters.  Great QBs win championships and make very few mistakes, so I fully understand your points.  Personally, I find this non-debate tiresome.    Until Guilford has a more complete team in all facets of winning football, they do not deserve to be mentioned in the DIII elite.  At the very least, however, they are entertaining and that's a few light years ahead of where they were four or five years ago.  Enjoy this week's games!

[allsky7]

Looks like I'm going to have to add a little levity this morning.

My team lost.  And this was after I crowed about the defense.  But I'm enjoying the Bridgewater and Guilford traffic this morning, so please keep it coming. 8)

But don't worry about me.  I consoled myself with Police tickets for the November 6 show at the JPJ arena in C'ville.  Have you got yours?  Ha. 8)

On another good note, my copy of Shorty arrived over the weekend, and it's well worth owning/watching.  There is coverage of the Guilford, W&L, and BC games from that year, and the story is very engaging and warming.  I hope Mr. Simms is with the H-S program for a long time. 8)

     Don't forget E&H, Davidson, Gettysburg, Sewanee, & R-MC.  8)

     And thanks for reminding me about concerts. I had to miss the Aerosmith concert at Nissan last night to deal with family obligations. 

[fmfdoc]

     I promise I will never...ever...EVER compare scores again!! 

Johns Hopkins 17 H-S 16
H-S 54 Gettysburg 7
Gettysburg 41 Hopkins 10 (at Hopkins)
     

When you get stuff like this figured out and can draw conclusions, then apply them to future games, let me know. I think I could find a job in Las Vegas for you.

[Jacketlawyer]

Looks like I'm going to have to add a little levity this morning.

My team lost.  And this was after I crowed about the defense.  But I'm enjoying the Bridgewater and Guilford traffic this morning, so please keep it coming. 8)

But don't worry about me.  I consoled myself with Police tickets for the November 6 show at the JPJ arena in C'ville.  Have you got yours?  Ha. 8)

On another good note, my copy of Shorty arrived over the weekend, and it's well worth owning/watching.  There is coverage of the Guilford, W&L, and BC games from that year, and the story is very engaging and warming.  I hope Mr. Simms is with the H-S program for a long time. 8)

     Don't forget E&H, Davidson, Gettysburg, Sewanee, & R-MC.  8)

     And thanks for reminding me about concerts. I had to miss the Aerosmith concert at Nissan last night to deal with family obligations. 

Oh yeah, I forgot about E&H.  That was one of the better scenes with Coach Wacker.  Amazing that his recall is so good.  Amazing.

Wish they'd examined the rivalry a bit more in the film; it's hard to know why he wants the victory so badly for his birthday, unless you're familiar with the "feud."

But back to football.  I may be in DC for the CUA game, and I hope the Jackets can rebound. Go Macon.

[allsky7]

     I promise I will never...ever...EVER compare scores again!! 

Johns Hopkins 17 H-S 16
H-S 54 Gettysburg 7
Gettysburg 41 Hopkins 10 (at Hopkins)
     

When you get stuff like this figured out and can draw conclusions, then apply them to future games, let me know. I think I could find a job in Las Vegas for you.

     I DO have this crystal ball packed away in storage!! 

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Wasn't Hasanova at the Stagg Bowl last year? Did he not go into the stadium?

That's where the best Division III quarterback he's seen was playing -- assuming he looked at the field.

When you see a quarterback play 14 times, and others only once (maybe twice), I can see someone's thinking becoming fuzzy.

Perhaps that applies to you and Highfill as well.

No question.  But I've never said Highfill is the best Division III quarterback I've seen.

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Jeff would rather be 15-0.  Josh can have POTY, AA, and the records.  He certainly deserves it with the numbers he has, and will, put up.

Matt, for gosh sake, Vogelbach would rather be 15-0 as well.

Sorry, my statement clearly should have included a or 8).  Something to let you know that I was being facetious.

I think this discussion has you a bit rattled.  You're usually very careful and guarded with your opinions and insight, but then you throw out there the "Vogelbach is the best D3 QB I've seen" statement, and all heck breaks loose.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, and I - like many - think you're one of the most intelligent and insightful people on these boards.  So don't get frustrated and pull a WLU78 on us.

[allsky7]

Looks like I'm going to have to add a little levity this morning.

My team lost.  And this was after I crowed about the defense.  But I'm enjoying the Bridgewater and Guilford traffic this morning, so please keep it coming. 8)

But don't worry about me.  I consoled myself with Police tickets for the November 6 show at the JPJ arena in C'ville.  Have you got yours?  Ha. 8)

On another good note, my copy of Shorty arrived over the weekend, and it's well worth owning/watching.  There is coverage of the Guilford, W&L, and BC games from that year, and the story is very engaging and warming.  I hope Mr. Simms is with the H-S program for a long time. 8)

     Don't forget E&H, Davidson, Gettysburg, Sewanee, & R-MC.  8)

     And thanks for reminding me about concerts. I had to miss the Aerosmith concert at Nissan last night to deal with family obligations. 

Oh yeah, I forgot about E&H.  That was one of the better scenes with Coach Wacker.  Amazing that his recall is so good.  Amazing.

Wish they'd examined the rivalry a bit more in the film; it's hard to know why he wants the victory so badly for his birthday, unless you're familiar with the "feud."
But back to football.  I may be in DC for the CUA game, and I hope the Jackets can rebound. Go Macon.

    I agree. My only complaint about the movie (I admit from my own selfish bias) is that I wish they had spent more time on the old days and laying the foundation of this birthday wish.  Most of the folks involved in this movie are relative newcomers to H-S. Some of the old timers could have added even more insight to the big picture.  8)

[hasanova]

Wasn't Hasanova at the Stagg Bowl last year? Did he not go into the stadium?

That's where the best Division III quarterback he's seen was playing -- assuming he looked at the field.

When you see a quarterback play 14 times, and others only once (maybe twice), I can see someone's thinking becoming fuzzy.

Perhaps that applies to you and Highfill as well.

No question.  But I've never said Highfill is the best Division III quarterback I've seen.

True, but I correctly predicted almost verbatim this would be your next post.  lol  Good luck to BC this weekend.  

[fmfdoc]

I'm not starting a Vogelbach vs. Highfill debate (in other words, I'm not saying Highfill is better than Vogelbach), I'm simply trying to point out that Vogelbach has gotten his 8,131 passing yards and 88 touchdowns mainly because of the system he is in.

Perhaps a debate is not your purpose, but this post is doing a great impersonation of a debate.    Good luck to Jeff and the Eagles - they're a fine player and a great team, certainly worthy of any accolades they receive.

     I think anytime you talk about the "best" at anything, you open a can of worms. There are so many variables that come into play it is practically an impossible task. Statistics only account for part of the equation IMO. Guess it can make for some interesting message board and tailgate talk though. 

I am going to reserve the right to update my opinion after Oct 13, but I will say this:  I think Vogelbach is a better fit for GC, and Highfill a better fit for BC.  Overall, I think Vogelbach is a better D3 QB.  Matt, it may not be as close as you think.  The best D3 QB I have ever seen?  I think it's the Trinity QB who was banned from their Stagg Bowl team.  

I do know one thing about D3 QBs.  That I am going to see a fun game on Oct. 13.  It may not be fun after the game, but that should be the most entertaining game that I will see all year.  That 'Nova guy better show up!

GO BC!

I agree. Unless you are using statistics alone, the best at anything is entirely a matter of personal opinion and what you are basing that opinion on.

Aside from having some level of talent, the ability to read defenses, and make the right decision at the right time, it is probably a matter of who fits best within a system; or even more important, how well a coach can adapt to utilize a particular player's strengths and minimize the player's weaknesses that makes a QB threat more than anything else.

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

I'm not starting a Vogelbach vs. Highfill debate (in other words, I'm not saying Highfill is better than Vogelbach), I'm simply trying to point out that Vogelbach has gotten his 8,131 passing yards and 88 touchdowns mainly because of the system he is in.

Perhaps a debate is not your purpose, but this post is doing a great impersonation of a debate.  [...]

Nope, simply trying to bring Vogelbach's numbers back down to earth.

I'm sure the same comparisons can be made with other QBs in the league. Sorry, I just happen to have Highfill's career numbers already compiled - so it took less time to research and post.

[hasanova]

Jeff would rather be 15-0.  Josh can have POTY, AA, and the records.  He certainly deserves it with the numbers he has, and will, put up.

Matt, for gosh sake, Vogelbach would rather be 15-0 as well.

Sorry, my statement clearly should have included a or 8).  Something to let you know that I was being facetious.

I think this discussion has you a bit rattled.  You're usually very careful and guarded with your opinions and insight, but then you throw out there the "Vogelbach is the best D3 QB I've seen" statement, and all heck breaks loose.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, and I - like many - think you're one of the most intelligent and insightful people on these boards.  So don't get frustrated and pull a WLU78 on us.

Thank you, but I assure you I am not the least bit rattled or frustrated.  This whole thing is "much ado about nothing."     

[Matt Barnhart (kid)]

Jeff would rather be 15-0.  Josh can have POTY, AA, and the records.  He certainly deserves it with the numbers he has, and will, put up.

Matt, for gosh sake, Vogelbach would rather be 15-0 as well.

Sorry, my statement clearly should have included a or 8).  Something to let you know that I was being facetious.

I think this discussion has you a bit rattled.  You're usually very careful and guarded with your opinions and insight, but then you throw out there the "Vogelbach is the best D3 QB I've seen" statement, and all heck breaks loose.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, and I - like many - think you're one of the most intelligent and insightful people on these boards.  So don't get frustrated and pull a WLU78 on us.

Thank you, but I assure you I am not the least bit rattled or frustrated.  This whole thing is "much ado about nothing."     

A "for gosh sake" post that was edited would suggest otherwise, but whatever.

And IMO, this discussion is actually a very interesting one.  I'm starting to think you're backing away from your original "Vogelbach = the chosen one" statement.

Did I push the right button to keep this discussion going?

[Trenches]

Smokin' guns ablazin this morning. 

Pat - You NEED to see Josh play. Make it a priority to catch a game. Soon.


Matt - as for the percentages... compare two players -
QB 1:
0-10 passes: 12-16   10-20: 9-12   20-40:  5-10   40+: 2-4   total: 25-40 (61%)
QB 2:
0-10 passes: 6-8   10-20: 10-15    20-40:  2-6   40+: 1-2   total: 19-31 (61%)

QB 1 here is in a GC type O, QB 2 in a BC. Both Comp %'s are approx 61%, but you can see the impact of the number of attempts. Although more completions are made in all but the 10-20 range, the percentages stay similar. Just had to throw this out there since you said you were tired of that arguement. Yes, the GC O throws mainly short passes, but due to the high number of passes thrown total, it can affect a completion percentage.

Bottom line... we all know that when it comes down to it, the GC O gets it done on Saturdays. Now if the D plays the way they are capable, look out!