FB: Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference

[smedindy]

Ralph - they could have that game at the Dome and they may get a huge crowd if the price was right! The Bell game is pretty well hyped anyway, and a playoff game would be sheer madness.

[Ralph Turner]

Smedindy, I believe that the playoffs are under the complete auspices of the NCAA as outlined in the Handbook, including starting times and admission prices.

At least we got a quick response from Bonzo! 8)

Or maybe it was he who took my karma point!

Gee, and I thought the post analyzing some conspiracy theories in the machinations of the SCAC was clever.

[wally_wabash]

Ron, the problem is that any tiebreaker that the SCAC comes up wherein 7=-2 Depauw gets that AQ over 9-0 Trinity screws all other Pool C candidates.  If that's the tiebreak the SCAC had set up BEFORE this happened, then so be it.  After the fact, it's bogus. 

And I don't hang any of this on Trinity.  I'm all for tossing all blame on Depauw (I really don't like them at all), but I'm not sure that's fair either.  I really think, that unless the SCAC decides that the best overall record gets the AQ, the NCAA should toss both teams into Pool B.  If they both qualify and get bids that way, fine.  I don't like the SCAC being able to give a 7-2 team the AQ such that the conference can get two teams in the playoffs. 

[Pat Coleman]

If that's the tiebreak the SCAC had set up BEFORE this happened, then so be it.  After the fact, it's bogus.

The conference has the right to determine its automatic bid however it sees fit. Some conferences have odd tiebreakers. Some have their teams only play partial schedules. Not sure either one has room to talk.

[Ron Boerger]

Ron, the problem is that any tiebreaker that the SCAC comes up wherein 7=-2 Depauw gets that AQ over 9-0 Trinity screws all other Pool C candidates. 

[...]  I don't like the SCAC being able to give a 7-2 team the AQ such that the conference can get two teams in the playoffs. 

I think you are allowing your hatred for DePauw to color this discussion.  First, you seem to be assuming that the SCAC is going to go out of its way to design the tiebreaker to give DePauw an advantage.  If the tiebreaker they come up with is the one Ralph mentioned (e.g. the team that hasn't been to the playoffs longest gets to go), then perhaps you have a point.  We haven't seen the tiebreak rules, though, and I doubt the SCAC is so desperate to get a second football team in the playoffs that it would use this as the primary rule.  Second, neither team has played a conference game.  That means neither team has a leg up and will be operating under the same rules to qualify for the conference's bid.  You can rest assured that the guys at TU will do whatever they can to deny the guys at DU the auto bid, as I would imagine the same could be said about the guys at DU. 

As others have stated, there is no assurance that either TU or DU will actually go undefeated, let alone both.   What if someone else should win the conference?  Should they have to get dumped into Pool B?  Should we be happy that Pool B gets "screwed" instead of (allegedly) Pool C?   Does that make things any better? 

Penalizing a conference because one of its members made a decision to keep its kids out of harm's way would be petty and counterproductive.   It would set a precedent the NCAA would probably rather not set.  

[Ralph Turner]

To amplify the SWC tiebreaker that I mentioned, I don't have any problem with the last oneback there rule that gave Texas Tech the bid.  There was a 5-way tie in 1994 (and the Aggies were on probation) and Tech lost to Southern Cal in the Cotton Bowl 55-14.  Tech had not been to the Cotton Bowl since 1939.  After all of the criteria had failed to determine a winner, that "longest one out" was used instead of a coin flip.

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/conference_champs/champions.php?conid=184

[TigerDad]

If blame must be assigned, let's deflect it from either school and onto the true cause of the SCAC title problem.  Here are two choices:

1) Mother Nature:
For those earth-worshippers out there, Mother Nature concocted the wandering path of Hurricane Rita to frustrate and confuse D3Football fans and their respective teams.  By heading her at South Central Texas first, she made the DePauw PTB rightfully fear for the safety of their team.  By pushing her east late on Wednesday night, Mother Nature embarrassed the DePauw admins by causing the rest of us to doubt their "manhood" and "character" ... therein, the previous posting discussions about DPU's scheming motivation.  Mother Nature, meanwhile, giggles and shakes her head while scolding, "It's not nice to fool Mother Nature!" (as in the margarine commercial).

or, 2) The LORD God Almighty:
According to theist football fans, the Creator allowed Hurricane Rita to develop tremendous potential destructive force while out in the Gulf, but directed her to lesser populated areas thereby saving thousands (or perhaps millions) of homes and businesses, and potentially preserving many families from injury or death.  The fact that the last minute curve of the storm's path affected football game schedules and travel plans is simply incidental.  

Either way, remarkably, the thousands of Houston evacuees streaming west through our town on Thursday, then back east on Saturday, did not seem concerned about the SCAC tiebreaker situation.  The nerve of those selfish folks ...

Don't get me wrong ... I do love my football, but I imagine the SCAC situation will work out as it should in the end.  And if there's a bit of controversy along the way, well, that just gives us good fodder for the discussion board!   

GO TIGERS ... BEAT THOSE ENGINEERS.

[Pat Coleman]

Many conferences use the so-called Rose Bowl Rule (they who have been out the longest get to go) to break the 'unbreakable' tie, for what it's worth.

[evacuee]

How about this?

DePauw can't run the table.  Someone jumps up and bites them.  A lot of you folks were loving Millsaps in the preseason.  We all know that Trinity will be undefeated.  When they've lost in the past, the team that got lucky on that day was unable to capitalize. Trinity wins it with a better record, as they do every year. 

We're not going away. 

[Ron Boerger]

Many conferences use the so-called Rose Bowl Rule (they who have been out the longest get to go) to break the 'unbreakable' tie, for what it's worth.

Yeah, I don't have a problem with it as long as it's the rule of last resort. 

[wally_wabash]

If one of the other SCAC teams wins the conference, they will have earned the AQ because they played the full conference schedule.  So no, they shouldn't be tossed into Pool B.  My Pool B argument applies only to Trinity and Depauw because they are effectively playing in a six-team conference this year as a result of the decision to cancel the game.  Ron, you've said in another area on PP that the 7-team conference is what it takes to demonstrate adequate competency for a playoff bid.  

It's true that conferences can choose their playoff representative by any way they see fit, but there is some amount of integrity involved in doing so.  What's stopping the OAC from giving their AQ to the second place team and letting MUC "sweat out" the selection process?  Technically, they could do it but they don't because it isn't right.  What could happen here in the SCAC is similar, if to a lesser degree.

[Ron Boerger]

Damn, dude, this is a freak occurrence caused by a storm that caused billions of dollars of damage and has now killed over 100 people.  Get off your high horse already.  There's no way  the NCAA is going to apply separate rules to a conference depending on who wins it.  I know you Wabash people don't like DePauw but this is getting ridiculous.   Go concentrate on the Monon Bell and leave the rest of us alone. 

And next time a hurricane impacts a wide swath of the OAC, let's talk.  The SCAC isn't "giving" their AQ to anybody. 

[smedindy]

Wally - I agree, let it go. The SCAC can work this out amongst themselves. Someone will get the AQ and everyone will have to live with it. Let's just hope that DePauw doesn't feel slighted before the Bell game.

I don't see the analogy at all - you don't see a lot of this in D-1 because they have such and elongated season they can work games in November and even December.

[wally_wabash]

It's not that I don't care about the storm, Ron.  I do.  But what we need to realize here is that the NCAA doesn't have a conscience.  Time and time again, the NCAA has ruled against individuals and institutions regardless of their circumstance.  The NCAA pays no attention to freak occurrances.  

My problem here isn't so much with Depauw specifically as it is with the SCAC.  A two-loss Depauw team has no business whatsoever in the playoffs unless: 1) they've beaten Trinity and won the SCAC outright or 2) Depauw is the only undefeated team in the SCAC.  I would say the same thing if it were Rhodes or Millsaps or any other team from the conference...this case just happens to be Depauw.  The scenario is ripe for the SCAC to backdoor their way into two bids here, and the SCAC probably doesn't deserve two bids.  That's my gripe...not that it might be Depauw that gets in.  

[smedindy]

The SCAC deserves two bids more than the NCAC, for sure. Last year DPU probably would have made an expanded playoff field.   And I don't think they'd backdoor their way into two bids, anyway. There's still a lot of football to be played and some 2-loss teams would have a strong case for a "C" at any rate.