FB: Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference

[wally_wabash]

TLU's coach is on the committee that has ranked TLU behind Guilford and Moravian each of the last two weeks, and probably yesterday as well.  Maybe send a strongly worded email to him? 

[Ralph Turner]

TLU'S coach probably recused himself and left the room at that time of the meeting.

[Coolrey]

Although I believe that TLU was playoff worthy, it just wasn't going to be.  Very proud of the turnaround of this program.  A very good coaching staff, a new stadium and a senior class that has gone 29-9 over the past four years.  Before that, TLU was a homecoming opponent for most programs and lucky to win 5 games a year.  Good luck to Hardin-Simmons and UMHB in the playoffs and we hope that you represent Texas well.  Congrats and good luck in the future to the TLU coaches and seniors and thank you for your commitment and dedication to convert an also-ran to a nationally recognized and respected program.  Job well-done.

[GillCJ1]

Although I believe that TLU was playoff worthy, it just wasn't going to be.  Very proud of the turnaround of this program.  A very good coaching staff, a new stadium and a senior class that has gone 29-9 over the past four years.  Before that, TLU was a homecoming opponent for most programs and lucky to win 5 games a year.  Good luck to Hardin-Simmons and UMHB in the playoffs and we hope that you represent Texas well.  Congrats and good luck in the future to the TLU coaches and seniors and thank you for your commitment and dedication to convert an also-ran to a nationally recognized and respected program.  Job well-done.

Congrats to the Bulldogs on another successful season.  Looking forward to future match-ups.

[Coolrey]

Whoops..forgive me...29-11. Math skills lacking.

[TLU02SA]

Although I believe that TLU was playoff worthy, it just wasn't going to be.  Very proud of the turnaround of this program.  A very good coaching staff, a new stadium and a senior class that has gone 29-9 over the past four years.  Before that, TLU was a homecoming opponent for most programs and lucky to win 5 games a year.  Good luck to Hardin-Simmons and UMHB in the playoffs and we hope that you represent Texas well.  Congrats and good luck in the future to the TLU coaches and seniors and thank you for your commitment and dedication to convert an also-ran to a nationally recognized and respected program.  Job well-done.

Congrats to the Bulldogs on another successful season.  Looking forward to future match-ups.

Likewise.  I hope TLU continues to schedule UMHB and HSU.  With the SCAC going to a double round robin next year, it will be difficult to schedule both. 

I find it frustrating that UMHB and HSU will have to play each other in the first round.  I understand that costs, geography and logistics in D3 football are a huge consideration but I truly believe that both of those teams are top 16 (possibly top 8 or even better).  It is unfortunate that Texas is relegated to 2 playoff entries and that they are forced to play each other in the first round.  I am curious, with so many teams in the Northeast and in the upper-western midwest, are there any states that have more than 2 playoff teams?  And if the max is 2, are they forced to play each other?  Or is this just something that happens to Texas teams because of their locale?

[wally_wabash]

Although I believe that TLU was playoff worthy, it just wasn't going to be.  Very proud of the turnaround of this program.  A very good coaching staff, a new stadium and a senior class that has gone 29-9 over the past four years.  Before that, TLU was a homecoming opponent for most programs and lucky to win 5 games a year.  Good luck to Hardin-Simmons and UMHB in the playoffs and we hope that you represent Texas well.  Congrats and good luck in the future to the TLU coaches and seniors and thank you for your commitment and dedication to convert an also-ran to a nationally recognized and respected program.  Job well-done.

Congrats to the Bulldogs on another successful season.  Looking forward to future match-ups.

Likewise.  I hope TLU continues to schedule UMHB and HSU.  With the SCAC going to a double round robin next year, it will be difficult to schedule both. 

I find it frustrating that UMHB and HSU will have to play each other in the first round.  I understand that costs, geography and logistics in D3 football are a huge consideration but I truly believe that both of those teams are top 16 (possibly top 8 or even better).  It is unfortunate that Texas is relegated to 2 playoff entries and that they are forced to play each other in the first round.  I am curious, with so many teams in the Northeast and in the upper-western midwest, are there any states that have more than 2 playoff teams?  And if the max is 2, are they forced to play each other?  Or is this just something that happens to Texas teams because of their locale?

There is no limit on the number of teams from a given state.  I'm not sure where you would get that idea.  Texas doesn't get two teams- two teams in Texas were selected.  Sometimes there might just be one.  Sometimes three.  It's unlikely, but as long as the ASC does not qualify for an automatic bid, there might be zero teams from Texas. 

[TLU02SA]

Although I believe that TLU was playoff worthy, it just wasn't going to be.  Very proud of the turnaround of this program.  A very good coaching staff, a new stadium and a senior class that has gone 29-9 over the past four years.  Before that, TLU was a homecoming opponent for most programs and lucky to win 5 games a year.  Good luck to Hardin-Simmons and UMHB in the playoffs and we hope that you represent Texas well.  Congrats and good luck in the future to the TLU coaches and seniors and thank you for your commitment and dedication to convert an also-ran to a nationally recognized and respected program.  Job well-done.

Congrats to the Bulldogs on another successful season.  Looking forward to future match-ups.

Likewise.  I hope TLU continues to schedule UMHB and HSU.  With the SCAC going to a double round robin next year, it will be difficult to schedule both. 

I find it frustrating that UMHB and HSU will have to play each other in the first round.  I understand that costs, geography and logistics in D3 football are a huge consideration but I truly believe that both of those teams are top 16 (possibly top 8 or even better).  It is unfortunate that Texas is relegated to 2 playoff entries and that they are forced to play each other in the first round.  I am curious, with so many teams in the Northeast and in the upper-western midwest, are there any states that have more than 2 playoff teams?  And if the max is 2, are they forced to play each other?  Or is this just something that happens to Texas teams because of their locale?

There is no limit on the number of teams from a given state.  I'm not sure where you would get that idea.  Texas doesn't get two teams- two teams in Texas were selected.  Sometimes there might just be one.  Sometimes three.  It's unlikely, but as long as the ASC does not qualify for an automatic bid, there might be zero teams from Texas.

I know there is not a set number.  It just seems that every year the committee selects two Texas/Louisiana teams, makes them play head-to-head and that is that. My comment has less to do with questioning the committee on the number of teams selected from the Texas/Louisiana. 

My main concern is the Texas/Louisiana teams are placed into a de facto sub-regional bracket when they are required to play each other head-to-head in the first round.  Some years, that is fine but I find the bracketing very penalizing to HSU and UMHB this year.  I believe that each of those teams is within the top 16 (and possibly top 8) teams in the country.  In a perfect world, those teams should not have to play each other until the second round at the earliest. 

Again, I understand that costs and travel time are major factor in the D3 bracketing.  I just think that the committee should have been more creative this year with that specific matchup.  For example, HSU could be hosting Hendrix, while Huntington hosts UMHB.

[jknezek]

For example, HSU could be hosting Hendrix, while Huntington hosts UMHB.

That is an extra flight. Huntingdon can't drive to UMHB per the 500 mile rule.

[crufootball]

This would probably never get approved because 500 miles is already a really long bus trip but I did have an idea that might solve some things.

In cases that it would allow for a more traditional bracket, a team could be put on a bus for 600 miles. It seems like a number of times I looked at distances and it would fall just over 500 miles (Hendrix to HSU is 524 miles, Wabash to Hendrix is 594). Perhaps in these cases you also grant the traveling team 2 nights of hotels which I would still think if much cheaper than a flight plus 1 night in hotel.

This is probably grasping at straws but it would allow some additional flexibility and might not help the Western teams but might help the southern teams every now and then.

[jknezek]

I think I read somewhere NAIA is 700 miles, but I could be mis-remembering. Long bus trips. Not so bad in the wide open south, but in the traffic congested north east or midwest, where a bus averages closer to 50mph on freeways than 70, 600 miles is 12 hours. Add a food stop and stretch stop and you are talking close to 14 hours each way on a bus. At some point it's just not worth it...

[wally_wabash]

I know there is not a set number.  It just seems that every year the committee selects two Texas/Louisiana teams, makes them play head-to-head and that is that. My comment has less to do with questioning the committee on the number of teams selected from the Texas/Louisiana. 

My main concern is the Texas/Louisiana teams are placed into a de facto sub-regional bracket when they are required to play each other head-to-head in the first round.  Some years, that is fine but I find the bracketing very penalizing to HSU and UMHB this year.  I believe that each of those teams is within the top 16 (and possibly top 8) teams in the country.  In a perfect world, those teams should not have to play each other until the second round at the earliest. 

There's not a single person, here or on that selection committee, that doesn't agree with this.  This stinks for competitive purposes and everybody knows it.  But this isn't a perfect world, this is D3 and we have to work with the dollars that we've been allotted.  That's it.  That's the constraint and it isn't going anywhere. 

And let's just point this out- Isn't UMHB or HSU going to have to probably beat one or the other on the way to the title?  Whoever wins this thing has to win 5 games.  Don't win 5 and you don't get the trophy.  Whether you lose in round 1 or round 4, the end result is basically the same.   

Again, I understand that costs and travel time are major factor in the D3 bracketing.  I just think that the committee should have been more creative this year with that specific matchup.  For example, HSU could be hosting Hendrix, while Huntington hosts UMHB.

As has been pointed out, this isn't a solution. You've created an extra flight and that's not getting approved in today's NCAA.  For this kind of thing to ever work, you need an odd orphan and probably an odd number of Texas teams.  Something that forces more than one first round flight no matter what.  That's hard to pull off though.

[crufootball]

There's not a single person, here or on that selection committee, that doesn't agree with this.  This stinks for competitive purposes and everybody knows it.  But this isn't a perfect world, this is D3 and we have to work with the dollars that we've been allotted.  That's it.  That's the constraint and it isn't going anywhere. 

And let's just point this out- Isn't UMHB or HSU going to have to probably beat one or the other on the way to the title?  Whoever wins this thing has to win 5 games.  Don't win 5 and you don't get the trophy.  Whether you lose in round 1 or round 4, the end result is basically the same.   

Again, I understand that costs and travel time are major factor in the D3 bracketing.  I just think that the committee should have been more creative this year with that specific matchup.  For example, HSU could be hosting Hendrix, while Huntington hosts UMHB.

As has been pointed out, this isn't a solution. You've created an extra flight and that's not getting approved in today's NCAA.  For this kind of thing to ever work, you need an odd orphan and probably an odd number of Texas teams.  Something that forces more than one first round flight no matter what.  That's hard to pull off though.

It seems like we are reaching dead horse level to this argument but I just can't resists replying to this. I think most of us completely understand the reasoning for why the Texas and NWC teams are going to be paired, but can you blame us for complaining for as Pat said in in the podcast when we get screwed?

Yes it is true that in order to be the best you have to beat the best, but that easier to shallow when you have to do it in the later rounds. When the ASC/SCAC and NWC teams have to beat a good team twice just to get to the 2nd round I can tell you for sure it does matter if you lose in the 2nd or 4th round. Being able to go on the recruiting trail and say you advance to the quarterfinals or semi's is going to sound a lot better than we got beat by a fellow conference member in the 1st round of the tournament.

At any rate, like I said I think most people that are on these boards realize and respect why things are done the way they are but that is never going to stop us from at least rehashing this argument every year.

[wally_wabash]

There's not a single person, here or on that selection committee, that doesn't agree with this.  This stinks for competitive purposes and everybody knows it.  But this isn't a perfect world, this is D3 and we have to work with the dollars that we've been allotted.  That's it.  That's the constraint and it isn't going anywhere. 

And let's just point this out- Isn't UMHB or HSU going to have to probably beat one or the other on the way to the title?  Whoever wins this thing has to win 5 games.  Don't win 5 and you don't get the trophy.  Whether you lose in round 1 or round 4, the end result is basically the same.   

Again, I understand that costs and travel time are major factor in the D3 bracketing.  I just think that the committee should have been more creative this year with that specific matchup.  For example, HSU could be hosting Hendrix, while Huntington hosts UMHB.

As has been pointed out, this isn't a solution. You've created an extra flight and that's not getting approved in today's NCAA.  For this kind of thing to ever work, you need an odd orphan and probably an odd number of Texas teams.  Something that forces more than one first round flight no matter what.  That's hard to pull off though.

It seems like we are reaching dead horse level to this argument but I just can't resists replying to this. I think most of us completely understand the reasoning for why the Texas and NWC teams are going to be paired, but can you blame us for complaining for as Pat said in in the podcast when we get screwed?

Yes it is true that in order to be the best you have to beat the best, but that easier to shallow when you have to do it in the later rounds. When the ASC/SCAC and NWC teams have to beat a good team twice just to get to the 2nd round I can tell you for sure it does matter if you lose in the 2nd or 4th round. Being able to go on the recruiting trail and say you advance to the quarterfinals or semi's is going to sound a lot better than we got beat by a fellow conference member in the 1st round of the tournament.

At any rate, like I said I think most people that are on these boards realize and respect why things are done the way they are but that is never going to stop us from at least rehashing this argument every year.

See, I don't think people do respect the way things are done.  UMHB/HSU didn't get screwed.  This was ALWAYS going to happen.  There was not a way to get around it.  It isn't new, it's completely expected, so I don't understand the annual tantrum that happens when that bracket gets put out. 

And I really don't understand it this year.  The committee didn't have to give the ASC/NWC teams a buffer round, but they did.  Just as easily (and probably less expensively) could have put Linfield/Whitworth with HSU/UMHB and Cortland/Salisbury with Huntingdon/Hendrix.  That's absolutely a thing that could have happened.  You guys should be celebrating this bracket, tbqh. 

[crufootball]

Just because we always get screwed, doesn't mean we didn't get screwed. How would you feel if every year it was possible, the NCAA paired Wabash and DePauw because it was cost effective?

I will repeat I completely understand why the committee and NCAA pair us together, but please forgive us that we don't celebrate the fact that a #2 seed is facing a #3 and that we don't have to go fact #1 in the next round.