FB: Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference

[evacuee]

If you want to promote division 3 sports, do a google search for pontiac game changing performance and vote for the only d3 play that will likely be seen there for a long time.  We only have a few days left and Appalachain State is currently in the lead. 

A vote for Trinity is a vote for d3football.

[DPULefty22]

Now we've got two gorillas, to continue your metaphor.

Very true...and I think BSC is going be really good really soon as well.  I'm wondering if DPU's best chance to win the SCAC didn't get washed out by Rita. 

To be fair... DPU did win the SCAC that year - a split title with Trinity.  DPU's 2 losses that year were at the hands of two playoff teams by a combined 8 points - if they hadn't scheduled Wesley that year (who I think went to the national semis that year - they beat the Tigers 31-26 in Greencastle), maybe they go 8-1, and while the lack of a standout win would have hurt their Pool C chances, who knows?

I know, I know, 'co-champions' and all that, but it's that part after the 'co' that's the big thing.

I'll always believe DPU would have beaten Trinity that year - that was the best DePauw team I saw in my four years, and Trinity was as 'ripe for the picking' as a program like that one is ever going to be. Oh, well.

Oh, and I wholeheartedly agree about BSC - took a gutsy two-minute drill to bail the Tigers out in their first visit down there this past season, and most of BSC's impact players were freshman. I may have posted this at the time of the game, but if that's the case I'll say it again - a lot of those Panthers could have seen some serious time on any other team in the conference, including the DPU-TU-MC triad. They're well coached, too.

[Ralph Turner]

The other big thing going for BSC is that the president has given 110% of institutional support to the athletics programs.

There is not been "big-time" D-3 emphasis in the South, from Millsaps to the coast.  (I am not disregarding Sewanee or Millsaps or Oglethorpe or Huntingdon or LaGrange, but I think it is BSC that provides the "critical mass" for D3 to take off!)

I think that the BSC faithful will embrace D-3 as well as any place in the country, and there is not a conflict between SEC football on one level and the SCAC/D-3 on another.

[frank_ezelle]

Ralph, I can't disagree with your comments about the potential of BSC becoming a D-3 power in athletics if they so choose.  It is hard to analize where their overall program is right now with some of their teams having the benefit of former D1 players still remaining in the program and other teams being made up primarily of freshmen.  There was a lot of excitement about the return of football this year and maybe they will build on that excitement and maybe that excitement will fade.  Time will tell.

I feel like most people here discount the post of Millsaps people when it comes to football, so I'll just give my opinion and everyone can just blow it off as an over zealous fan.  When the coaches at Millsaps say that their two goals are to win the SCAC championship and the NCAA championship, they are not looking at this as setting an achievable goal followed by a pipe dream goal.  While the last two years have been championship years at Millsaps, I think they are just part of the process that is needed to get to a much higher goal of being one of the handful of schools with a legitimate chance of winning the national championship.  Time will tell.

[AF4]

ralph's observations may b on the money, with respect to D-3 and the deep south... but several things are coming into play... south alabama (acording to the news outlets in mobile) has decided to start a football program they have a verbal  comitment to eventally join the D-1 sunbelt (i thank 5 yrs)

kennesaw State in marietta, ga will begin football within the next 3 yrs(according ..again to news i read out of marietta) and ga state in mid town atlanta is starting up football
kennesaw will probably b d-2 => d1cs
i believe this will affect lagrange some...particularly kenesaw (as they have som kids from cobb county)

the relatively new naia programs at shorter  (rome ga) and faulkner (montgomery) will also impact all these schools... i no... i no... not the same kids... but i am not so sure there is that great a defference in recruiting (ok...grades being a big diff...but there r some smart kids at those schools)

having lived through the boys (aka son) recruiting odessey last yr ...i thought it had a lot to do with just playing football...and not a lot more

in the boys case after 6 official visits... it came down to 2 d-2 schools which offered partials, invited walk ons to 2 d1.( bc & cs)...although we visited sewanee, bsc, and samford...he had no interest (i wanted him to go to either sewanee or samford....but he did not like either) ... he visited huntingdon...jusor t to get out of school...and fell in love with it... i liked the idea of d-3...i liked the scholar athlete idea... and since he got an academic sholarship...the price was right

in his case...and my impression many of his team mates...it is about playing football.... the boy said (while making his decision ...... 'dad, it's either auburn-alabama and then everything else....so...i'm gonna go to huntington cause they got a 100% acceptance to law school... and i thank i can play more'
(i believe the emphasis was really '''i thank i can play more' and not at all about the law school)

i realize i have rambled...but i believe the increase number of programs will forever hurt the potential growth of d-3 in the south as compared to the rest of the usa... millsaps being a possible exception ( the saints, the facilities..etc)

many folks can say ..well they r different type of kids attracted to d-3... maybe..... but don't over state that point... bsc has transfers (according to thier we site) from grambling, jax state, carson-newman, the citadel...and several d-3 schools... kinda like huntingdon did it's first year... both schools require high standards... we can argue which is higher... but my point is the new schools will affect all the d-3 in the south...as these r small states and only so much talent...

possible example:
one of the linemen from milsaps on the 3rd team of the all south region is from mobile... now i am sure he would pick milsaps again and perhaps my thesis does not apply to him... but other kids of similar talent might b tempted to stay in mobile and go to south alabama (which has a medical school and is a FINE institution)... and i bet that kid could play there...

the more diluted... well the weaker all the lower levels will become... but i could b wrong... it won't b the first or last time

before everyone from the scac screams i am stupid (which might b true)..i love the scac...  my first cousin was capt of the football team at sewanee in 66...

keep the faith

[Ralph Turner]

Ralph, I can't disagree with your comments about the potential of BSC becoming a D-3 power in athletics if they so choose.  It is hard to analize where their overall program is right now with some of their teams having the benefit of former D1 players still remaining in the program and other teams being made up primarily of freshmen.  There was a lot of excitement about the return of football this year and maybe they will build on that excitement and maybe that excitement will fade.  Time will tell.

I feel like most people here discount the post of Millsaps people when it comes to football, so I'll just give my opinion and everyone can just blow it off as an over zealous fan.  When the coaches at Millsaps say that their two goals are to win the SCAC championship and the NCAA championship, they are not looking at this as setting an achievable goal followed by a pipe dream goal.  While the last two years have been championship years at Millsaps, I think they are just part of the process that is needed to get to a much higher goal of being one of the handful of schools with a legitimate chance of winning the national championship.  Time will tell.

Frank, I was mainly concerned with football in that post.  The "D-1" facilities, especially baseball, will continue to be a lure for prospective student athletes.

Here is the architectural drawing for the new football stadium and other facilities.

My comment on the critical mass is that now there another peer institution that is playing D-3 football.  Was any "enthusiasm" at Millsaps when Millsaps would play McMurry over the last three decades?

Who seems to excite the Millsaps alumni?  Rhodes, Sewanee, Trinity?  Austin College, Centre, DePauw?

Huntingdon, La Grange and BSC have brought a new level of football excitement to a football-starved area in this decade.  Specific to the SCAC, the option for  "Alabama boys" will be to sit on the bench at some D1-AA or have playing time and a comparable or better education at BSC.

If the resurgence of Millsaps football coupled with the growth of BSC heightens D3 awareness, then great!  I have said many times.  I think that there are more D-II/D-III calibre football players/athletes who have given up intercollegiate athletics because it wasn't D-1, than we know of.  Raising the profile of the joys and benefits of D-III athletics is the mind-change that may occur in the South with the arrival of BSC.

[cush]

Good points but i'd look at the state of ohio, they have six teams in the mac + ohio state and cincy. Than they have 7 teams in the ncac + case in the uaa and who knows who else playing football at the college level but that's alot of servings. As for d3 football in the south, geo, florida, s.car and LA are pretty much untapped...well at the level the scac wants, ie high academic school's...maybe throw in ncar since the soco is d1. I do think that hits a point, the scac like to be playing with each other and other academic school's cause that is their selling point and that's why i lean to them joining up if enough academic type horses leave the d3 barn for d4.

[Ralph Turner]

AF4 has some of the same thoughts in his very good post. 

I understand the concern for the dilution of talent that may occur at the upper levels, but I also think that the South has that much talent to go around.

Another dynamic is the difference from the "control" that the coach has over a player with the "Athletic" scholarship.  My cousin was an all-state defensive lineman in the top classification in Texas.  He received a full ride to SMU back in the Ron Meyer era (Craig James/Eric Dickerson).  After the first day of three-a-days, he realized that D-1 was not for him.

He is now looking at the options for his 15 year-old who is a talented wide receiver.  He knows exactly when football no longer became "fun".

Auburn/'Bama is one level.  The "wannabes" that didn't get to 'Bama are now looking at Kennesaw State.  They are reaching for the brass ring there.  D-III is another level, and I think that it is a mind set that student-athletes can adopt.

That mind-set change in favor of D-III is what I want to promote.

[AF4]

"That mind-set change in favor of D-III is what I want to promote"
Ralph Turner- hero, great American

that is why i enjoy your posts.... that is why i love this d-3... i was a wanna-b at what is now a mediocre d-1cs school... it got me an education. (with por grammer and spelling)... but i too remember when it stopped being fun...

i started reading this site 2 yrs ago... cause the boy didn't want to wrestle anymore (the greatest sport in the world) and only wanted to play ball (which brought back memories of when it quit being fun)...reading all i could about d-3...as it was foreign... helped me and my bride (34yrs) steer the boy...

i am thankful he decided to do what he did.... if he was gonna play ball, that is.... and meeting mike turk (huntingdon's hc..didn't hurt)

of  the 2 non horse sex forums i read and occasionally talk.. heck of all the forums i am on...this is the best.... best (appearing) folks...and the games we went to this yr and the people we met (perhaps with the exception of faulkner-naia) just solidified that thought-belief... nice...real people

oh well... yall have a wonderful new yrs... i 'm gonna feed the mules, move some hay, kick back and get sick eating fried turkey and watching football for the next few days... uh ...and go of church of course

i won't pray that auburn wins... but i might that bama loses

keep the faith

[frank_ezelle]

Ralph asked, "Who seems to excite the Millsaps alumni?  Rhodes, Sewanee, Trinity?  Austin College, Centre, DePauw?"

Ralph, even if you had added Mississippi College to the list, the answer would unfortunately be "none of the above".  I'm on the SID's email list so I get Millsaps sports stories from that source, but I can't remember ever getting an alumni email from the school that passes along good news about athletics or promotes any sporting event other than Homecoming and maybe the football game with MC.  In my mind, it is an incredible lost opportunity by the school.

You might remember that I started a Millsaps sports email at this time last year.  It lasted about two months but ended when I could not get the Millsaps administration to send out a one-time announcement about the availability of a Millsaps sports email.  Since the alums were the target audience, it was pointless to continue without the support of the folks outside of the athletic department who could help me reach the alums.  I keep hoping that they will pick up the ball and do something on their own or give the athletic department more staff so they can do an official email, but I doubt that will happen any time soon.

Oh well, let me get off my soapbox and start working on photos from the women's basketball game this afternoon.  Happy New Year to everyone and thanks for all that all of you add to this message board.

Frank.

[tutiger]

Did anyone see the Pontiac Game Changing Performance commercial during the Alamo Bowl?  Talk about complete garbage.  You would not have even known the Trinity play was being considered.  It was the last play shown, was significantly abbreviated, and the explanation of the voting started before the Trinity play ended.  There wasn't any audio like there was for the other plays.  It was complete BS.  D3 gets screwed again.

[D3_DPUFan]

Did anyone see the Pontiac Game Changing Performance commercial during the Alamo Bowl?  Talk about complete garbage.  You would not have even known the Trinity play was being considered.  It was the last play shown, was significantly abbreviated, and the explanation of the voting started before the Trinity play ended.  There wasn't any audio like there was for the other plays.  It was complete BS.  D3 gets screwed again.

Yes, I did see that and actually it's been running that way all week. It is BS and I guess is evidence that the folks at Pontiac want one of the DI schools to get the award.   

[HunterT]

Been a long time since i've looked at this page, but i figured that there would be some chatter about the Pontiac Game Changing Performance nomination.

Yes D3 is getting screwed by the commercials, we can all agree with that. But it is still good that at least we're on there, can't fight that.

My concern is about the scholarship. IF Trinity was to win the award, there is a $100,000 scholarship gift to the winning school. What are the stipulations for the scholarship? If it's athletic, is a D3 school even eligible to win?

If TU does win, does the money go to the athletic program as a whole to be used for improvements? or does it go into a "leadership fund" (a.k.a. the secret athletic scholarship  )?

Just some thoughts of mine. I hope TU does win, I think it would be amazing to have a D3 school win, but to have one from the SCAC win would be great. And regardless it'll be good to see the team on tv during the championship game.

p.s. part of me does have to hope that they don't win. Because if TU gets all that money, how is Rhodes supposed to compete with that??? 

[Ron Boerger]

Pretty sure the money goes to the school's general scholarship fund.   Edit:  yes, according to the press release "Winning school receives $100,000 General Scholarship Contribution from Pontiac."

The commercial has been pretty sad and they have been running it for quite a while now.  Look at it from Pontiac's POV - if Trinity gets it they get little exposure as the number of TU fans/alumni is much smaller than the other three schools.  But yeah I figured all along that App State would be the winner.

Remember that you can vote weekly (and it turns over Saturday or Sunday each week) at http://www.pontiac.com/ncaa.  It also seems that cell phone votes (e.g. from your cell phone to the cell phone URL that someone posted earlier) aren't limited to weekly. 

p.s. part of me does have to hope that they don't win. Because if TU gets all that money, how is Rhodes supposed to compete with that??? 

Since Trinity's endowment is almost as large as the other three finalists combined, the only worry TU opponents should have would be if they won the money and used it to make the visitor "locker room" even worse ... 

[tusid]

I've debated making this post for a while, but I've decided to go ahead with it.  I know people are tired of hearing about the Trinity play, but I hope everyone gets out there and votes anyway.  This is the first time a DIII team has ever been in the running, and there's no guarantee that DIII will get another shot at this.  I have it on good authority that Trinity is in fact trailing in the voting, though the deficit is not insurmountable.  However, I don't think Trinity can win without the support of DIII fans/friends/family everywhere.  So go to the site and "Vote DIII" before the January 3 deadline.  I only plan on posting this here, but feel free to duplicate it on all the D3sports.com message boards you all think would be interested. 

Thanks,
TUSID