2011 Final Four

[BUBeaverFan]

Wooster has fan support that many DIII programs can only dream about.  Imagine how many Wooster fans would come to a final four game in Columbus.  Heck, I live in a town with a DIII school, with another about 12 miles away.  The paper that serves the area doesn't do either of those programs justice and they are almost the only shows in town.  There is one NAIA II school and one ORCC school who also don't merit much coverage.  High school sports are the name of the game for local media.  The Dispatch would cover a DIII Final Four very well, regardless of how they cover Cap, Ott, OWU,  or NAIA/NCAA II ODU, etc.  during the season. 

Wooster's local paper isn't on my must read list everyday, but I will say this.  They do a fairly good job of covering the COW and it's not just limited to football, basketball and baseball.  Although, those 3 sports get the majority of coverage, they also give coverage to minor sports as well.  I'm sure this factors in Wooster's large and loyal local fanbase.  That and owning the best win percentage in ALL of college basketball in the 2000's doesn't hurt either.   

Now, if only the Scots could add one of those nice walnut and bronze trophies to their trophy case... 

After this season I'll be back to just rooting for the Bluffton U Beavers.  They are about as far away from walnut and bronze as you get.  Regardless of how the Wash U ride ends this year it has been a fun four years.  It was great that even friends and family were able to hoist the trophies with the players as a part of the celebration. 

[therock]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

[Gregory Sager]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Hard to say, but remember that Calvin did host the D3 men's basketball Final Four throughout a good chunk of the 1980s.

[therock]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Hard to say, but remember that Calvin did host the D3 men's basketball Final Four throughout a good chunk of the 1980s.

Which reemphasizes the point - they don't have experienced support over there. Hosting in the 1980's would be completely different than hosting it now.

[Gregory Sager]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Hard to say, but remember that Calvin did host the D3 men's basketball Final Four throughout a good chunk of the 1980s.

Which reemphasizes the point - they don't have experienced support over there. Hosting in the 1980's would be completely different than hosting it now.

Why?

[David Collinge]

Which reemphasizes the point - they don't have experienced support over there. Hosting in the 1980's would be completely different than hosting it now.

Why?

Probably no Potsdam State or North Park; Russians are our allies now (sorta); women have smaller hairstyles; Joanie Loves Chachi off the air...need I go on?

[HopeConvert]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Really? "Experienced support?" That's the argument? The good people in Salem figured it out in short order; I suspect Grand Rapidians could do the same.

[KnightSlappy]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Really? "Experienced support?" That's the argument? The good people in Salem figured it out in short order; I suspect Grand Rapidians could do the same.

I know it's not the Final Four, but Calvin is used to big games and big events. Last year's MIAA tournament final drew 4,100 to the Van Noord Arena, and they're used to at least one game a year with 4,500+ fans and media members for the annual rivalry game with Hope.

I know there's more to the Final Four than just bigger crowds, but Calvin does have experience in that department.

[HopeConvert]

I have only been to Salem once, and when I went I never investigated Roanoke, so I am willing to recant my earlier judgment about places to dine and sleep. Clearly I made the judgment without sufficient information and have since been appropriately corrected. And I did like Mac N Bob's, and the people in the area were very friendly.

That said, I stand by my judgments concerning the Civic Center itself and Salem's inaccessibility. Bob, I'm curious as to why you say you don't have any solutions for the centrality and accessibility issue and why we have to just suck it up and accept Salem. It seems to me that Calvin is a perfect solution. It's centrally located, big enough to hold any number of fans who would want to come, but intimate enough for a smaller crowd, very near a large airport, has a fan base that would show up even if local teams weren't in the game (I know I would go no matter who was playing), has excellent facilities, has a large number of hotels and restaurants within a 5 minute drive - I just don't see the downside. I'm not saying it's the only place possible, but it's hard for me to imagine a better one and I can't see why posters on this board aren't jumping at it.

If you're worried about Calvin potentially having a homecourt advantage, no need to worry as I don't see them representing the MIAA any time soon.  

Downside = experienced support. I highly doubt Calvin will be able to compete with the level of experienced support (and free man hours at that in the case for many of those folks) offered by the ODAC schools, the ODAC office, and the Rotary Club. How many people in and around Calvin have the multiple years of experience supporting a final four that is as big as the men's basketball Final Four?

Really? "Experienced support?" That's the argument? The good people in Salem figured it out in short order; I suspect Grand Rapidians could do the same.

I know it's not the Final Four, but Calvin is used to big games and big events. Last year's MIAA tournament final drew 4,100 to the Van Noord Arena, and they're used to at least one game a year with 4,500+ fans and media members for the annual rivalry game with Hope.

I know there's more to the Final Four than just bigger crowds, but Calvin does have experience in that department.

It's bigger than the Final Four? 

In all seriousness, if I were given my choice between sweeping Calvin and not winning the NCAA Tournament, or being swept by Calvin and winning the NCAA Tournament, that would be a tough call. In truth, I'd probably opt for the former.

[WUPHF]

In all seriousness, if I were given my choice between sweeping Calvin and not winning the NCAA Tournament, or being swept by Calvin and winning the NCAA Tournament, that would be a tough call. In truth, I'd probably opt for the former.

OK, OK, I have to ask, when you say in all seriousness, you are being serious right?  Do you think a lot of other Hope fans would agree?

I love rivalries.  And, I have been following the Missouri/Kansas rivalry my entire life, one of the oldest rivalries in Division I, and while taking down Kansas is the biggest thing, in part because we know we will not win the national title, I would have to think that most Mizzou fans would prefer the national title.

[Pat Coleman]

I have to admit that it doesn't make a lot of sense to me either, but I've given up trying to make sense of the emotion around Wabash-DePauw football or Hope-Calvin basketball.

I will tell you flat out -- I have no idea whether Catholic split with Goucher or swept them in 2001. All I remember is that we have a banner hanging in the DuFour Center and a Walnut and Bronze in the trophy case.

[KnightSlappy]

I think many Hope fans force themselves to believe a similar sentiment.  It's like a coping mechanism or something.

I would most certainly rather get our tails whipped twice by the ugly Dutchmen and then rebound to win the NCAA Championship if given the choice to do so. I'd pick this every year.

[WUPHF]

I should add that the +4500 plus for a small school rivalry game blows my mind. 

It is easy to keep a rivalry going when you graduate +4500 fans each year like Missouri and Kansas, but for two very small schools, it is impressive to say the least.

[ChicagoHopeNut]

I think many Hope fans force themselves to believe a similar sentiment.  It's like a coping mechanism or something.

I would most certainly rather get our tails whipped twice by the ugly Dutchmen and then rebound to win the NCAA Championship if given the choice to do so. I'd pick this every year.

Ugly Dutchmen? Ouch! Although as I recall VanNoord is rather Dutch, haha.

I agree with KnightSlappy in that I would happily lose to Calvin if it meant winning the NCAA Championship (although I would prefer both!).

While I wouldn't want to dare dive to deeply into the mind of HopeConvert. I might hypothesize the reason he may pick a different option is revealed in his name.

[KnightSlappy]

I think many Hope fans force themselves to believe a similar sentiment.  It's like a coping mechanism or something.

I would most certainly rather get our tails whipped twice by the ugly Dutchmen and then rebound to win the NCAA Championship if given the choice to do so. I'd pick this every year.

Ugly Dutchmen? Ouch! Although as I recall VanNoord is rather Dutch, haha.

I agree with KnightSlappy in that I would happily lose to Calvin if it meant winning the NCAA Championship (although I would prefer both!).

While I wouldn't want to dare dive to deeply into the mind of HopeConvert. I might hypothesize the reason he may pick a different option is revealed in his name.

I meant it more in nickname, not heritage. As you point out, Calvin's every bit as dutch (heritage) as Hope is.