2011 Final Four

[dalmavs03]

It's likely he played a little bit better when he was averaging 17.3 points in the first four NCAA Tournament games.

hahaha...it always amazes me when people make such assessments based on a weekend. the big guy was a huge reason why they were there.

I'll be the first to tell you, other than this past weekend, I don't know anything about any of the four teams.  I was making an observation about #41.  He's their "big man" and he played anything but that.  I'm not talking he had an off game.  I'm saying he plays light, like a little man, who's afraid to throw his body around and fight for some boards, go up strong and actually challenge the other team.  Aside from getting a lucky block, probably because he's so large, I didn't see anything all that great.  I'm not ripping the guy.  Obviously he had to be some kind of a great basketball player at some point in his life or else he wouldn't have gotten where he was.  It just seems like for some reason he's playing scared.  I'm not against this guy or the team.  I'm from PA and although I wasn't cheering for UC, I wasn't against them either.  I just wanted to see some great games, which I did! 

[ac08]

I don't think it's fair to cite fear as the reason for his lethargy. Sure he was only good very close to the basket, but he got there pretty much whenever he wanted. And while I agree that his rebounding skill is devoid of any sense of urgency, I think that's more of a product of his size.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Sure he was only good very close to the basket, but he got there pretty much whenever he wanted.

I don't agree - or maybe he just didn't want to get close to the basket very often

[sac]

I wondered aloud at the games Friday if Shema had ever matched up with a  big man like Amherst's legit 6-10 Kevin Hopkins.   I started to look around the Centennial Conference and could only find a couple 6-8 kids but the rosters say nothing of bulk.

He did look unsure of himself, and couldn't move as well as Amherst's more athletic players.  His foul trouble both games was largely do to his poor movement, and really shyed away from physical contact.  He had a significant height advantage vs Hope and fouled out in just 13 minutes with 8 points and 3 rebounds.

[La Verdad]

Sure he was only good very close to the basket, but he got there pretty much whenever he wanted.

I don't agree - or maybe he just didn't want to get close to the basket very often

That may have been the case.  Every amherst big that I spoke with told me there was no way to stop him from getting position.  That being said, he didn't show much besides size and a surprisingly soft touch.  No scoring ego, not much in the way of post moves, no speed or quickness at all (at least compared to the amherst bigs); at one point vs the jeffs he had the ball on the baseline about 8 or 10 ft out and the only person between him and the basket was Olson...he didn't even look at the hoop.

[Greek Tragedy]

Just merged with last year's...

[Greek Tragedy]

Looks like a pretty solid Final Four.  We have Washington U coming out of the Bracket of Death here to defend it's National Championship.  Guilford, though their first Final Four (?), comes in from the powerful ODAC.  Franklin & Marshall represents the Centennial and Richard Stockton from the usually tough NJAC.  Who's the biggest surprise?

I would probably have to say Guilford.  Both F&M and RS hosted both weekends while Guilford had to play three neutral court games and an away game to get to Salem.

Of course a good argument can be made for Washington U going through the Bracket of Death with wins by 2, 3, 3, and 15.  But, they are the defending champions!

[Titan Q]

A history of the D3hoops.com Top 25 poll and Final Four results...

(Using the second to last poll each season - the one in place at the start of the tournament, and at the time the Final Four games were played.)

2008
#11 Wash U beat #1 Hope
#3 Amherst beat #16 Ursinus

#1 Hope beat #16 Ursinus
#11 Wash U beat #3 Amherst

(poll: 2-2)

2007
#4 Virginia Wesleyan beat #8 Wash U
#6 Amherst beat #2 Wooster

#8 Wash U beat #2 Wooster)
#6 Amherst beat #4 Virginia Wesleyan

(poll: 1-3)

2006
#7 Virginia Wesleyan beat #11 Illinois Wesleyan
#3 Wittenberg beat #4 Amherst

#11 Illinois Wesleyan beat # 4 Amherst
#7 Virginia Wesleyan beat #3 Wittenberg

(poll: 2-2)

2005
#21 Rochester beat #14 Calvin
#1 UW-Stevens beat beat #19 York (Pa.)

#14 Calvin beat #19 York
#1 UW-Stevens Point beat #21 Rochester

(poll: 3-1)

2004
#1 Williams beat #5 Amherst
#10 UW-Stevens Point beat #13 John Carroll

#13 John Carroll beat #5 Amherst
#10 UW-Stevens Point beat #1 Williams

(poll: 2-2)

2003
#3 Williams beat #6 Wooster
#24 Gustavus Adolphus beat #4 Hampden-Sydney

#6 Wooster beat #4 Hampden-Sydney
#3 Williams beat #24 Gustavus Adolphus

(poll: 2-2)

2002
#6 Otterbein beat #1 Carthage
#4 Elizabethtown beat #18 Rochester

#1 Carthage beat #18 Rochester
#6 Otterbein beat #4 Elizabethtown

(poll: 2-2)

2001
#14 Catholic beat #3 Ohio Northern
#11 William Paterson beat #17 Illinois Wesleyan

#17 Illinois Wesleyan beat #3 Ohio Northern
#14 Catholic beat #11 William Paterson

(poll: 1-3)

2000
#15 UW-Eau Claire beat #21 Salem State
#1 Calvin beat #19 Franklin & Marshall

#21 Salem State beat #19 Franklin & Marshall
#1 Calvin beat #15 UW-Eau Claire

(poll: 3-1)


Since its inception in 1999-00, the poll is an even 50% at the Final Four, 18-18.

This weekend:

#2 Wash U vs #23 Guilford
#6 Richard Stockton vs (RV) Franklin & Marshall


* F&M becomes the first unranked team to play in the Final Four.

[Pat Coleman]

How does it go if you eliminate the third-place game?

[Titan Q]

How does it go if you eliminate the third-place game?

Excluding the 3rd place game, the poll is 15-12 (.556).  The breakdown by round is:

National semifinals: 12-6
National consolation: 3-6
National championship: 3-6


Note that the poll in place at the time of the Final Four is done before any tournament games take place.  If a poll was released before the Final Four, it would probably look a lot different than the post-Selection Sunday poll.  (The poll in place at the time of the Final Four does not factor in 4 rounds of the NCAA tournament and all of those key games between ranked teams.)

Nonetheless, it is interesting.  Anything can happen in Salem.

[r.w. mcnickels]

Who's the biggest surprise?

I would probably have to say Guilford.  Both F&M and RS hosted both weekends while Guilford had to play three neutral court games and an away game to get to Salem.

Guilford's road warriors have probably had the most surprising tourney run, but I think F&M's season as a whole has also been incredibly surprising.  Coming off three awful campaigns, the Dips were picked to finish 5th in the CC preseason poll.  I really thought 16-17 wins would be a good year because they're loaded with underclassmen (including a freshman point guard).  It'll be interesting to see how they perform on the big stage.

[hasanova]

Who's the biggest surprise?

I would probably have to say Guilford.  Both F&M and RS hosted both weekends while Guilford had to play three neutral court games and an away game to get to Salem.

Guilford's road warriors have probably had the most surprising tourney run, but I think F&M's season as a whole has also been incredibly surprising.  Coming off three awful campaigns, the Dips were picked to finish 5th in the CC preseason poll.  I really thought 16-17 wins would be a good year because they're loaded with underclassmen (including a freshman point guard).  It'll be interesting to see how they perform on the big stage.

I think you're right about both schools.  Guilford was picked to finish 3rd this year in the 11 team ODAC ... behind Randolph-Macon and Virginia Wesleyan. 

[sac]

If you survive a bracket of death, is it really a bracket of death?

[Mr. Ypsi]

If you survive a bracket of death, is it really a bracket of death?

Well ... for everyone else!

[Even the NCAA d3 men's committee hasn't yet designed a bracket where NO one emerges! ]

[PurpleReign]

The Final Four in D3 this year was very competitive and lived up to it's billing.  This next set of games is like an afterthought and is about as interesting as "watching grass grow."  The D3 national championship has already been decided and don't understand why Washington U has to play these next two games.