East Region Playoff Discussion

[JT]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Well stated. +K The same goes for White-Water, MHB, Wesley and others. Open the rosters to over 100 and things may change. Rowan did very well plus Fisher, Cortland and Hobart did well, but not the staying power of Rowan. What happened to you guys this year?

Rowan doesn't have close to the resources a Mount Union has.  As a private school, they can pretty much do what they want.

The problem with Rowan... they are trying to figure out recruiting and keeping the four year kid and remain nationally viable.  Can't run the spread w/o receivers that can separate/or run great routes against good secondaries, and you must have a very good QB.

Defense is very fast but light up front... if the offense can't move the ball, they are toast by the 4th qtr.

QB was good enough... receivers were talented but young, leaving the defense vulnerable.

The past few years Accorsi had some talented Freshman that couldn't handle the school work or team discipline.  I think the core of the team is very good, but a couple of consistent skill players away from challenging deep in the playoffs.  We also need more beef on the d-line.

[Jonny Utah]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Well stated. +K The same goes for White-Water, MHB, Wesley and others. Open the rosters to over 100 and things may change. Rowan did very well plus Fisher, Cortland and Hobart did well, but not the staying power of Rowan. What happened to you guys this year?

Rowan doesn't have close to the resources a Mount Union has.  As a private school, they can pretty much do what they want.

The problem with Rowan... they are trying to figure out recruiting and keeping the four year kid and remain nationally viable.  Can't run the spread w/o receivers that can separate/or run great routes against good secondaries, and you must have a very good QB.

Defense is very fast but light up front... if the offense can't move the ball, they are toast by the 4th qtr.

QB was good enough... receivers were talented but young, leaving the defense vulnerable.

The past few years Accorsi had some talented Freshman that couldn't handle the school work or team discipline.  I think the core of the team is very good, but a couple of consistent skill players away from challenging deep in the playoffs.  We also need more beef on the d-line.

JT the Wisconsin Schools seem to do a good job with d3 football.  Of course NJ and NY do a lot better than MA does too.

And Mt. Unions facilities are not that impressive.

[JT]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Well stated. +K The same goes for White-Water, MHB, Wesley and others. Open the rosters to over 100 and things may change. Rowan did very well plus Fisher, Cortland and Hobart did well, but not the staying power of Rowan. What happened to you guys this year?

Rowan doesn't have close to the resources a Mount Union has.  As a private school, they can pretty much do what they want.

The problem with Rowan... they are trying to figure out recruiting and keeping the four year kid and remain nationally viable.  Can't run the spread w/o receivers that can separate/or run great routes against good secondaries, and you must have a very good QB.

Defense is very fast but light up front... if the offense can't move the ball, they are toast by the 4th qtr.

QB was good enough... receivers were talented but young, leaving the defense vulnerable.

The past few years Accorsi had some talented Freshman that couldn't handle the school work or team discipline.  I think the core of the team is very good, but a couple of consistent skill players away from challenging deep in the playoffs.  We also need more beef on the d-line.

JT the Wisconsin Schools seem to do a good job with d3 football.  Of course NJ and NY do a lot better than MA does too.

And Mt. Unions facilities are not that impressive.

The field has been around since 1917, but that ain't the program.  They have all the modern scouting and film study tools.  That was what I'm talking about.  Then you make it cheaper than a state school education, while having a great head coach that is the AD... and I'd call that a formula.

How many Ithaca football players are paying under 15K per year for school?

[Jonny Utah]

I dont know what Ithaca football players pay to go to Ithaca.  Do you know what Mt. Union players pay to go there?

Film and scouting tools are important, but film is film, and a lot of good d3 football programs have grad assistants that break it down on film however the head coaches want it.  Mt. Union is going to have 2 camera angles like any other good d3 program is going to have.  Unless you know something I don't.

The facilities I was talking about was the football offices, weight room etc.  I took a quick tour of Mt. Union when I was there and I didnt see anything out of the ordinary.  Im sure they blow Buff States facilities out of the water, but they dont have what Cortland, SJF, Union or RPI has thats for sure.

[Pat Coleman]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Uhm, I think you forgot 10 national championships. That feeds on itself.

I don't know what the discount rate is at Mount Union or how to find it, but as always, students loans have to be paid back. This I know.

MTU has an indoor facility, JU, that is better than anything I've seen in D-III.

[Yanks 99]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Uhm, I think you forgot 10 national championships. That feeds on itself.

I don't know what the discount rate is at Mount Union or how to find it, but as always, students loans have to be paid back. This I know.

MTU has an indoor facility, JU, that is better than anything I've seen in D-III.

The National Championships definitely help...and so does the indoor facility.

Student loans have to be paid back...but "found" grants for certain students are helpful, and can sway a family/athlete towards a school.

[Jonny Utah]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Uhm, I think you forgot 10 national championships. That feeds on itself.

I don't know what the discount rate is at Mount Union or how to find it, but as always, students loans have to be paid back. This I know.

MTU has an indoor facility, JU, that is better than anything I've seen in D-III.

I didn't see that.  A turf field?  

I kind of snuck around the buildings there and saw a good size weight room but no field house

[JT]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount. 

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago. 

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Very well said tecmo, +k

After yesterdays results dlip is felling very frustrated with the "level" of play in the east here in 09. You make a great point that many of us have been around and thought, at one point, we were getting closer. Yet this year it seems very obvious to dlip that we as a region are just not there. dlip thinks the way you put it in your post makes perfect sense and is a respectful way to describe how many of us feel. dlip does not want to sit here and hammer the east for what good will it do? Yet, when looking in the mirror, we see Del Val, who is probably now our top team, who we already know could not hang with Wesley. Yes dlip knows Del Val has improved, but ****, so has Wesley. Let's just ****in hope the level of football grows in 10' and works it way a bit closer to the national stage.

dlippiel,

First with D 3 football we don't have the luxury of injury reports and accurate information on whose playing and even the stats are not 100% accurate. That being said, it creates a difficult environment to pick games winners. (It is also why D3 is a great take on any given day anything can happen)

Union beats Ithaca both teams at full strength early in the season, Ithaca loses to Springfield 5 starters out both defensive ends (93 & 95 DNP) vs. a rush orient team.  Merchant Marine beats Susquehanna (QB Palazzi does not play) Union losses to Muhlenberg after the game it was determined Connolly QB had a mild concussion.  Ithaca beats Alfred (93 & 95) play 8 tackles, 4 TFL and 1 sack, how do you measure the impact of the non-skill position with factors that don't show up on the stat sheet. For example the IC DE maybe drew 2 or 3 holding penalties that – 30 yards and can kill drives. That what makes this so hard to predict and why they play the games.

As for MT Union consistency, they have more depth than most D3 school I understand they have 100 on a freshman team, a JV squad and 100+ on the varsity unit. How are their academic standards vs. all the other programs? In my opinion it's not apples to apples, it's like a D1 non scholarship program trying to beat a BCS program, they don't have the same resources and guidelines.

1) Roughly 20% of the men at Mount Union are football players. 

2) The average financial aid packages brings the tuition cost down under your average DIII State school in NJ.

3) Great head coach who's also the AD

4) All the modern technical bells and whistles.

Pretty much a formula for success.  No?

Uhm, I think you forgot 10 national championships. That feeds on itself.

I don't know what the discount rate is at Mount Union or how to find it, but as always, students loans have to be paid back. This I know.

MTU has an indoor facility, JU, that is better than anything I've seen in D-III.

Obviously the 10 titles... which has incubated a more favorable atmosphere.  Much of this aid does not have to be paid back.

I'm just pointing out the "MOUNTain" opponents have to climb.  I've always been a David vs. Goliath kind of guy anyway.  I'm just not going to pretend that the they are some little school making good. It is a powerhouse dynasty... the aw shucks PR doesn't fly anymore.  

Kehres is the nicest, most straight up guy you'll meet, but he's created the gift that keeps and giving as long as he's there.  I think his son is few fries short of a happy meal. Mount is Mount as long as Larry is still calling the shots.

[JT]

I dont know what Ithaca football players pay to go to Ithaca.  Do you know what Mt. Union players pay to go there?

Film and scouting tools are important, but film is film, and a lot of good d3 football programs have grad assistants that break it down on film however the head coaches want it.  Mt. Union is going to have 2 camera angles like any other good d3 program is going to have.  Unless you know something I don't.

The facilities I was talking about was the football offices, weight room etc.  I took a quick tour of Mt. Union when I was there and I didnt see anything out of the ordinary.  Im sure they blow Buff States facilities out of the water, but they dont have what Cortland, SJF, Union or RPI has thats for sure.

He's got NFL style robotic cameras operated by joystick from the pressbox.

[maxpower]

JT... don't really see how you come fresh off defending the Yankees to insinuating that Mount has an unfair advantage....

[JT]

JT... don't really see how you come fresh off defending the Yankees to insinuating that Mount has an unfair advantage....

Never mentioned unfair anywhere in my posts.  I'm just telling it like is.  They don't break any rules, and most graduate. Mount does have an advantage, but you'll get the occasional special club that comes along and beats them.

I respect them, put them No. #1 on my ballot, but would like to see two teams in this year's Stagg Bowl that aren't from Alliance Ohio. 

[SJFF82]

I think most that most here know that very few teams over the past ten years could hang with Mount Union.  I understand the idea behind pointing out the sillyness of posters lamenting over a season that will inevitably end to Mount, when in the past, our years have.... ended to Mount.

With that said, I think a lot of the frustration in here boils down to the level of football being played.  Most on here have been around long enough to compare the current level of play to a good number of years.  Just off the top of my head, it's clear that teams such as Ithaca, Cortland, RPI, Hobart, Union, Fisher, Springfield, Brockport, Rowan... are down significantly compared to teams not too many years ago.

While the past and current teams may still all add up to losses to Mount, there's something to be said for quality football being played.  It's fun to watch your school have playmakers on offense and defense, have an explosive offense, a shutdown defense, an incredible wideout, a QB that can make all the throws.. and there just hasn't been too much of that this.  There's a certain level of disappointment as I believe many around here just a short time ago, including myself, thought a number of teams out of the East were just about ready to compete on the national level.  Five or six years later, we seem a very long way from that..

Well said and I respect that point of view.  

But I'd offer a couple counter points.  The teams you mentioned may be having down years but others - Alfred, Del Val, Kean, Leb Val - are not.  They are in the East and, though they may not have as many message board posters or as rich a history as some others you mention, there's plenty of good story lines there.  The MAC has a chance to have wins against champions of the Centennial (JHU), ODAC (Randolph Macon), Liberty League (Susquehanna), NJAC (Montclair or Kean) and NEFC (Curry).  So maybe for one year the power has just shifted to a different part of the region.

I do agree that there are no power teams in the East and view the playoffs as pretty wide open.  I think there is more parity within conferences that makes for more interesting seasons and lowers the likelihood of one team or two teams dominating the landscape.

I also agree that the East teams are a long way from beating the national powers, if we limit that group to Mary Hardin-Baylor, Mount Union and Whitewater.  But I think the same could be said for most teams in most regions with the exceptions of a few that have a lot of history to draw upon come recruiting time (St. John's, Linfield).

Dew Crew is the only poster looking for a "story line",and I suspect he was just joking/lamenting...Everyone else is looking for good high quality football in the East, not story lines.

[SJFF82]

Gordon,

  Your bringing a little sanity to the discussion, which is great, but I would suggest that the problem lies in the lack of notable wins for the best teams in the region.  Right now, DelVal looks like the best team in the region and has beaten a couple of teams of note (JHU, Kean), but did lose convincingly to #5 Wesley suggesting that the top of the East's "ceiling" this year is somewhere between #10 and #20 and after that, I'm not sure a #2 is the the top 25 or so in the country.  It's not so much that the top East team can't compete with UMHB/MUC/UWW, but I'm not sure they can compete with SJU, Linfield, OAC #2 (ONU I guess, maybe Capital), top 2 in CCIW, etc.  (that group that would be #4 - say #12) that's frustrating for me personally.   

  That doesn't mean there aren't a number of fascinating stories in the East, just that we all have to dig a little deeper and consider different goals for the teams in the region.  I have no doubt that Dew's comment was a throw away one in disgust with the fact that the two undefeated teams which held the most promise on the national landscape (other than DelVal, who had the top 5 loss) got taken out to the woodshed yesterday.  I'm still interested in what happens every week across the region and check out all the scores and box scores.  The ECAC's will be interesting this year for sure. 

oops....you already said it...and better  +k when I get it....back

[dewcrew88]

Maybe my column this week will be how bad the east has freakin gacked it this year. Jesus Christ.

I suspect this is a throwaway line but if you are really hard up for story ideas, look at Springfield or Delaware Valley.

didn't think it would cause such a problem   but yes, this was a throwaway line. Sorry nobody got the sarcasm.

[Yanks 99]

I have to ask...with Mount Union almost certainly on its way over to the East...who is going to grab the pool C's...or will we only have one Pool C like last year when they brought in Randolph-Macon (complete joke that they did this) and Mount Union?