FB: Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference

[Adam Sayer]

More cushion...better the pushin! And There ain't nothing wrong with "Good Breeding Material."

[altor]

Altor, you are the eternal optimist.

I cut most of the quote because I don't disagree with it.  DC football has been mediocre for the past several years and I can't honestly say that I see that changing in the immediate future.

However, If I'm the eternal optimist, then you, sir, are the eternal pessimist.  4-6, 5-5, 7-3, 6-4.  These are not records of "an ugly sister of the HCAC."  As you said, they are middle of the pack.  Even the current mark of 1-3 is hardly the end of the world when you put it in the perspective of who they've played.  It takes very little optimism and a broader view of the conference and D-III as a whole to realize that by the end of the season, they will pick up a couple more wins and continue this string of mediocrity.

If you want to decry the mediocrity, I have no problem with that.  But sometimes, y'all make it sound like this is the worst football team in the world, which is not the case.

[cave2bens]

Altor, you are the eternal optimist.

I cut most of the quote because I don't disagree with it.  DC football has been mediocre for the past several years and I can't honestly say that I see that changing in the immediate future.

However, If I'm the eternal optimist, then you, sir, are the eternal pessimist.  4-6, 5-5, 7-3, 6-4.  These are not records of "an ugly sister of the HCAC."  As you said, they are middle of the pack.  Even the current mark of 1-3 is hardly the end of the world when you put it in the perspective of who they've played.  It takes very little optimism and a broader view of the conference and D-III as a whole to realize that by the end of the season, they will pick up a couple more wins and continue this string of mediocrity.

If you want to decry the mediocrity, I have no problem with that.  But sometimes, y'all make it sound like this is the worst football team in the world, which is not the case.

As there was a switch from the singular to the "southern plural" and no mention of crossing the Maumee in a single-masted vessel (yawl), I agree with your take on this, Altor.  There are eerie similarities to the "Hope"ful conundrum up in the MIAA, and your point is well-taken.  It depends on which ManU shows this weekend, whether RHIT and Hanover are for real or short-term adrenal boluses, the Ravens have had their primaries clipped, and GOK what's up with the Beavers come November.   DC could end up +/- .500.

As to new direction, addressed by 70_DC with an incoming administration, it's a "see if there's more than rhetoric" to Dr. Gordon.  I sincerely hope there is - we entertained Wood (and his ex-), in our Atlanta living room, who extolled the same virtuous verbiage during his pre-inaugeral tour regarding recruitment, "one trick pony" endowments, and desire to re-elevate academics.  Six years later?  ummm, ummm, ummm.  

The saving grace is that DC is certainly not the worst team in DIII - I fear that an old, campus friend of ours, Bob Head (DC'76) is blessed with that distinction at Rockford.  

Had to edit - I hate being old and fingers failing to react as quickly as an already feeble mind. 

[Jackets Backer]

I think the new Prez will be really good for the DC athletics he seems to really like sports (2youbg sons who love football helps). We all know support from the top is required to be good (I think Hanover would agree). DC has not had a prez that supported FB and sports in general since Harris left in the 90's. Unfortunately there is several years of bad support that needs to overcome. In the good years we used to have a solid core from Florida (lots of speed, some large cubans to block, and an occasional nose tackle with a shy non opionated pops with killer fish tacos). Last several years the admin would not even allow them to recruit south of Ohio. I don't think there is anyone on the roster south of Lima. New prez has already been reaching out to alums and committed to bringing in students for various states including those DC never considered.

I'll take a wait and see approach on this one. New Prez has never been around athletics before. I've heard he's trying to reach out to the athletic programs and I know he's supporting athletics more maybe than has been done in the past but there are lots of hurdles standing in the way of that happening. How many years have we heard about a fieldhouse getting done at DC. As long as I can remember and the chances of that happening are slim to none and slim walked out the door this summer with a big opportunity DC had.

Financial aid is a huge problem at DC, it's hard to recruit against the Ohio Northerns, Adrians, Trines and even Blufftons. It's all about recruiting at the college level. Add in the fact that those schools have facilities that put DC's to shame and it's  hard to bring a kid to DC when he has offers from the others.

As long as the athletic programs have strong numbers,  DC doesn't worry about the wins and losses. Until that attitude changes, middle of the road or mediocre is what you're consistently going to get.

[Adam Sayer]

I think the common cry for the DC folks is a sense of being close enough to sniff the pie, but not getting a chance to savor the flavor. DC had their chances in the past to be better than what they were and now that "time period" seems to be fading. The HCAC isn't a good conference at all this year and DC has a chance to flirt with .500, however, that may not be indicative of where the program is heading.

[dc_has_been]

I'm with Jackets Backer, wait & see approach.  In regards to the Prez, I hope he really does support the program b/c football can bring in a lot of money for a school  Especially when the team can equal 1/10th of the student body & money they can bring in with games, fundraising, & so on. 
Hopefully they start reaching out to the guys from the south again.  That not only brings in some size, speed & skill, but alos gives them a chance to play football past high school & to get an education too.  I've even offered to help recruit out west before.

[Jackets Backer]

I'm with Jackets Backer, wait & see approach.  In regards to the Prez, I hope he really does support the program b/c football can bring in a lot of money for a school  Especially when the team can equal 1/10th of the student body & money they can bring in with games, fundraising, & so on. 
Hopefully they start reaching out to the guys from the south again.  That not only brings in some size, speed & skill, but alos gives them a chance to play football past high school & to get an education too.  I've even offered to help recruit out west before.

I don't think the south is recruited much if at all in recent years by DC. Coach P recruited the heck out of Florida and brought some great southern talent to DC but times have changed. I don't know but maybe the budget keeps DC to the tri-state area in regards to recruiting and out of Jacket Fans' backyard.

The thing is, men's basketball has brought in some big-time talent. The current coach and previous one knew how to recruit and don't seem to have trouble bringing in championship caliber talent and have built the program into a contender every year for the last four or five years. They've even brought in kids from the Chicago area the last few years and Cleveland and Columbus kids. They know how to sell the program (one that has not great facilities) and are reaping the rewards. The HCAC is a 100 times more competitive in mens basketball than it is in football and HCAC mens basketball is actually highly-regarded on a national scale.

Basketball is a bit different than football in the fact that one or two guys can make a big difference ... it takes many times that number in football to contend at a high level.

Sure there are hurdles in regards to bringing in the type of talent that makes you challenge for a conference title consistently at DC, but it's happened before here. If you're determined enough to be a winner, that's exactly what you'll be.
Right now there's not a lot of big-time talent like the football program had in the past with the Kris Zajacs, Mike Haydons, Richard Palmers, Josh Staggs, Chris Tietjes, Luke Dillons and others I'm leaving out. That group had a little swagger to them on the field and the Jackets have lost that swagger the last couple of years.

[altor]

The HCAC is a 100 times more competitive in mens basketball than it is in football and HCAC mens basketball is actually highly-regarded on a national scale.

What makes you think this?  When was the last time the HCAC got two teams in the basketball tournament?  Who was the last HCAC team to host a game in the basketball tournament?

[Jackets Backer]

The HCAC is a 100 times more competitive in mens basketball than it is in football and HCAC mens basketball is actually highly-regarded on a national scale.

What makes you think this?  When was the last time the HCAC got two teams in the basketball tournament?  Who was the last HCAC team to host a game in the basketball tournament?

I don't know when or if they've had two teams in the tourney but they've been competitive and had success in the tourney. Transy hosted not too long ago (2005?) and went to the Elite 8 and one of their best players didn't play that year. I believe Manchester went to the Final Four when Steve Alford was coaching there. Hanover's had teams in the Sweet 16. The HCAC hasn't had much success in the playoffs in football over the years except for a couple times, but Franklin changed that last year. I'm just saying that the HCAC has been a lot more competitive on a national scale in basketball and had  success in the postseason.

[altor]

I'd forgotten about Transy in 2006.  Hanover hosted a first-round game in 2005 when there were only 48 teams and went to the sweet sixteen.  Hanover hosted a second-round game in 2004 after going 26-1 and earning the bye and lost.

I guess when I look at the media coverage and fans talking, I don't see any difference for the HCAC between basketball and football.  The conference is not the bottom of the barrel, but they are hardly a powerhouse either.

[SaintsFAN]

Sayer,


I'm headed North early on Saturday morning to see Hallett vs. Dean Paul (Heidelberg vs. ONU).... Reality Check has some kind of special redcarpet treatment set up for us --- I'm sure its impressive since ONU is NOT commuter school like MSJ is... If you are off on Saturday (or want to quit), look me up and you can ride up with us. 

I think we're gonna meet in Dayton (he has Homecoming/reunion at CJ on Saturday night) and roll up while telling "Your HS team sucks" jokes...

[Adam Sayer]

Our game this week is on Saturday....I've suffered through an 0-10 season...a little 1-6 isn't going to stop me

[SaintsFAN]

Our game this week is on Saturday....I've suffered through an 0-10 season...a little 1-6 isn't going to stop me

I'd call in "dead" as the coach of that team...

[altor]

I'll take a wait and see approach on this one. New Prez has never been around athletics before. I've heard he's trying to reach out to the athletic programs and I know he's supporting athletics more maybe than has been done in the past but there are lots of hurdles standing in the way of that happening.

In his inaugural address yesterday, President Gordon touched only briefly on athletics.  He was very positive about the role athletics play in the lives and educations of our young adults.

I also must say that he was the first DC president of the three I've known to make an appearance at a home cross country meet.

[dc_has_been]

I'll take a wait and see approach on this one. New Prez has never been around athletics before. I've heard he's trying to reach out to the athletic programs and I know he's supporting athletics more maybe than has been done in the past but there are lots of hurdles standing in the way of that happening.

In his inaugural address yesterday, President Gordon touched only briefly on athletics.  He was very positive about the role athletics play in the lives and educations of our young adults.

I also must say that he was the first DC president of the three I've known to make an appearance at a home cross country meet.

DC has a cross country team?