BB: SUNYAC

StarvinMarvin · September 10, 2010, 12:30:46 AM

To be honest, I really couldn't care less...hope things work out for all involved. However, I simply don't like to see the Cortland program portrayed negatively in this whole scenario. Not every program is well-suited for every kid and that's reality. My question is, how do you stay somewhere for three years if you're being done so wrong? All of a sudden this isn't the place for you? I hear that the kid did the same thing in high school...transferred from one high school to another for his senior year due to conflict with the head coach. I don't know the young man personally but what lesson is learned from running away when the going gets tough? Shoes like that are NOT tough to fill in my opinion. The real shoes that are tough to fill are the Gardner's and Nickel's of the world who are as much men as they are great baseball players. The leadership they exhibit is what allows the Simone's of the world to thrive without needing to be held accountable behind the scenes. Numbers don't mean squat...a player can easily do as much harm to team dynamics as good when it comes to statistics. However, these are things that cannot be measured and everyone simply looks at numbers and bases their value to the team on that. Bottom line is that program doesn't normally lose kids and in fact, I challenge anyone to find me the name of the last TALENTED transfer out of Cortland within the last 15 years. In my opinion, this should tell anyone outside of the program itself a little bit about the truth of the matter. As a parent, I don't enjoy bashing kids per say but the entitlement factoe does bother me tremendously.

StarvinMarvin · September 10, 2010, 12:33:57 AM

Very well said magicman...I like that!

reddragon00 · September 10, 2010, 09:22:09 PM

I agree with all of you...big loss for the program on the field. Loved watching him play but heard he was tough to deal with..Not the first time rumblings have come out about being drafted from the program. Heard JB almost cost the Tone kid some bucks in dealing with the Twins in the early stages. Twins scouts thought JB was purposely making it hard to have Tone back for another year. That was just word on the street. Anyway, hope Simone finds what he is looking for but not too many 5'8 OF in the bigs!!!!!!

StarvinMarvin · September 11, 2010, 09:05:58 PM

"Big bucks" is when you're negotiating in the top three maybe four or five rounds. In the 14th round there are no "big bucks" or life-changing amounts of money involved. In that round the there's very little room for negotiation and no more than 5-10 grand in either direction is gained or lost. To suggest that the head coach intentionally attempted to hurt Tone's leverage for selfish gain is simply ridiculous. The bottom line is that young man walked away with a nice chunk of change and his schooling paid for. People mistake drawing out the negotiation process to benefit the kid for the head coach in this situation must be deliberately steering him in a selfish direction.

StarvinMarvin · September 11, 2010, 09:11:00 PM

My apologies for misquoting you Reddragon...I realize you wrote "bucks' and I wrote "big bucks" but nonetheless I believe you get my point about the round and the corresponding amount(s) of money usually negotiated.

airball55 · September 12, 2010, 03:53:43 AM

I have seen this kid play. Actually saw him a bunch this summer. The wooden bat helps him, more chances for infield hits. That is his game, he can fly and gets down the line very well. Outside of that, I don't see where the big move to D2 Mt. Olive really helps his chances. Actually, I think it hurts him where the players will be bigger and faster. He would have a better chance of standing out up here. Not that great of an outfielder neither as he played left in the NYCBL. His numbers were good, solid player at the D3 level, but, I hope he gets his degree. He was not listed in the top 15 for prospects in the NYCBL. Now if he was transferring to Florida St.... then we could all get interested. He can run, maybe someone gives him a shot in indy ball, that would still be a feather in Cortland's cap, after all, that's where he developed. I wish him luck.

scuba16 · November 17, 2010, 10:20:52 AM

Corland is still one of the best D3 Programs in the country... regardless of this particular situation.
Facts: Mt Olive has had 22-23 kids get drafted or sign in the past 15 yrs and Cortland has had like 21-22.... So you are really comparing similiar programs playing in different divisions. Maybe the kid gets seen by more scouts being in North Carolina and maybe somebody really likes him and gives him a shot.
Maybe he has a great yr and doesn't get a sniff... who knows!
Having Coached Jason and being a Cortland Baseball Alum, I can tell you that the kid did this purely for himself. Doesn't make him a bad person. He feels that he has a better chance to get drafted or signed at MT Olive... Time will tell if its a good decision!~!!!!
Cortland will goes its way, J Simone will go his and SH$$ happens! Its a big loss for Cortland but life goes on and it gives another guy(s) a shot at playing...!

BBFan62 · November 17, 2010, 07:38:40 PM

Well, excuse me for weighing in on this...but I hate this time of the year because everything is so slow.........and we have a long, cold winter ahead before we get to watch what we enjoy....watching our guys compete at the college level. My sons team was scheduled to play Cortland last March but it was 'weathered" out. hard to play in snowmobile suits!

I believe that, unless you are a flat out stud, size indeed matters. I don't think you find too many 5'8" or so guys in the majors. It's sad to say that because baseball should be the one major sport where it shouldn't matter. However, everyone is free to pursue his dream.
The best example I can give where size is the gauge concerns a transfer to Illinois Wesleyan. I'm not sure how many guys they lost from their DIII championship team but they picked up a sophomore transfer who was one of the best (class of '09) catchers in Illinois. He had the best "pop time" in the state and, his senior year, shattered the hitting record, getting 66 hits in 33 games, along with 10 home runs. He batted .546 on the year. However, when he toured some of the D1 schools he was told that, even though he was truly outstanding, they had catchers 6'+, 190 lbs+ who were close to the same skill level. This guy is about 5'9" - 5'10", about 175 lbs. His father laughs and holds his fingers a few inches apart and asks, "You know what this represents?"; the difference between AJ and $5 million bucks. In addition to catching, he will get a chance to close games, as he hit 89 on the radar gun.

DefenseWins · November 18, 2010, 01:41:38 PM

Scuba brings up point that may get overlooked. More scouts down south, better chance to be seen. Not that Cortland does not get seen, but demographically the south has always been know as the "region with better ballplayers". This being said, if he performs as good if not better down south, his chances of being seen/signed increase imo.

P.S- Winter Sucks

StarvinMarvin · November 19, 2010, 03:06:36 AM

more scouts so therefore a better chance of being drafted? That is a fallacy first and foremost...going down south where the talent pool is greater only lessens one's chances due to being a "small fish in a big pond" ideology. Some people on here and in general absolutely crack me up!! No idea WTF they're talking about...ha! You're talking about a young man who, if he had any chance, is only hurting himself and here's why. Let's say there's a scout per say, who has been following a player since high school with interest. This player is not seen as being a draft pick out of high school but this scout wants to further evaluate him in college. This same player just so happens to go to a college where the same scout can now evaluate him in college because the player is in the same scout's regional coverage. This scout doesn't deem the player a junior draft pick but wants to see him play his senior year out and possibly sign him as a senior sign for example. Uh oh, what's this. The kid has left and is now in a different scout's area of coverage. Reports can travel but the human intangible does not. Get a clue people as to how this works before some of you spew off nonsense!

StarvinMarvin · November 19, 2010, 03:18:11 AM

I also love this AJ and his father story...$5 million smackaroos if the kid was only 6 foot tall instead of 5'1". How absolutely comical!! Ever heard of Paul LoDuca? He's an absolute monster...go check out his height. How about Craig Biggio, who was a catcher when he first came up. Check his height out too. There are plenty of catchers who are under 6 feet tall that have played in the big leagues. "Pop time" schmop time...do it in a game!!! The difference between this AJ and $5 million bucks is his ability not his height. Good for him that hits a whopping 89 on the gun...throw and locate strikes and hopefully he has another pitch or two cuz 89 gets laced all day, even at the DIII level sir! I'm sure the kid is a very good player but his dad needs to get out of lala land and get over the inch of height being to blame for his son not getting a chance to be the next Jason Varitek. Oh wait a minute...Ivan Rodriguez is 5'7". Ask his dad if he's ever heard of him. CLOWNS!!

DefenseWins · December 01, 2010, 01:58:40 PM

You basically proved my point for me through all your beating around the bush non-sense. If a player moves, say down south, and is a small fish in a big pond, and he stands out amoung all the big fish, doesnt that account for raw talent. And if a scout in one region lets another scout in another region know that this kid is coming into his region, and they keep a close eye and he performs as well as he did and still stands out amoung a larger talent pool doesnt that increase his chances of a contract.

Also these boards are more for intellectual conversations and even if someone is wrong, show some professionalism and dont act like a kid. People on these boards are all smart and know the game. And to think you know more than any other person on here shows a little something about your character.

P.S.- Winter still sucks

StarvinMarvin · December 04, 2010, 04:15:22 PM

In all actuality, I blew you out of the water cuz the bottom line is you have a very limited perspective on how the draft process works as well as the intricacies of that world. You choose to focus on the regional aspect of this debate and I'm telling you that although part of it, there's a great deal more that goes into the process of evaluating professional talent. Throw numbers out the window, it's about projection, makeup, tools and things of that nature. You must remember that the draft is really geared for the top 5-10 rounds and clubs know the vast majority of their major league talent must be correctly evaluated in those rounds. Yes, there are exceptions to every rule and every year mid to late round picks as well as free agent signings "make it". Rounds 15-50 represent a lot of turn over in the minor leagues as well as bodies to get their prospects experience in the minors against. All players at that level are talented but more than 3/4 of the players selected are considered icing on the cake should they help out their parent club someday. So for me personally, a region or particular college certainly plays a role in the process but the beauty of professional baseball is there's so much opportunity and if you're a good enough player I'm willing to bet you'll be discovered regardless. Now the draft process is an inexact science but these guys are on more often than not. Of the major sports in our country, baseball is the only one whereby your professional career is not out of the question should you fail to secure a division I opportunity. I apologize for being offensive or disrespectful but I try to tell it like it is. Just tired of reading and listening to misinformed people who only fuel many of misconceptions that are so prevalent regarding professional baseball. Kids now a days think everyone owes them something and if they don't get drafted then someone must have done them wrong. Should have gone D1, should have gone down south, if I was only taller. How about 32 teams don't think you're capable of playing at that level. No one owes you anything and your numbers don't mean squat. Get over and get on with your life...it's a tough game!

StarvinMarvin · December 04, 2010, 04:28:13 PM

One more thing if I may...people on these boards are all smart and know the game? That is the most ridiculous statement I think I have ever heard. If you only knew what it truly means to "know the game" I think you may retract that but maybe not. I'll take my questionable kid-like character all day and minus karma points while you walk through life eating granola, listening to Dan Fogleberg and praying for the day they give out medals for a tenth place finish! Having some fun...lighten up and laugh a little, it's good for you!

scuba16 · December 05, 2010, 11:40:19 PM

Quote from: DefenseWins on November 18, 2010, 01:41:38 PM
This being said, if he performs as good if not better down south, his chances of being seen/signed increase imo.

MLB scouts/teams don't draft you on how good you are now, they draft on how good they think you'll be in 4-5 yrs. Scouts are trying to project how good you'll be. The bigger, faster, stronger, the better chance you'll have in the Minors to develop... so they say.
If you are that good, you'll be found no matter where you are. Fact is, 5'7-5'8 kids don't get too many shots. You have to really have a local scout like you that can convince his regional cross checker to also like you. Lemke, Eckstein, Pudge sized guys don't happen much.
The other thing is, you really have to love baseball to survive in the minors. All day practice during spring training in the Florida heat, followed by playing in podunk towns. Not too great living conditions, not good pay, long bus rides= not easy to do!

Minor league guys go into spring training weighing 220 and come out 190.... that **** can't be fun!!!!