MBB: Landmark Conference

susiddad · January 20, 2010, 11:09:37 AM

Fair enough. Watching most of the games last year, it seemed that way.

Dave 'd-mac' McHugh · January 20, 2010, 12:11:34 PM

susiddad - we are basically on the same page... it just depends on the coach. IMHO from experience playing collegiate athletics and from coaching myself and covering sports as a job and a hobby... there are three types of coaches: those who can get the most and more out of players; those who can get the most and more out of a team as a whole; and the greats who can do both.

The arguement made by some (and I do see) for Coach Marcinek is that he gets the best out of his players; your point about Juniata's coach is also correct as he gets the most out of his team. I am not disagreeing with either... they are two different coaches with two different styles and adjustments to the talent they have on their roster.

Now... someone pointed out that one team had POY, ROY, Coach/Year, etc. but weren't a great team record wise or something. That goes to show that you can have the best talent and certainly do something with it, but unless you play as a team you aren't going to go very far. I see this EVERY year especially in conference tournaments and the NCAA "Big Dance." The teams that win championships are not the ones with a stand-out player... they have several and/or work as a great team. Case in point, when CUA won their title... they had several guys along with Pat Maloney (who everyone remembers). They beat a William Patterson team that had one of the best players in Division III: Horace Jenkins. The two-time Wash U and two-time UW-Stevens Point teams were great teams which certainly had great individuals as well.

Just a thought...

susiddad · January 20, 2010, 12:26:52 PM

Absolutely. Teams with no talent can do nothing except hold the ball the whole game and hope for an off night and frustrating a team....we have one of those in this league.

As far as talent goes, the team with the most talent should win most of the time. If they don't you have to look at the coach and ask why? At SU we have won probably right around where we should have. Nothing shocking over the past for years talent representative.

I would say Juniata has overachieved and Catholic underachieved in that regard and not by anything that is absurd. There have not been too many shockers so far.

Matt Letourneau · January 20, 2010, 02:26:24 PM

Just curious why you think Catholic has underachieved--you mean this season or in the last 3? I'm not sure that I agree. Although in the past you've dismissed it, this year they've got one senior and they have freshman taking more minutes than I probably ever remember. Yes, they've got the league's best player, but there hasn't been much consistency around him.

So its hard for me to say--at this point in the season, at 12-4---that they've really underachieved. Last year, they were 18-10--which was probably on target, and the year before when they really struggled, when they were really young and Banzhof hadn't developed.

This year, based on what I've seen, SU has probably underachieved a little bit.

susiddad · January 20, 2010, 03:25:10 PM

Matt,

Better said, if I were to guess that they overachieved or underachieved, i would go with underachieved. The teams had more potential if anything. Not that they have had bad seasons or are having one now at all (actually are prob. overachieving) this season.

I would point to their depth at positions and the depth at coaching staff. Most staffs in this league are a veteran coach with some kids around him. At CUA you have so many coaches to cover all aspects of a program. Where is it translating on the court? Recruiting? Superior scouts and game planning? I'm not sure I see it anywhere.

In fairness, at 12-4 CUA is having a great season and getting better as the year goes on. They are my pick to win it all especially if they can get the home game vs. USMAA.

hoopit123 · January 20, 2010, 06:16:58 PM

Quote from: Matt Letourneau on January 20, 2010, 02:26:24 PM

This year, based on what I've seen, SU has probably underachieved a little bit.

matt---i am very curious how one could possibly take the stance that SU has underachieved. how good were they to be this year?! they graduated 5 seniors, 3 of which were key players. plus cosgrove, a starter, and kerwin, 6th man, transferring. if anything, they have OVERachieved! theyve beaten a #13 team. lost by 6 to FandM. beat a 23-win and ncaa tourney team by 20, beat CUA!!!, etc... IMHO, they have far surpassed my expectations going into the season. there was talk about them getting double figure wins. they are already there.
dont forget, they start 3 freshmen--granted, different ones--each game. theyre 5 man is currently a 6'1" forward. personally, i am VERY surprised of their success this season.

after the loss of players, what more could one REASONABLY have expected this year? i am very proud of what they have done---while inconsistent, they are far from underachieving, and down right impressive most of the time for a bunch of young kids!

NEPAFAN · January 22, 2010, 07:11:52 PM

Believe it is alumni weekend at Scranton this weekend. Wonder what the reaction of alumni is on the state of the team this year, but hey at least Goucher is scheduled for tomorrow afternoon!

saratoga · January 23, 2010, 10:15:25 AM

An absolutely huge win for the Royals last evening at the Long Center. In a game that may have sealed their fate one way or another, the Royals came out & played with more hustle & determination as they've displayed all season. Diving for loose balls, boxing out a much taller Catholic team & actually crashing the boards & getting second chance shots.
Scranton did a magnificent job of spreading the floor, taking their time on offense & driving the lanes that were there. When the lanes were sealed, the kick backs were there & the Royals outside game came through as well. Truly great to see the Royals not be so reliant on the 3 and take it right inside and get layups & or fouls.
I will certainly give credit when do & the Royals & the coaching staff deserve much credit for putting together a great game plan & playing with purpose & passion. Eli was a beast inside & played like he was 6'9". His jumping abilty was never more evident as it was last night. He always plays hard but, last night he was focused beyond anything I've seen in quite some time. Zack was able to create & drive the lanes as Scranton created great spacing & it was the defense that fueled the offense as the Royals seemed to challenge every shot for the entire 40 minutes.
The D was further evidenced by about 9 blocked shots of which Eli had about 6 himself. One great one was when 6'8" Matt Swaback ran the length of the floor & blocked a potential fast break layup against the back board which was picked up by a Royal & fed downcourt to a teammate for a layup the other way.
Last night was like watching a totally different team than has played thus far this season. Great game plan by the staff, great hustle all night by the kids & another tough night in the Chamber of Horrors for one J.B.
If Scranton can bottle this game & realize the approach they took last night can & must be applied to each & every remaining game...they will be a very formidable opponent. What they can not do is think they've now got it all figured out & take anyone for granted or the huge steps taken last night will have meant nothing.
I really can't begin to explain how great it was to see the Royals attack on offense from multiple areas on the floor & to play defense with such conviction all game long. Great job by the coaches & players...hope they've turned it around.

Matt Letourneau · January 23, 2010, 02:05:07 PM

Why does EVERYBODY seem to get it together like that to play Catholic? Already this year I think we've been the recipient of the best games of Susquehanna, Scranton and Washington and Jefferson's seasons.

NEPAFAN · January 23, 2010, 02:35:05 PM

Quote from: saratoga on January 23, 2010, 10:15:25 AM
An absolutely huge win for the Royals last evening at the Long Center. In a game that may have sealed their fate one way or another, the Royals came out & played with more hustle & determination as they've displayed all season. Diving for loose balls, boxing out a much taller Catholic team & actually crashing the boards & getting second chance shots.
Scranton did a magnificent job of spreading the floor, taking their time on offense & driving the lanes that were there. When the lanes were sealed, the kick backs were there & the Royals outside game came through as well. Truly great to see the Royals not be so reliant on the 3 and take it right inside and get layups & or fouls.
I will certainly give credit when do & the Royals & the coaching staff deserve much credit for putting together a great game plan & playing with purpose & passion. Eli was a beast inside & played like he was 6'9". His jumping abilty was never more evident as it was last night. He always plays hard but, last night he was focused beyond anything I've seen in quite some time. Zack was able to create & drive the lanes as Scranton created great spacing & it was the defense that fueled the offense as the Royals seemed to challenge every shot for the entire 40 minutes.
The D was further evidenced by about 9 blocked shots of which Eli had about 6 himself. One great one was when 6'8" Matt Swaback ran the length of the floor & blocked a potential fast break layup against the back board which was picked up by a Royal & fed downcourt to a teammate for a layup the other way.
Last night was like watching a totally different team than has played thus far this season. Great game plan by the staff, great hustle all night by the kids & another tough night in the Chamber of Horrors for one J.B.
If Scranton can bottle this game & realize the approach they took last night can & must be applied to each & every remaining game...they will be a very formidable opponent. What they can not do is think they've now got it all figured out & take anyone for granted or the huge steps taken last night will have meant nothing.
I really can't begin to explain how great it was to see the Royals attack on offense from multiple areas on the floor & to play defense with such conviction all game long. Great job by the coaches & players...hope they've turned it around.

Toga,

You sound like a new man. Good recap, but how was the officiating?

NEPAFAN · January 24, 2010, 01:53:07 PM

Scranton wins again by 12 or so over Goucher. It appears the key is to keep Londo out of foul trouble, as he had a monster weekend. Another key might be Luke Hawk who scored 14 off the bench. If they can get Hawk going I don't see any reason why the Royals can't make some noise in the conference tourny.

Any other interesting results from the weekend?

ronk · January 25, 2010, 12:05:30 AM

At the 1/2 point of the conference sched:

Standings Projected Final

MMA 6-1 MMA 11-3
C 5-2 Sus 10-4
Sus 4-3 C 9-5
Scr 4-3 Scr 9-5
J 3-4 J 6-8
G 3-4 G 5-9
D 2-5 D 3-11
M 1-6 M 3-11

I'm projecting the home team holding serve in the 2nd half except for MMA over M,J,D; C over D,G; and Sus,Scr over M.

Matt Letourneau · January 25, 2010, 11:05:37 AM

You think Scranton will lose at Catholic?

susiddad · January 25, 2010, 11:10:43 AM

In regards to playing your best vs. catholic and all the teams that do. What is the reason? Is it luck?

Perhaps they are the easiest team to prepare for? Slow down Banzhopkf, keep them from pushing you out of bounds on o-boards, and protect the paint. Watching them play 2 this year, they are not hard to figure out.

hoopit123 · January 25, 2010, 11:48:42 AM

projecting an 'underachieving' team to finish 2nd in the conference and host a playoff game against the ever-overachieving CUA??!!!

i think usmma has made their statement, finishing off SU saturday with ease. this just furthers my initial prediction that usmma will win the conference this season. SU has clearly not noticingly struggled playing on the road this year, shown by beating a good cua team on the road. so, the fact that usmma easily took care of them, i feel, really shows 'who is boss'. but who knows, the past few years i dont think SU has lost to usmma at home, so we will see.