MBB: Landmark Conference

[saratoga]

Wondering if Trevor can coach both teams?
Guess they'd need the Landshark to end this nonsensical women on the road/men at home etc. bafoonery first.
Karma to my good friend from old San Juan.
Hang in there, it's going to be a bumpy ride.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Wondering if Trevor can coach both teams?
Guess they'd need the Landshark to end this nonsensical women on the road/men at home etc. bafoonery first.
Karma to my good friend from old San Juan.
Hang in there, it's going to be a bumpy ride.

The reason for the mid-week game structure was coaches complaining about the weekend structure wasn't fair in terms of injury recovery and academics (giving the kids time to study; too tired coming back from trips to study). Personally, I think it is a narrow-minded mentality considering there are far better conferences than the Landmark who go with weekend schedules and their programs seem to do pretty well all the same. Since moving to this non-weekend schedule (in the sense of two games), the Landmark hasn't exactly improved the quality of basketball - in other words, it wasn't the schedule in the first place. Due to travel, weekend schedules make more sense. Due to structure, I don't love the non-double-headers. But it is what it is when coaches run the roost (that is a comment not directed at the Landmark or those who run things, but more at coaches around the country who have a tendency to foul things up for no good reason).

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Since MMA has now injected themselves into playoff contention with their come-from-ahead victory over Scranton last night:

My personal standings for playoff contention:

Susquehanna - +2
Scranton        - 0
Drew              - 0
Catholic         -  0
Juniata           - -1
MMA              - -1

Big games this week:

Catholic-Scr   Sat
Sus-Drew      Sat
Jun-MMA       Sat

MMA is a team that should be better than their record indicates. They finished last season winning 6 of their final 7 league games and I kinda thought they would push on from there. They're the 2nd best 3pt. shooting team in the league and they force a bunch of turnovers. If they could just cut down on how many fouls they commit and stop turning the ball over themselves, they'd consistently be a top-4 team. Every CUA game against them has been a real challenge.

You have to remember... Merchant Marine deals with off-the-court challenges that really hamper the team's ability to come together. Deployments, commitments, and the like can keep the program from having the entire team together until mid-season. It happens all of the time. They might not be available to even practice for the first half of the season or at least in a limited way. I have gotten very used to looking at an MMA squad from the year before and not seeing it get back to that speed until the final month of the season. They just deal with different challenges than other squads. It is a BIG reason they are leaving the conference for a more local group next season.

[CardsFan]

Wondering if Trevor can coach both teams?
Guess they'd need the Landshark to end this nonsensical women on the road/men at home etc. bafoonery first.
Karma to my good friend from old San Juan.
Hang in there, it's going to be a bumpy ride.

The reason for the mid-week game structure was coaches complaining about the weekend structure wasn't fair in terms of injury recovery and academics (giving the kids time to study; too tired coming back from trips to study). Personally, I think it is a narrow-minded mentality considering there are far better conferences than the Landmark who go with weekend schedules and their programs seem to do pretty well all the same. Since moving to this non-weekend schedule (in the sense of two games), the Landmark hasn't exactly improved the quality of basketball - in other words, it wasn't the schedule in the first place. Due to travel, weekend schedules make more sense. Due to structure, I don't love the non-double-headers. But it is what it is when coaches run the roost (that is a comment not directed at the Landmark or those who run things, but more at coaches around the country who have a tendency to foul things up for no good reason).

It's certainly disingenuous if the case was being made that weekend scheduling was directly hampering the quality of play.

D-mac you would know better than most since you talk to a lot of coaches, wouldn't the coaches also want more days between games to get more practice time and to gameplan for opponents?

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

Yes and no... it's Division III... many coaches understand that you play with the situation you have and in conferences like the SUNYAC, NESCAC, MIAC (though it's adjusted), NWC, UAA, and others (seriously, there are a lot of conferences)... travel demands they play on the weekends and thus you adjust accordingly. Heck, to win the NCAA championship you are going to most likely play opponents on a weekend three times.

However, most coaches in this conference have told me on air and off... if they have a top player injured in the first of two games, it is unfair they can't rest to be ready for a game three or four days later than to lose them for the next game. They also complain that their student-athletes are getting home so late and are exhausted after playing back-to-back games that they can't study and get their work done on Sundays.

I think when it comes from this conference it rings hallow. They formed to be of like-minded, seemingly high-standard institutions who have some travel challenges and decided to pair games on the weekend. Then they say it is too difficult on the student-athletes both physically and educationally - that their students can't handle it - yet, conference like the NESCAC and UAA who have far higher academic standards and demands (to be blunt) are doing it every week. They are traveling further and, yet, their student-athletes are still doing incredibly well in the classroom despite the schedule AND they are incredibly good on the court as well. They deal with injuries all of the time, but their teams still succeed.

Is it ideal? No! But to cop out of it because "it's too hard" when others prove it can be done... seems weak.

What I am saying is not new. People in the conference have read my statements here and heard me say them elsewhere. Hiding behind "my best player is injured, it's not fair" is short-sighted. Saying "they are too tired to study" means they aren't up to the standards of the school in the first place. Am I being harsh? Yes. But we now have a schedule where rivals never meet on the weekends because they are close enough that those games need to be played during the week because the long-drive games have to be played on the weekends. In other words, we will never get a final game of the season between actual rivals with the season or playoff berth/bids on the line. We also will not get rival schools playing a double-header because, again, they won't play on weekends. We will get something else because instead of thinking long term and understanding this schedule will only make you better... coaches and others thought short-sighted.

But here's the kicker that I am not sure everyone thought through, and I am quite sure someone in the conference will tell me I'm wrong... by having the men and women split during the week... schools are paying for extra trips every season via bus. Instead of Goucher taking one bus to take both men and women to a game, they pay for a bus one week for the women to go to Catholic and another bus a few weeks later to take the men's team to Catholic. Yes, some schools could argue they take two busses anyway, but they are the minority from what I see showing up to Goucher every night.

Sorry... I jumped on the soap box. Stepping off now.

[BCannon]

In my personal experience I  preferred the Wednesday/Saturday schedule vs. the Saturday/Sunday for the physical and academic reasons provided.

Economically I would imagine it is much cheaper to pay for a few extra bus trips than 20 hotel rooms 3 times a year.

[NEPAFAN]

Thanks lefty2 for that information.For someone that has been following the Royals for more then 35 years I think D3hoops is the best thing for all d3 sports it is great to put your opinion  out there.So I have just one other question since you get pluses and minus does it tell you who gives them to you or does that stay behind close doors?Just a question because I am a die hard Royals fan and I never miss a game home or away both men and women unless as you know in the Landmark when they split then I choose to either go and see the men or the women.I would love to know who gives me the karma pluses or minuses.Thanks again Nepafan you know who I am just a clue sat right in front of you at the goucher game if this is who I think it is!

Good guess work.


Can we get a win Saturday?

[Matt Letourneau]

D-Mac and I have disagreed on the schedule issue for years!  I was a big proponent since before they made the change.

Catholic-Scranton is the last game of the season for both teams.  Pretty solid match-up, yes?

What real "geographic" rivalries does this conference have? 

The fact that other conferences play all weekend games isn't an affirmative reason why it should be done.  I still think this format makes more sense from a competition standpoint.   It was very hard to gain and sustain momentum when you only play once a week.  If you're playing well, you want to get back out there and keep it going, if you're not, you don't want to have to sit around all week waiting for a chance to turn it around.

[CardsFan]

Little primer for tomorrow:

CUA record at the Long Center in Landmark play: 0-11, average margin of defeat 10.5 points per game. Yeesh. This has to be the worst record of any team in the conference at one gym.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

The fact that other conferences play all weekend games isn't an affirmative reason why it should be done.  I still think this format makes more sense from a competition standpoint.   It was very hard to gain and sustain momentum when you only play once a week.  If you're playing well, you want to get back out there and keep it going, if you're not, you don't want to have to sit around all week waiting for a chance to turn it around.

There are conferences all around the country and in the Landmark's backyard that prove that theory completely wrong. Some of the best teams in the country come out of conferences who play games on the weekends only. I am not saying it is a road to success, but it certainly isn't a momentum issue. I mean, teams in the NESCAC who have gone undefeated in their conference (and on to national championships)... you have to wonder how they could keep up that momentum under your theory, right?

Heck... coaches who argue it isn't fair that a player doesn't get time to recover from Game 1 to Game 2 from an injury doesn't consider the fact that played does get an entire week to rest before playing the next set of games. Whereas players only get two days (maybe three) to rest before having to tackle another game midweek... making their chance of a recovery actually a little less and maybe playing games less than 100% for far longer.

[San Juan]

Dave I loved the weekend schedule as a follower it stinks from a fans point to choose one over the other on the weekdays and I travel everywhere with the Royals.All I can say is you might see some changes coming!

[ronk]

 Bcannon and Matt LeTourneau are back in the Chat site; all we need now is The Grove to be at full strength.

[Reserved Seat]

The Centennial played Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday this week.  Not much time to recover.

[saratoga]

Injuries? Recovery time?
Please.
The reality of the situation is the Landmark had it right when they started & they've been screwing with success ever since.
Do the UAA & NESCAC play 2 games on the weekend?
Answer: YES.
Do both conferences have some distance to travel between Friday & Sunday?
Answer: Most definitely.
Especially the UAA whose schools are running out of the gym on Friday evening & catching flights to their next destination for Sunday's game more often than not.
But don't their players ever get hurt/tired?
Answer: Clown question bro.
Question; What about academics at these schools...are the kids getting enough time to study?
Answer: Some of the best & brightest student/athletes in the land...you tell me.
Do these conferences actually win championships?
Answer: Please look up the resume's of Wash U, Amherst, Williams & NYU.
Time for the Landmark to shelve their current setup & return to men & women playing at the same sites with Friday/Sunday games.
I also know that beyond the whining of MMA over this setup, Moravian was also a big pain constantly crying over the cost of travel etc.
You're either in or out...have your school spring for the extra travel or go back to the MAC.

[NEPAFAN]

D-Mac and I have disagreed on the schedule issue for years!  I was a big proponent since before they made the change.

Catholic-Scranton is the last game of the season for both teams.  Pretty solid match-up, yes?

What real "geographic" rivalries does this conference have? 

The fact that other conferences play all weekend games isn't an affirmative reason why it should be done.  I still think this format makes more sense from a competition standpoint.   It was very hard to gain and sustain momentum when you only play once a week.  If you're playing well, you want to get back out there and keep it going, if you're not, you don't want to have to sit around all week waiting for a chance to turn it around.

Matt I agree no real rivalries in the landmark. I beg someone to point one out other than Catholic and Scranton.