New kick off rule

[Knightstalker]

If you want more height on a kickoff, perhaps going old school might help, give the punter and square toed kickers boot and teach him how to be George Blanda.  A strong legged kicker booting it straight could probably put it pretty deep and get under it better.  In HS I used to kickoff straight on and fg and extra points were soccer style because it was much more accurate.

[janesvilleflash]

Many of the straight on kickers were linemen, because of pure leg strength.

[kickerdad]

Many of the straight on kickers were linemen, because of pure leg strength.

Amen brother. Some of these kids today look like they have toothpicks for legs.

[PA_wesleyfan]

My son may have has the biggest feet for a kicker 11 +. Most of there kids today have smaaaaaaallll feet.

[kickerdad]

My son may have has the biggest feet for a kicker 11 +. Most of there kids today have smaaaaaaallll feet.

Tell him not to feel bad, I was a kicker and I wear a size 13.

[Mr. Ypsi]

kickerdad,

Watch out - the NCAA may legislate maximum foot size like the PGA limits oversized drivers!

[K-Mack]

Kickerdad,
I have not heard anything about the NCAA bringing back the two inch tee. I have some very strong feelings about the whole situation. I do not agree with the rationale to move the tee to one inch one year and the next move the spot back to the thirty yard line. This will certainly separate those kickers who have strong legs from those who are accurate and consistant. At this level I would much rather have a kicker who can hit 90% of their FG's from 40 and in, and be able to place their K/O inside the ten yard line with good height.

Would this also increase the need to have two guys, an accurate field goal guy and a strong-legged kickoff specialist? Maybe during regular-season home games that's not an issue, but on limited travel rosters or playoff rosters, that can be a pain.

KickerDad, with regard to the 70 yards needed to reach the end zone and possible changes in kicking style necessary for some to keep their jobs ... do you think there are kickers out there who can go the full 70 if they flatten the trajectory on the kicks, but won't because those will end up being direct line drives to return men? Will the net effect be either shorter, higher kickoffs, or more directional kicks, perhaps even to up-backs, to limit field position?

While I feel your pain, personally, as a fan of the game, I like to see more kickoffs returned. While the touchback is a exhibition of one player's skill (the kicker) and an important field position strategy device, a returned kick is a much more active, exciting play to watch. I'm sure all the part-time special teamers out there will enjoy the increased activity, if the net effect is significant.

My son had a ACL

I have two! (I think)

K-Mack,

My own personal preference if I was a coach, (and to set the record straight, I AM NOT) would be to kick it with great height to somewhere between the 5 and 8 yd line, and depending on the scouting report of the return men place it between hash and sideline. Giving your coverage team opportunity to get down and under it. However this will now require a stronger leg than most kickers have now and with a short tee it means as a coach, you have to come up with the correct strategy for the team you are up against. I forsee more of the high kicks to the outside up men in hopes of them calling for the fair catch somewhere around the 25 or 30. I also see some coachs going for the squib kicks to the slower up men in hopes that they will fall on it to cover and maybe even bobble. On-side kicks will become less of a worry unless you are down and time is almost out.  Direct line drives will give the runner time to generate a full head of steam and be risky business. Coverage team won't have a chance to get down field and break down for a stop. They will be chasing him like a hound after a rabbit. You lane defense will be gone before they pass the 50 yard line. That's my 2 cents worth.

As far as ACL's I had two along with a bunch of cartilage but after 6 knee operations between both knees, I now have two fake ACL's and zero Cartilage. Just bone on bone. But god I still love this game.

I agree with you almost wholeheartedly here.

In fact, to borrow your "if I were a coach" theme, I think kickoffs are overstrategized as it is. You want the wind at your back in the 4th quarter, but even that's mostly for field goals. But other than that, I don't like the squib kicks or the line drives. I like a team whose special teams can go down and make a dern tackle.

I would always have my guy try to kick it as deep as possible and try to cover it. I'm OK with angling toward the hash if you can keep it inbounds, and I'm OK with kicking to the worse of the two return men. But I would never use the squib or a line drive unless I'm fairly certain it's going to be the last play of a half. It never seems to benefit the kicking team field-position-wise.

Now, taking the runback for TD out of the equation is certainly a valid counterargument to putting it in play. But maybe you can offset that with the possibility of fumbles or muffed kicks by kicking it to the return men. In my experience, there are very few return men to fear, and when you do, it sort of tells your team you don't think you can stop him. I'd like to have 10 nutbags going down there trying to make a play.

I have no statistical data to back this up, but it seems to me that teams who kick off and cover the kick start off with better defensive field position than those who squib.

There are many variables, of course, in addition to skill of return men, including wind and wetness and quality of kick coverage team. So maybe some coaches have their reasons when squibbing or kicking for touchback.

Anyway ... it must be the offseason

[PA_wesleyfan]

AH But if you can kick a squibb between the deep men and the up men you would reap great rewards. But you need accuracy as well..

But kicking it high and deep beats all..

[K-Mack]

AH But if you can kick a squibb between the deep men and the up men you would reap great rewards. But you need accuracy as well..

But kicking it high and deep beats all.

Do you favor a touchback to putting it in play?

I really have never given this this much thought before.

[Ralph Turner]

K-Mack, the wind in Texas in the 4th quarter can make or break a comeback.  It is not uncommon in October and November to have 20-30 MPH winds that subside as sundown approaches. 

[K-Mack]

K-Mack, the wind in Texas in the 4th quarter can make or break a comeback.  It is not uncommon in October and November to have 20-30 MPH winds that subside as sundown approaches. 

I believe you.

I remember sitting in the Belton HS pressbox and having this moment where it became perfectly clear why that's Tornado Alley. I could see for miles. I think I counted about eight town water towers on the horizon.

So yeah, I see how wind could be a problem.

Although I've been to many a mid-Atlantic game where wind has wreaked havoc. Thinking particularly of a Johns Hopkins/Carnegie Mellon game I wrote about in ATN a few years back, the Bridgewater-King's playoff game and a UVa. game where Al Groh deferred to the second half, then kicked off again just to avoid having the wind coming at them in the 4th.

[kickerdad]

Do you favor a touchback to putting it in play?

I really have never given this this much thought before

K-Mack,

I prefer putting it play unless you have a kicker that can put it out of the endzone on a regular basis. If you put it in play you be damn sure you have the best/uglyest/meanest/nasty/hell bent for leather 10 men on the team who can stay in their lanes, shed blocks and make one on one tackles. (before the runner gets to the 20 yard line.

[PA_wesleyfan]

I prefer a good high kick to the five with undersized madmen charging...And Especially Wesley's kick off team of any year!!!quote author=K-Mack link=topic=5274.msg721023#msg721023 date=1181102962]

AH But if you can kick a squibb between the deep men and the up men you would reap great rewards. But you need accuracy as well..

But kicking it high and deep beats all.

Do you favor a touchback to putting it in play?

I really have never given this this much thought before.
[/quote]

[kickstart]

Interesting discussion.  The move from the 35 to the 30 effectively adds about 15 yards to a KO.  A five deep KO this year with the coverage 5 yard back is the equivalent to a goal line kick last year.   In order to insure a touchback the kick will need to be on the endline with at least a 4.0 hangtime.  I believe that you will see a lot more run backs as a result.

It is a misnomer to believe that a low kick can be driven deeper.  Take a water hose and watch that when you raise the stream of water to 30  to 40 degrees it will get its maximum distance.  the same with a KO.  A low kick will not get the distance that a kick with good trajectory and the same force will.  A low kick 5 deep will result in a runback almost every time. 

I am suggesting a kick 3-4 yards deep with a 4.0-4.3 hangtime.  When the return guy catches it he will hesitate just a moment before he runs it out.  That  .5 second hesitation will effectively erase the  5 yard buffer and should result in stop somewhere inside the 20.  I believe that you will see alot more strategy imployed with the changes.

check out www.kickstartkicking.com to see an interesting description of how this works.

[kickerdad]

Interesting discussion.  The move from the 35 to the 30 effectively adds about 15 yards to a KO.  A five deep KO this year with the coverage 5 yard back is the equivalent to a goal line kick last year.   In order to insure a touchback the kick will need to be on the endline with at least a 4.0 hangtime.  I believe that you will see a lot more run backs as a result.

It is a misnomer to believe that a low kick can be driven deeper.  Take a water hose and watch that when you raise the stream of water to 30  to 40 degrees it will get its maximum distance.  the same with a KO.  A low kick will not get the distance that a kick with good trajectory and the same force will.  A low kick 5 deep will result in a runback almost every time. 

I am suggesting a kick 3-4 yards deep with a 4.0-4.3 hangtime.  When the return guy catches it he will hesitate just a moment before he runs it out.  That  .5 second hesitation will effectively erase the  5 yard buffer and should result in stop somewhere inside the 20.  I believe that you will see alot more strategy imployed with the changes.

check out www.kickstartkicking.com to see an interesting description of how this works.

Kickstart -

Showed this to my son and he loves it. We will be ordering one sometime this weekend. He and I have a couple of questions.

1. What weight lifting exercises do you find to be the best i.e. squats, leg lifts, leg presses?
2. Calf exercises? Other than leg lifts off a 4x4
3. Stretches for the hips. He has the tighest hips I have ever seen (hip flexors)
4. Does your instruction DVD have everything you web sit shows plus more?