East Region Fan Poll

[rams1102]

As for the rankings, we keep W/L records for a reason.  Teams don't go to the playoffs based on their yds per carry or their passing efficiency.  The bottom line is that there will be a winner and a loser.  On a given weekend in a head to head game, I score more points, I win, you lose. I am better.  The season record will reflect the "body of work".  If I lose to a lower ranked team or an unranked team, my rank should drop, regardless of injury or last second field goal. If it's early in the season I will drop further, later in the season there will be greater weight placed on the body of work.  With that being said then...I don't really understand why St. Johns is still in the top 25 with a 3-2 record.  Obviously, I don't have a clue.

Well, they lost to the #4 and #17 ranked teams by a total of four points.

To me, I try to say, ok St. John's is #23 and Cortland is #25. If those two teams played today, who would win? To me, St. John's wins that game. So I am ok with that difference. Another way I sometimes think "Would Cortland be better than 3-2 if they played St. John's schedule?" Probably. And St. John's would absolutely be 4-0 if they played Cortland's schedule.

Yes, it stands to reason with similar/identical records and a H2H win, that we could tell. But until the NCAA admits they screwed IC in 1998, I guess we have to make do with what we got

As I said on the NJAC Board, when you play better teams you get better. Can't wait till the NJAC gets to (8) teams. St. Johns plays better teams.

[clandfan]

St. Johns plays in a tougher conference;  no argument.  Your formula though is chock full of hypotheticals that we can never answer with over 200 DIII teams and however many conferences.  Heck DI BCS has tried weighting conrference strength, like opponents, like opponents opponents, ranking and we all know how everyone likes that....sometimes they get it right, more often not.  You gotta go with watchya got.  St. Johns now, by the way, is 3-3.  I don't think we can now rank them ahead of a 5-0 team that has  held their opponents to 13 straight scoreless quarters and has given up 19 points all season.

[rams1102]

St. Johns plays in a tougher conference;  no argument.  Your formula though is chock full of hypotheticals that we can never answer with over 200 DIII teams and however many conferences.  Heck DI BCS has tried weighting conrference strength, like opponents, like opponents opponents, ranking and we all know how everyone likes that....sometimes they get it right, more often not.  You gotta go with watchya got.  St. Johns now, by the way, is 3-3.  I don't think we can now rank them ahead of a 5-0 team that has  held their opponents to 13 straight scoreless quarters and has given up 19 points all season.

I can not disagree, but beat Rowan and knock of the Red Hawks and you are the man.

[clandfan]

one game at at time Rams...one game at a time. 

[lewdogg11]

Funny that no one in my top ten lost yesterday, but my 11, 12, and 13 all lost. Not much work for my poll this week.

[theoriginalupstate]

Funny that no one in my top ten lost yesterday, but my 11, 12, and 13 all lost. Not much work for my poll this week.

Lyco impressed me yesterday, they moved up a couple spots in my ballot. Other than that not a ton of movement one way or another.

[Bombers798891]

St. Johns plays in a tougher conference;  no argument.  Your formula though is chock full of hypotheticals that we can never answer with over 200 DIII teams and however many conferences.  Heck DI BCS has tried weighting conrference strength, like opponents, like opponents opponents, ranking and we all know how everyone likes that....sometimes they get it right, more often not.  You gotta go with watchya got.  St. Johns now, by the way, is 3-3.  I don't think we can now rank them ahead of a 5-0 team that has  held their opponents to 13 straight scoreless quarters and has given up 19 points all season.

Well, obviously, 3-3 is different. My argument was based on a 3-2 St. John's, not a 3-3 one.

Yes, you can't be held accountable for your conference mates, but that doesn't mean we ignore it. As I said on the E8 board, three straight shutouts are impressive regardless of opponent.

But here's the thing: Cortland hasn't just not played good teams. They've played BAD teams. 5-20 is 5-20. (Techincally, 5-15).

I've called out the Bombers a lot and here's what I can tell you: They would be 5-0 right now against that lineup. No doubt in my mind. Maybe they'd struggle with Kean a bit, but Cortland didn't exactly light them up either.

Here's the thing though: That doesn't mean Cortland's not good. In fact, they could be very good. And they'll have a chance to prove they can beat the Rowans, Montclairs and ICs of the world and move up as a result. But when your best win is a 12-point win against a team that's going to probably go 6-4 if not 5-5, I'm not exactly ready to go that far yet. 

[theoriginalupstate]

Good point Bombers...

Cortland is beating the teams they should beat, and they deserve credit for that...

They've yet to be tested so we'll see what happens when they are...

[Phil99]

Good point Bombers...

Cortland is beating the teams they should beat, and they deserve credit for that...

They've yet to be tested so we'll see what happens when they are...

Very true.  CState's only competitive opponent thus far has been Kean.  I agree they deserve credit anyway as I've seen many a team play to the level of their opponent and give the lesser team a shot if not lose outright and let's face it, three shutouts against even three sub par teams is a worthy accomplishment.  Looking forward to see how they do thru the end of their season which is clearly where they will be truly tested.

[clandfan]

All fair comments.  Rowan this week. 

It would also be fair to say that the bombers have not exactly been world beaters with wins over St. Larry, Union, Widener and Hartwick and losses to your only two real quality opponents.

Agreed....E8 is a stronger conference top to bottom but you are talking hypotheticals again.  You have shown some deficiencies in your OL and run game and I am not sure that the Keans and TCNJs of the world couldn't contain your so-called air-Zappia.  We'll never know and Cortaca will be our best judge but that will be a crapshoot as always given the nature of the beast.

[Bombers798891]

All fair comments.  Rowan this week. 

It would also be fair to say that the bombers have not exactly been world beaters with wins over St. Larry, Union, Widener and Hartwick and losses to your only two real quality opponents.

Agreed....E8 is a stronger conference top to bottom but you are talking hypotheticals again.  You have shown some deficiencies in your OL and run game and I am not sure that the Keans and TCNJs of the world couldn't contain your so-called air-Zappia.  We'll never know and Cortaca will be our best judge but that will be a crapshoot as always given the nature of the beast.

Of course the Bombers aren't world beaters. Who said they were? I do think they would be 5-0 against Cortland's schedule thus far, but that's more an indictment of the schedule than an endorsement of the Bombers. Western Connecticut, Buff State and Brockport are all terrible. As for TCNJ, I think a team averaging less than 200 yards offensively is not going to be put in my good category

So that leaves Kean. And again, they're probably going to be, at best, 6-4 and maybe 5-5. No-one's saying Cortland's not good--in fact, I believe I got flak on the E8 board for saying that Cortland would probably beat IC. Stomp Rowan and Montclair and I'll look pretty smart

Anyone can contain Zappia. He's above average, but not the kind of guy who can win  playing behind, against a good defense, when you can't run the ball. It's not so much that he's good, as much as it is he's better than the alternative (running the ball for 2 yards). He ain't Team Boltus, that's for sure. He's not even Brian Grastorf.

The whole thing with polls is hypothetical. We don't know anything about the relative strength of most of these teams. Is Cortland better than Alfred? Is Fisher better than Montclair? How good is Del Valley? It's all educated guesswork, my friend

[rams1102]

All fair comments.  Rowan this week. 

It would also be fair to say that the bombers have not exactly been world beaters with wins over St. Larry, Union, Widener and Hartwick and losses to your only two real quality opponents.

Agreed....E8 is a stronger conference top to bottom but you are talking hypotheticals again.  You have shown some deficiencies in your OL and run game and I am not sure that the Keans and TCNJs of the world couldn't contain your so-called air-Zappia.  We'll never know and Cortaca will be our best judge but that will be a crapshoot as always given the nature of the beast.

Of course the Bombers aren't world beaters. Who said they were? I do think they would be 5-0 against Cortland's schedule thus far, but that's more an indictment of the schedule than an endorsement of the Bombers. Western Connecticut, Buff State and Brockport are all terrible. As for TCNJ, I think a team averaging less than 200 yards offensively is not going to be put in my good category

So that leaves Kean. And again, they're probably going to be, at best, 6-4 and maybe 5-5. No-one's saying Cortland's not good--in fact, I believe I got flak on the E8 board for saying that Cortland would probably beat IC. Stomp Rowan and Montclair and I'll look pretty smart

Anyone can contain Zappia. He's above average, but not the kind of guy who can win  playing behind, against a good defense, when you can't run the ball. It's not so much that he's good, as much as it is he's better than the alternative (running the ball for 2 yards). He ain't Team Boltus, that's for sure. He's not even Brian Grastorf.

The whole thing with polls is hypothetical. We don't know anything about the relative strength of most of these teams. Is Cortland better than Alfred? Is Fisher better than Montclair? How good is Del Valley? It's all educated guesswork, my friend

Of course Montclair is better then Fisher. Only kidding, that's why we play the games. Polls are Polls, there is a lot of conjecture there. The key is to play a tough out of conference schedule and not a cupcake schedule. You will get better and your advancement in the polls will get better.

[clandfan]

I hear ya Bombers.

Rams...couldn't agree more.  Hoping we can get to 8 teams and improve that OOC schedule.  I think that's the only way the league will get stronger.

Of course we have Cortaca but would love to play more E8 teams OOC.  keeps us in upstate ny and strengthens our schedule.

[AUKaz00]

Week 6 Fan Poll 

Team	Record	Points	Last Rating	Next Week
1   Delaware Valley( 7 )	4-1	96	1	at Wilkes
2   St. John Fisher( 3 )	6-0	91	2	vs. Hartwick
3   Montclair State	5-0	78	3	vs. Buffalo State
4   Cortland State	5-0	70	4	at #7 Rowan
5   Alfred	5-0	64	5	at RPI
6   Springfield	4-1	42	6	vs. #9 Utica
7   Rowan	4-1	34	7	vs. #4 Cortland State
8   Lycoming	4-1	33	8	vs. Widener
9   Utica	5-1	28	10	at #6 Springfield
10  Ithaca	4-2	6	9	Open Date

Also Receiving votes:               
SUNY-Maritime 5
William Paterson 3
                     
            
Voting Distribution:            

Delaware Valley (1,1,1,3,1,2,1,1,1,2)
St. John Fisher (2,3,2,1,2,1,2,2,3,1)
Montclair State (4,2,4,2,3,4,3,5,2,3)
Cortland (3,4,3,5,4,3,5,4,5,4)
Alfred (6,5,5,4,5,5,4,3,4,5)
Springfield (7,6,6,8,6,6,7,6,10,6)
Rowan (8,8,7,6,7,10,8,7,7,8)
Lycoming (9,9,8,7,8,7,6,8,8,7)
Utica (5,7,9,10,9,8,9,10,6,9)
Ithaca (10,NR,NR,9,NR,9,10,NR,NR,NR)
SUNY-Maritime (NR,NR,10,NR,NR,NR,NR,9,9,NR)
William Paterson (NR,10,NR,NR,10,NR,NR,NR,NR,10)


Key Matchups:
#4 Cortland State at #7 Rowan
#9 Utica at #6 Springfield

[SJFF82]

just 'thinkin' out loud here...and wondering how strong this Fisher team is compared to the 2006 squad that hung within 5 pts until 4 minutes to go against MUC.

I saw several games live that year and 2 so far this year.  In my mind, this present team is at least a 7pt underdog to the 2006 team.  How that equates to the relative strength of the East this year and the rest of the country remains to be seen.

The 2 major differences are the RB and the defense as a whole.  I have seen Borum carry the ball 40 or so times this year, and I cannot recall seeing him break many tackles nor do I recall seeing him getting to the second level on too many runs.  Robinson did that on almost every carry in 2006.  I dont see Borum busting through MUC's defensive line on 4th and goal from the 1 in December like Robby did in '06.  You need that to go deep in December. 

Yes their passing game is the 'greatest show on turf' since the Rams of Warner, Faulk, et al, but passing games can become erratic, and good defenses will make you pay for being 1 dimensional.

Their current defense is a far cry from the ball-hawking defense that led them in 06.  Stepnick and Lang were animals.  This defense is very adequate, and even showed some spark against IC this week, but very adequate means you only give up 49 to MUC in December instead of 49 by half time.  And dont tell me about bend dont break defense, because the 06 defense never bent OR broke..well, except the Chris Sharpe debacle, but they were down Stepnick and others that game.

So...being the glass is laying broken on the floor instead of half-full guy that I am....I am going out on a limb and stating that should we make the NCAA's this year, anything less than a 4th quarter show-down with MUC along the way will prove the correctness of the foregoing non-sense.

I kinda see us going down in a shootout with DVC ala 2004...before MUC gets their teeth in us.