East Region Fan Poll

[pg04]

A relevant and interesting question to both Softballrz and Charles would be, where do they think Endicott should be rated in the poll (seriously, not fishing for non-genuine answers)?

[pg04]

   

Not that it matters, I will add my thoughts and poll if I were still participating:

1.  Salisbury
2.  Delaware Valley
3.  Hobart
4.  Montclair State
5.  Kean
6.  Cortland State
7.  Widener
8.  St. John Fisher
9.  Endicott
10. Lebanon Valley

Salisbury is way out in front.  I think Del Val, Hobart, and Montclair State are the second class, and to me are interchangeable (at this point!).  I have trouble moving Kean way down because they still have those big wins, and although the loss to an 0-5 team is bad, I don't think Brockport is nearly as bad as that record.  Cortland could now be put in front of Kean, but right now they are just edged out.  Widener has been good this year and I have trouble with Fisher's blowout loss.  Endicott does get in, it's hard to ignore their wins. 

[lewdogg11]

   

Not that it matters, I will add my thoughts and poll if I were still participating:

1.  Salisbury
2.  Delaware Valley
3.  Hobart
4.  Montclair State
5.  Kean
6.  Cortland State
7.  Widener
8.  St. John Fisher
9.  Endicott
10. Lebanon Valley

Salisbury is way out in front.  I think Del Val, Hobart, and Montclair State are the second class, and to me are interchangeable (at this point!).  I have trouble moving Kean way down because they still have those big wins, and although the loss to an 0-5 team is bad, I don't think Brockport is nearly as bad as that record.  Cortland could now be put in front of Kean, but right now they are just edged out.  Widener has been good this year and I have trouble with Fisher's blowout loss.  Endicott does get in, it's hard to ignore their wins.

+K  Well stated and explained.  Relatively similar thinking that I have.  I have Lyco in over Lebanon Valley because of their W's over Rowan and Albright and 3 pt loss to Widener.  Leb Valley has a 7 pt win over Albright and a blowout loss to DVC, but otherwise, their schedule doesn't excite me so far.  But they play in 2 weeks so we'll find out then.

[softballrz]

Neither Charles our I have said anything about where in the top ten Endicott should be listed.  Just to be in the top 10 discussion is a win for the program.  Also, WENC needs to be in the discussion. 

[dlippiel]

Now we are talking Honestly dlip likes this Endicott team (what he knows of it having yet to see them play). They are in the discussion for sure but to dlip, just not there yet. Their improvement and gradual growth are impressive, now they just need to defeat someone outside of the NEFC or ECFC. By the way, sorry, WNEC, with their loss to Mass Maritime, is not in the discussion yet but they are having a good season, which is great.

[pg04]

Neither Charles our I have said anything about where in the top ten Endicott should be listed.  Just to be in the top 10 discussion is a win for the program.  Also, WENC needs to be in the discussion.

I know, but I would like to know where you might think they should be in the grand scheme of things.  Having NEFC posters is a good thing in that we get views we haven't had in the past...

[pg04]

As for WNEC, they'll have trouble getting in here because they have a loss.  It's just a fact of the matter that teams with losses within the NEFC are going to have trouble getting traction here.  It could very well end up that they win the conference and get ranked here. 

Edit:  I posted this before I actually read Dlip's post, but you pretty much answered the same way...so yeah. 

[Charles]

This board      AFCA
1.  Salisbury      11   (641 votes)
2.  Delaware Valley   9   (703 votes)
3.  Hobart      NR   (16 votes)
4.  Montclair State       7   (745 votes)
5.  Kean         21   (202 votes)
6.  Cortland State      NR   (16 votes)
7.  Widener      NR   (no votes)
8.  St. John Fisher      NR   (3 votes)
9.  Endicott      NR   (35 votes)*
10. Lebanon Valley      NR   (no votes)

The AFCA Division III poll follows the same basic format as the USA Today Coaches' Poll. The 2009 Division III Board of Coaches will have 40 voters, representing all Division III conferences.

[Charles]

A relevant and interesting question to both Softballrz and Charles would be, where do they think Endicott should be rated in the poll (seriously, not fishing for non-genuine answers)?

I think in the second 5 is fair. All they can do is what they are doing, win the games on the field. If they make the NCAAs then they will have another game against a common opponent perhaps and then a more fair judgement could be made.

[SJFF82]

Neither Charles our I have said anything about where in the top ten Endicott should be listed.  Just to be in the top 10 discussion is a win for the program.  Also, WENC needs to be in the discussion.

...Uh, that's correct....that is what 'we' are looking for.  Where do you think they rank and why?

[Frank Rossi]

A relevant and interesting question to both Softballrz and Charles would be, where do they think Endicott should be rated in the poll (seriously, not fishing for non-genuine answers)?

I think in the second 5 is fair. All they can do is what they are doing, win the games on the field. If they make the NCAAs then they will have another game against a common opponent perhaps and then a more fair judgement could be made.

Well, that brings up an interesting point.  Including Salisbury in the count, I have exactly 5 East teams in my Top 25, with Hobart being the last of the 5 near the very bottom of the ballot.  If you're upset that Endicott is missing national respect here, and still admitting that the regional poll should have them as sixth or seventh, then nationally, Endicott is getting exactly the amount of respect you yourself think they should be getting. 

Nothing against the Fan Poll, but it's a group of seven individuals just stating their feelings and is cited by only one publication.  It's a fun thing -- not a national barometer.  I no longer see your complaints as valid, whether or not you stated them cogently from the start.

[Doid23]

[All they can do is what they are doing, win the games on the field. If they make the NCAAs then they will have another game against a common opponent perhaps and then a more fair judgement could be made.

Well, no, they can schedule some real out of conference opponents. I have no idea whether Endicott is good, great, or average, and they've chosen that. Good for the kids for winning all of their games (since obviously the players have no control over scheduling), but if Endicott wants some regional recognition, they have to play someone of note. As it stands now, we won't know until they play a playoff game how they stack up.

EDIT: And to be clear, I find nothing wrong with scheduling local out of conference schools, trying to win your conference, and get to the NCAA's. Just don't expect regional or national recognition either if you play in a weaker conference.

[Charles]

A relevant and interesting question to both Softballrz and Charles would be, where do they think Endicott should be rated in the poll (seriously, not fishing for non-genuine answers)?

I think in the second 5 is fair. All they can do is what they are doing, win the games on the field. If they make the NCAAs then they will have another game against a common opponent perhaps and then a more fair judgement could be made.

Well, that brings up an interesting point.  Including Salisbury in the count, I have exactly 5 East teams in my Top 25, with Hobart being the last of the 5 near the very bottom of the ballot.  If you're upset that Endicott is missing national respect here, and still admitting that the regional poll should have them as sixth or seventh, then nationally, Endicott is getting exactly the amount of respect you yourself think they should be getting. 

Nothing against the Fan Poll, but it's a group of seven individuals just stating their feelings and is cited by only one publication.  It's a fun thing -- not a national barometer.  I no longer see your complaints as valid, whether or not you stated them cogently from the start.

As I wrote, I cannot really guage Endicot from a national stand point. Other than RPI who used to beat Endicott regularly except last year where they only won 6-3. RPI was a long ride on a bus for student athletes in D3. The trip to Springfield for WNEC could be 3 hours each way. I think that the national coaches giving them more votes than Cortland, Widener and Hobart is probably a good indication from an impartial group. This board is anything but impartial, in fact probably a little bias to teams that may have had better records in years past. Endicot is a very new program. The current seniors were recruited during the 5th year of the program. So for that I must give the kids credit for the past two years of success and the building of a program. I hope they run the table, they may need to to get another bid, and play against the big boys and just see how they do.

[pg04]

The coaches may or may not be unbiased as you state.  However, coaches in the West and North could know little more or even less about the eastern teams than those posting here.  Coaches don't really spend time looking at the teams in other regions and thus that poll can really only be taken with a grain of salt.  In fact, they probably give little more than a small look at things other than record.  I wouldn't put much in the way of credibility in the AFCA poll.   

[pg04]

I guess I should be clear:  I'm not saying that the AFCA poll is unreliable or anything.  That's for others to determine.  However, it's always easiest to pick the poll that makes your team look best.