East Region Fan Poll

[Machiavelli]

Might as well throw a NESCAC team on there if we're just trying to spread the love...

[Bartman]

Having participated as a voter last year, I know how difficult it is to rank the bottom rung. I do feel it should be more of a "who can beat whom" poll, but since there is not that much OOC data, then it is an art to rank these teams. Do I think Hobart crapped its pants when it lost to Endicott...yes; do I think Union should be ranked over Hobart with a H2H loss, no(so, making the NE teams feel good is OK with me, but I really don't think they are better than Union or Hobart...although the NESCAC should get some love too).
I really only care about the top 5 teams, and one of them should be a LL team and right now it is an undefeated RPI.. It will be interesting to see how much the LL beats up on itself the next few weeks because I don't see RPI surviving without a loss to either Union or Hobart , they just don't seem to have enough offense and the defense has a huge burden to keep them in every game.
The top three teams are head and shoulders above at this point, no question, although we will see how the Saxons do this Saterday as upset is on their minds.....then with Ithaca beating Alfred things could get interesting in the top ten. GO Saxons, and mess up these rankings!

[Oline89]

These are all excellent points, but let's talk Ithaca.  They have one signature win, Alfred.  At what point does the "good loss" argument start losing its leverage?  In my opinion, good losses to Brockport and RPI have to be supported by at least 2 signature wins.  If they beat Union next week, I could see a top 10 ranking, but will they advance past Alfred (even if Alfred has a "good loss" to Brockport)? Finally, what about Cortland?  4-1, with a "good loss" to Alfred.  I guess it will take until they have a good loss to Brockport to crack the top 10, since their next 3 games are against the weakest teams in the E8.  Good discussion

[Ice Bear]

Agreed that many good are being made. Dutch Boy still feels U has to defeat a top team from an top ER conference (which has to mean Ithaca or RPI) to be taken seriously.

No ****ing NESCAC teams please until they decide to crawl out from their rock and play somebody...****ing anybody.

[Machiavelli]

Throwing the poll out completely, where does everyone think the top New England teams REALLY fall here? Let's say they all are in one HUGE conference and they all had to play each other. What would be the top 15-20 in the final standings and would a New England Team even be in the top 15-20? I'd say MAYBE one, but probably none.

Without naming names, we have 4 LL teams, 4 E8 teams, probably 6 or 7 from the MAC, and 6 from the NJAC that I would think ALL would finish ahead of every New England team. That's 20-21 right there. Maybe, just maybe there is one. It's not MIT, it's definitely not Springfield. Definitely not WesConn. MAYBE Framingham, who isn't even mentioned in the poll because of the Cortland L, but they actually have had some success in the postseason and against some competitive OOC teams. And over the course of an entire season, maybe Endicott would sneak in there(even though they lost to MIT).

I'd say over the course of a super long season, i'd put 0-1 teams in the top 20 of the East Region standings if they all played against each other. Not saying some couldn't win a game or 2 here or there, just saying they wouldn't finish top 20 in the standings.

[Machiavelli]

These are all excellent points, but let's talk Ithaca.  They have one signature win, Alfred.  At what point does the "good loss" argument start losing its leverage?  In my opinion, good losses to Brockport and RPI have to be supported by at least 2 signature wins.  If they beat Union next week, I could see a top 10 ranking, but will they advance past Alfred (even if Alfred has a "good loss" to Brockport)? Finally, what about Cortland?  4-1, with a "good loss" to Alfred.  I guess it will take until they have a good loss to Brockport to crack the top 10, since their next 3 games are against the weakest teams in the E8.  Good discussion

The 'good loss' for Ithaca vs. Brockport did nothing for RPI in the National rankings. Ithaca lost to #5 Brockport by 6 and Ithaca moved UP in the rankings, then lost by 1(was 4 seconds away from losing by 7) to 20th ranked RPI and RPI stayed still at 20. The good loss only takes you so far, but regardless, Ithaca is a top 10 team in the East right now.

[wesleydad]

Mach, I agree with you, but respectfully not you, DutchBoy. Union lost a hard fought, one point game to Hobart thus moving them down the poll. Not out IMO.  The Dutchmen have already beaten handily the two best teams from New England last season, Husson and Springfield.  They also beat W. Conn. convincingly in 2016. In my mind they are superior. I have been searching for "the best team' in New England for weeks and have been giving my #10 vote to W. Conn. MIT is my next in waiting. In this week's poll I actually wanted to vote for a three way tie at #7, Union, Ithaca & Alfred but was overruled by the poll compiler, Wesleydad. As for regional rankings keep in mind that three New England teams will get Pool A's and be regionally ranked. MIT/Springfield of the NEWMAC will have to hope for a Pool B. Right now the ERFP has 4 teams from the NJAC getting votes. Do you really think Montclair is better than Hobart, Cortland or Union? The poll is skewed because three pollsters are NJAC/MAC guys (who don't see NY and NE teams) with no one representing the E8 or most of NE.

Ufan, I think you drastically underestimate the knowledge that the other voters have of the east teams by your above statement.  I am well aware of the strength of each conference.  I hated having 4 NJAC teams in my poll, tried for weeks to not do that as I believe that no league should have more than 3, but the are undefeated, Hobart, Cortland, and Union are not.  I dont expect Montclair to stick around, but as of right now why aren't they a top 10 east team.  The MAC is not good, Del Val is the only team that you can consider.  The LL had Ithaca, 2 losses now, and Union, who was at the bottom of the list for most people, both loss this week.  Why should they stay in?  The E8 has Brockport and Alfred in, who else should be considered from the E8?  I have no issue putting MIT and W Conn in at the bottom, they are undefeated and someone mentioned a chain that makes them possibly better than Hobart.  As a follower of Wesley for many years now, I know how bad these NE teams are as Wesley has played them in the first round of the playoffs several times and crushed them.  But in recent years some of these teams have won first round games against other east teams, so to make a blanket statement that they are all bad is wrong.

[Machiavelli]

Mach, I agree with you, but respectfully not you, DutchBoy. Union lost a hard fought, one point game to Hobart thus moving them down the poll. Not out IMO.  The Dutchmen have already beaten handily the two best teams from New England last season, Husson and Springfield.  They also beat W. Conn. convincingly in 2016. In my mind they are superior. I have been searching for "the best team' in New England for weeks and have been giving my #10 vote to W. Conn. MIT is my next in waiting. In this week's poll I actually wanted to vote for a three way tie at #7, Union, Ithaca & Alfred but was overruled by the poll compiler, Wesleydad. As for regional rankings keep in mind that three New England teams will get Pool A's and be regionally ranked. MIT/Springfield of the NEWMAC will have to hope for a Pool B. Right now the ERFP has 4 teams from the NJAC getting votes. Do you really think Montclair is better than Hobart, Cortland or Union? The poll is skewed because three pollsters are NJAC/MAC guys (who don't see NY and NE teams) with no one representing the E8 or most of NE.

Ufan, I think you drastically underestimate the knowledge that the other voters have of the east teams by your above statement.  I am well aware of the strength of each conference. I hated having 4 NJAC teams in my poll, tried for weeks to not do that as I believe that no league should have more than 3, but the are undefeated, Hobart, Cortland, and Union are not.  I dont expect Montclair to stick around, but as of right now why aren't they a top 10 east team.  The MAC is not good, Del Val is the only team that you can consider.  The LL had Ithaca, 2 losses now, and Union, who was at the bottom of the list for most people, both loss this week.  Why should they stay in?  The E8 has Brockport and Alfred in, who else should be considered from the E8?  I have no issue putting MIT and W Conn in at the bottom, they are undefeated and someone mentioned a chain that makes them possibly better than Hobart.  As a follower of Wesley for many years now, I know how bad these NE teams are as Wesley has played them in the first round of the playoffs several times and crushed them.  But in recent years some of these teams have won first round games against other east teams, so to make a blanket statement that they are all bad is wrong.

But why? Are you a big believer in participation trophies?

[Machiavelli]

And again, if this were Framingham, or even Husson at this point, i'd be ok with it. But when is the last time WConn or MIT beat anyone? I know WConn beat a 3-7 Hartwick last year by 1 which is super impressive and MIT only lost to a powerhouse playoff Springfield team by 36 last year, but come on!

Back in the day, Curry eventually earned their respect. Framingham has also earned some respect. And(I guess) Husson over the past few years. I need to see some consistency out of New England teams(or BIG wins of which there are ZERO) in order to take them a little seriously and think they can crack a top 10 poll.

I'm still baffled about the '4 teams from a conference' comment. If there are 4 teams(or more) from a conference, better than top teams from other conferences, then they are BETTER! There's no over/under on the # of good teams from a particular conference.

[Ice Bear]

What is the most impressive win by a NE team this season?

Dutch Boy totally agrees that West Conn and MIT really aren't worthy at this time, even considering the Endicott chain of events. If anything the Endicott win over Hobart and then their loss to whomever the **** actually proves that Hobart win wouldn't be repeated if the teams played again. 7/8 out of 10 times Hobart wins that game. Especially after a reconfigured defense and impressive performance against a still unknown team in Union.

[Machiavelli]

What is the most impressive win by a NE team this season?

Dutch Boy totally agrees that West Conn and MIT really aren't worthy at this time, even considering the Endicott chain of events. If anything the Endicott win over Hobart and then their loss to whomever the **** actually proves that Hobart win wouldn't be repeated if the teams played again. 7/8 out of 10 times Hobart wins that game. Especially after a reconfigured defense and impressive performance against a still unknown team in Union.

Endicott over Hobart.  Hands down.

[MRMIKESMITH]

What is the most impressive win by a NE team this season?

Dutch Boy totally agrees that West Conn and MIT really aren't worthy at this time, even considering the Endicott chain of events. If anything the Endicott win over Hobart and then their loss to whomever the **** actually proves that Hobart win wouldn't be repeated if the teams played again. 7/8 out of 10 times Hobart wins that game. Especially after a reconfigured defense and impressive performance against a still unknown team in Union.

Endicott over Hobart.  Hands down.

Dutch and Mach, can you all just join the "Fan" poll?  This is all good discussions and all. The more votes the better the spread.

[Machiavelli]

What is the most impressive win by a NE team this season?

Dutch Boy totally agrees that West Conn and MIT really aren't worthy at this time, even considering the Endicott chain of events. If anything the Endicott win over Hobart and then their loss to whomever the **** actually proves that Hobart win wouldn't be repeated if the teams played again. 7/8 out of 10 times Hobart wins that game. Especially after a reconfigured defense and impressive performance against a still unknown team in Union.

Endicott over Hobart.  Hands down.

Dutch and Mach, can you all just join the "Fan" poll?  This is all good discussions and all. The more votes the better the spread.

I did it for like 10 years. I'd be happy to do it, but can't make the commitment to get the poll in every week.


Huhuhuhuhuhuh. You said 'get the poll in'. Huhuhuhuh.

[Ice Bear]

Dutch Boy is down. Did it before and he'd enjoy it.

[MRMIKESMITH]

Okay, Wesleydad, their in. I knew putting West Conn at 10 would work...